What is your deffinition of abortion?

-dustin · Feb 27, 2005

abortion...touchy subject, eh

i believe the woman should have the ability to decide for herself if she wants to keep it, but should also take the husbands thoughts into consideration. -edit- oh yeah...third trimester...that's when things get screwy. if, for some reason, the mother's health is at risk, i think it's ok. if the mother decides that she doesn't want a baby, and decides to abort within the last trimester...that's when problems arise.

the morning after pill is sort of an abortion, actually, if there was an egg fertilized.

by the way, mack, did you know genetically you're 16% more like your mom than your dad?

mattv2099 · Feb 27, 2005

mack said:
I am just wondering what you all think of abortion and we should probably have a thread about it...

I am pretty much a right winger (not so much of a Bush fan), but i dont agree with right wingers at all half of the time, this is one of them. This whole left right thing is kinda silly really...

Any way here is what i feel it should be like:

A woman should have the right to have an abortion at any time, but cannot kill the baby after it has come out of the womb... and that the husband has no say in weather the baby gets aborted or not.

I believe it is kinda silly that people draw a line in the sand by saying the you can only have an abortion have X ammount of weeks. Next thing you know theyll say that using condoms is abortion and so is the day after pill.

DAMN YOU RELIGION!!! :mumble: :mumble:

I'm from a pretty liberal area of the country and consider myself extremely liberal...

however... As far as abortion is concerned there is a time when it is OK and a time when it is not OK.

for instance. morning after pill or early abortion are OK by me.
However, an 8th month abortion is completely evil and wrong, in my opinion. If the kid could survive outside of the womb then i definately think it's murder if you abort. The problem is I am not qualified to decide when it's ok and when it's wrong. say if a woman gets kicked int he stomach in the first month and has a mis caraaige.. coolness. but if some chick is due to give birth and 1 week before the due date has an abortion. dude that's just f*cked up and wrong.

Changleen · Feb 27, 2005

Morning After Pill = Fine, should be promoted more.
Abortion should be freely and discreetly availible in the first and second trimester, and availible under medical advice in the third trimester under exceptional circumstances such as dangers to the health of the mother.
I have no 'moral' issues with the destruction of a foetus before it is demonstrably and normally 'conscious' and 'self aware'. I do not believe this occurs until after birth, but would allow for the possibilty in the later stages of pregnancy, hence my attitude toward third trimester abortion.
Until it becomes self aware then I really don't think it's fundamentally different from any other collection of living cells, such as a tomato.

dhtahoe · Feb 27, 2005

mattv2099 said:
I'm from a pretty liberal area of the country and consider myself extremely liberal...

however... As far as abortion is concerned there is a time when it is OK and a time when it is not OK.

for instance. morning after pill or early abortion are OK by me.
However, an 8th month abortion is completely evil and wrong, in my opinion. If the kid could survive outside of the womb then i definately think it's murder if you abort. The problem is I am not qualified to decide when it's ok and when it's wrong. say if a woman gets kicked int he stomach in the first month and has a mis caraaige.. coolness. but if some chick is due to give birth and 1 week before the due date has an abortion. dude that's just f*cked up and wrong.

Well said Matt. We just had a scary thing happen to us and I'm glad it's legal. Back in 2000 I had cancer so the chances of me fathering a child was slim and none. Well as it turns out slim had not left town and my girl got pregnet. At first we were sooooo excited. The bummer was that she is on Acutane the acne drug that has been in the news alot lately because it has been causing SEVERE birth defects. By law she had to terminate it. But hey now I have proven the doctors wrong... Again. Oh and to top it all off he father owns a "womans clinic" in Vagas and is the third Dr. on the pro-life hit list. So I am for it all the way.

$tinkle · Feb 27, 2005

i think changleen should be re-defined as a foetus in his/her 25th+ trimester & let us exercise our right to choose.

maybe then he'd appreciate my pro-life stance just a little more

-dustin · Feb 27, 2005

off-subject-

that Acutane...man, i was gonna get on that, but i've heard some bad news regarding it. seems like it works wonders, but can have some intense side effects.

-back to subject.

Silver · Feb 27, 2005

Since I don't feel like typing, this is pretty much my view:

http://www.2think.org/abortion.shtml

I also refuse to take the pro-life side of the debate even somewhat seriously as long as they are the same group of people (with a very large overlap, not perfect, but close) that want to keep birth control and sex education out of the hands of teenagers.

Changleen · Feb 27, 2005

$tinkle said:
i think changleen should be re-defined as a foetus in his/her 25th+ trimester & let us exercise our right to choose.

maybe then he'd appreciate my pro-life stance just a little more

Are you pro-life because killing children is absolutely evil no matter what?

binary visions · Feb 27, 2005

the Inbred said:
off-subject-

that Acutane...man, i was gonna get on that, but i've heard some bad news regarding it. seems like it works wonders, but can have some intense side effects.

