[rockwool]

In absence of mountains and bigger hills where i live I run a 4x as do-it-all 'micro-dh' bike, so there's a lot of sprinty pedaling and tyre and rim weight is therefore extra crucial (I use Mavic 719's).

I just got a set of single ply 2.35" Swampthings in ST because my buddy swears by their lovely controlled skids, but they puncture too easy; ~850gr is too little and ~1160gr (2.35 HR in ST) is too much.

So maybe 2.1" dual ply (with XC tubes) is my answer, at least for the rear? I wanna recollect seeing DH tyres in 2.1" but Maxxis don't seem to have them any more..

Any suggestions and wisdom is welcome.

 

[Gary]

I just got a set of single ply 2.35" Swampthings in ST because my buddy swears by their lovely controlled skids, but they puncture too easy; ~850gr is too little and ~1160gr (2.35 HR in ST) is too much.

wouldn't have though you'd find a dual ply lighter than 1100g

I'm running a michy 2.1 Comp 24 on the rear of my mini DH bike and they are more than what you quote for the HR

 

[rockwool]

wouldn't have though you'd find a dual ply lighter than 1100g

I'm running a michy 2.1 Comp 24 on the rear of my mini DH bike and they are more than what you quote for the HR

Alright, I'm off to my happy place then...

 

[Bikael Molton]

where can you get Miche Comp24 2.1s?

 

[Kntr]

You can get the Minion or Highroller 2.35 in 2 ply. I like my Minion 2.5 single plys for XC/AM riding.

 

[rockwool]

You can get the Minion or Highroller 2.35 in 2 ply. I like my Minion 2.5 single plys for XC/AM riding.

You missed my parenthesis in the first post, the 2.35" Highroller is 1160gr (and the DHF is ~40gr heavier I guess) and it's a bit too much. I was thinking about something around 1000gr.




How much can be shaved of by going 2.35" tubeless setup on tubeless rims (like the 819)?

 

[Bikael Molton]

Are those UK only (Chainreaction)??

You can get the Minion or Highroller 2.35 in 2 ply. I like my Minion 2.5 single plys for XC/AM riding.

 

[Kntr]

Are those UK only (Chainreaction)??

Yep.
I like the Minion 2.5 single ply better. Its about 900g. Ive run them in the 25-30psi range with Maxxis light tubes with no problems.

 

[rockwool]

Are those UK only (Chainreaction)??

Dunno, but CRC definitely has got all the above mentioned.

 

[scrublover]

You missed my parenthesis in the first post, the 2.35" Highroller is 1160gr (and the DHF is ~40gr heavier I guess) and it's a bit too much. I was thinking about something around 1000gr.




How much can be shaved of by going 2.35" tubeless setup on tubeless rims (like the 819)?

Not entirely sure on that tire/rim combo, but seems you'd save at least a half pound per wheel, if not more. Depending on what tires you ended up going with. The tires I'm running are ~700gms. each.

I'm running a 2.35 Minion DHF single ply set up Gorilla Tape tubeless on some 717 rims - easy to set up, way lighter than the DH version of the tire, and in several months on chunky, rocky terrain with lots of pointy bits have not had a single flat.

Similar setup with an Intense System-4 XC 2.25" tire on the back of my hardtail has been problem free. Both running ~ 30psi.

Not what I'd take to the lifts or big shuttle rides, but they have been working great on trails, and the weight savings over a DH tire is nice on the pedaly stuff.

 

[FlipFantasia]

micheline comp24's in a 2.2 have been extremely durable for me. I've ran a set a year for the past two seasons on my pedally AM bike, UST tubeless on a set of crossmax sx's. Seriously, not one issue with them, ever. Not one flat, not one slashed sidewall. that includes a fair amount of bike park and shuttling and lots of riding sharp rocks in pemberton. their round profile makes them a bit interesting on wet roots, but it isn't horrible with a bit of attention. when it's dry these things absolutely slay all comers in my opinion, climbing they find traction where there really should be any, and I've been able to crawl my way up things I wouldn't think I could. anyway, if you can find them, they're awesome.

 

[rockofullr]

Too bad comp 24s are impossible to come by these days unless you know someone who has a stockpile.

 

[Gary]

where can you get Miche Comp24 2.1s?

You can't. I believe Michelin only made them for Trade teams, they're actually slightly different to a standard comp24 as they have the knobs everyone used to trim/cut already lowered. awesome rear tyre for the type of riding the OP is doing. I bought a bunch off Global Racing about 10years ago, down to my last 2 now.

 

[Jeremy R]

You can't. I believe Michelin only made them for Trade teams, they're actually slightly different to a standard comp24 as they have the knobs everyone used to trim/cut already lowered. awesome rear tyre for the type of riding the OP is doing. I bought a bunch off Global Racing about 10years ago, down to my last 2 now.

Yep, I only had one set of those. They were the same tread pattern and size of the old Hot S tires, but with the DH compound and wire bead.
Good tires.

To the OP, you may want to consider Specialized's line of SX tires. They are inbetween a 1 and 2 ply and weigh in at 950 for a 2.3 tire.

 

[rockwool]

Not entirely sure on that tire/rim combo, but seems you'd save at least a half pound per wheel, if not more. Depending on what tires you ended up going with. The tires I'm running are ~700gms. each.

I'm running a 2.35 Minion DHF single ply set up Gorilla Tape tubeless on some 717 rims - easy to set up, way lighter than the DH version of the tire, and in several months on chunky, rocky terrain with lots of pointy bits have not had a single flat.

Similar setup with an Intense System-4 XC 2.25" tire on the back of my hardtail has been problem free. Both running ~ 30psi.

Not what I'd take to the lifts or big shuttle rides, but they have been working great on trails, and the weight savings over