-back to subject.

--continuing off subject--
This will make you never want to use Accutane:
http://www.rocheusa.com/products/accutane/pi.pdf

I just read the first 15 pages and ... :eek:

!!

dhtahoe · Feb 27, 2005

the Inbred said:
off-subject-

that Acutane...man, i was gonna get on that, but i've heard some bad news regarding it. seems like it works wonders, but can have some intense side effects.

-back to subject.

Oh man stay away. It causes extreme mood swings, depression, birth defects. She switched to pro-active and it's better I think. Not to mention that it has little or in her case no side effects. Try that.

Game on.

-dustin · Feb 27, 2005

i used that a while ago. wasn't too impressed. i've tried 3 or 4 different treatments...Proactive, some rx stuff, some rx cream, and Neutrogena. none really impressed me too much. but i'm also not one of the severe cases, either. the rx stuff made my skin waaay sensitive. i'd get done riding and it would feel like my face was on fire. i'm liking Neutrogena. store generally has it on sale, and it's pretty mild.

Changleen · Feb 27, 2005

the Inbred said:
i used that a while ago. wasn't too impressed. i've tried 3 or 4 different treatments...Proactive, some rx stuff, some rx cream, and Neutrogena. none really impressed me too much. but i'm also not one of the severe cases, either. the rx stuff made my skin waaay sensitive. i'd get done riding and it would feel like my face was on fire. i'm liking Neutrogena. store generally has it on sale, and it's pretty mild.

Doc once told me moderate UV exposure was one of the best treatments for such things. A healthy tan is very beneficial. Just don't go melanoma wild.

The Kadvang · Feb 27, 2005

Changleen said:
Doc once told me moderate UV exposure was one of the best treatments for such things. A healthy tan is very beneficial. Just don't go melanoma wild.

Very true... I swim every day and so have a deep tan + the drying of the chlorine helps alot... I have almost no acne at all.

-dustin · Feb 27, 2005

doesn't a deep tan helping go against a lot of what dermatologists say?

-dustin · Feb 27, 2005

pretend i'm loco -

you mean "a lot", don't you?

is there a law regarding age limit for purchasing condoms? i'd assume no, but i've never actually asked anyone.

-dustin · Feb 27, 2005

just 'cause you don't need one doesn't mean you can't buy them. we used to buy them and tape them to exhaust pipes. or pee in them and throw them at a certain someone.

The Kadvang · Feb 27, 2005

the Inbred said:
is there a law regarding age limit for purchasing condoms? i'd assume no, but i've never actually asked anyone.

I don't believe so... hell I'm 16 and I've never had any trouble

neaky:

-dustin · Feb 27, 2005

the flavored/glow in the dark/scented one in the bathroom don't count.

The Kadvang · Feb 27, 2005

the Inbred said:
the flavored/glow in the dark/scented one in the bathroom don't count.

Hahahaha

-dustin · Feb 27, 2005

mack, chicks will dig innocence in college. at least, quality chicks will.

The Kadvang · Feb 27, 2005

the Inbred said:
mack, chicks will dig innocence in college. at least, quality chicks will.

shuttup

ALEXIS_DH · Feb 27, 2005

am quite liberal but i believe abortion is any interruption of the embryo any time AFTER the embryo has implanted itself on the walls of the uterus.

once the embryo has implanted, BANG!, you got a kid in progress. and touching it, is killing a whole new life (as evidenced by the new dna), doesnt matter if its unconscious or not. that is BS makeup to cover what really has a name.

morning after pills are OK with me, since they work by not allowing the embryo to stick to the uterus walls.

ALEXIS_DH · Feb 27, 2005

the Inbred said:
mack, chicks will dig innocence in college. at least, quality chicks will.

bwhahahahahahaha. one thing is voluntary innocence, and another is not getting laid even trying.
girls can smell the difference...

Silver · Feb 27, 2005

ALEXIS_DH said:
am quite liberal but i believe abortion is any interruption of the embryo any time AFTER the embryo has implanted itself on the walls of the uterus.

once the embryo has implanted, BANG!, you got a kid in progress. and touching it, is killing a whole new life (as evidenced by the new dna), doesnt matter if its unconscious or not. that is BS makeup to cover what really has a name.

morning after pills are OK with me, since they work by not allowing the embryo to stick to the uterus walls.

That doesn't make sense. You have new DNA before the embryo implants in the uterus.

I just thought of something else too...what do pro-lifers think about ectopic pregnancies?

TheInedibleHulk · Feb 27, 2005

mack said:
Uh, hem... <back on subject>

I think that once the old people die and the 30 year olds get to be 50 there will be allot more abortions and less people running around saying that young kids cannot buy condoms.

Shouldn't more condoms equal less unwanted pregnancies and therefore less abortions? I think abortion is an ugly thing and I sincerely hope that one day it becomes obsolete. My personal values and convictions tell me that abortion is wrong, but I can admit that it is a grey issue and my beliefs are influenced by morays that come from a religious tradition. Because of this fact, I do not think the government should outlaw abortion entirely since it is not the place of the government to tell people what they should believe. That said, partial birth and 3rd trimester abortions are murder. If the fetus can survive on its own than how can you even deny that it is not a seperate human being from the mother? If I had my way any mother that has ever had, or any doctor that ever performed a partial birth abortion would be considered culpabale for first degree murder. Scum of the earth.

It is highly unfortunate and illogical that often the same people who are against abortion are also against sexual education and safe sex. I doesnt make a damn bit of sense and I can provide no explanation for it other than that those people are stupid jackasses.

ALEXIS_DH · Feb 27, 2005

Silver said:
That doesn't make sense. You have new DNA before the embryo implants in the uterus.

I just thought of something else too...what do pro-lifers think about ectopic pregnancies?

yup, but until it doesnt reach the uterus walls is just polen in the wind... like with embryos in labs and stuff.

i dont say that it shouldnt be touched ONLY because is new DNA. i say once it has IMPLANTED into the moms, is alive and able to continue its growth but at the same time, a different entity from the mother.

while it hasnt attached to the uterus, is new dna with no chances of development, like any little piece of tissue.

-dustin · Feb 27, 2005

ALEXIS_DH said:
bwhahahahahahaha. one thing is voluntary innocence, and another is not getting laid even trying.
girls can smell the difference...

true.

Silver · Feb 28, 2005

ALEXIS_DH said:
yup, but until it doesnt reach the uterus walls is just polen in the wind... like with embryos in labs and stuff.

i dont say that it shouldnt be touched ONLY because is new DNA. i say once it has IMPLANTED into the moms, is alive and able to continue its growth but at the same time, a different entity from the mother.

while it hasnt attached to the uterus, is new dna with no chances of development, like any little piece of tissue.

Well, it's only going one way. If you assume that a full human life is at stake right after implantation, then surely taking away the ability to implant by artificial means isn't right.

ALEXIS_DH · Feb 28, 2005

Silver said:
then surely taking away the ability to implant by artificial means isn't right.

i dont understand that. care to elaborate??

Silver · Feb 28, 2005

ALEXIS_DH said:
i dont understand that. care to elaborate??

Like birth, there is nothing magical about the moment of implantation. If the fetus is human (and by human I don't mean simply genetically) after implantation, it's human before implantation.

caputo1989 · Feb 28, 2005

I am a facist. LOL

J/K I am conservitive though i dont care if a woman wants to have an abortion.
But i think the woman should only be in a early stage of pregnancy to have one.

ALEXIS_DH · Feb 28, 2005

Silver said:
Like birth, there is nothing magical about the moment of implantation. If the fetus is human (and by human I don't mean simply genetically) after implantation, it's human before implantation.

but a embryo floating around doesnt stand any chance at all of development, so its already a truncated life. it is not a kid in progress and wont be, UNLESS an external force act upon it.

on the other hand an embryo sticked to the walls of the uterus will develop into a kid unless external forces act upon it.

one will never be unless you help, and the other will be unless you interrupt.

fluff · Feb 28, 2005

ALEXIS_DH said:
but a embryo floating around doesnt stand any chance at all of development, so its already a truncated life. it is not a kid in progress and wont be, UNLESS an external force act upon it.

on the other hand an embryo sticked to the walls of the uterus will develop into a kid unless external forces act upon it.

one will never be unless you help, and the other will be unless you interrupt.

A baby after birth has no chance of development without an external force acting on it. Try telling me that ain't human..

$tinkle · Feb 28, 2005

Silver said:
I just thought of something else too...what do pro-lifers think about ectopic pregnancies?

that & other complications which are inviable & a threat to the life of the would-be mother should be terminated.

my vows are first & foremost to my wife/marriage; hence my creed: "let all that may become, be"

one thing i have not considered, but would also like fellow pro-lifers to chime in on is what they consider to be the boundary for a "life". examples:
- severly disabled (cannot chew, swallow, ambulate)
- life expetancy of < 1 yr
- severly deformed

now THAT should bring some healthy debate/in-fighting.

$tinkle · Feb 28, 2005

TheInedibleHulk said:
Shouldn't more condoms equal less unwanted pregnancies and therefore less abortions? I think abortion is an ugly thing and I sincerely hope that one day it becomes obsolete.
<snip>

this is going to hurt you more than it hurts me...

i agree with your post

What is your deffinition of abortion?

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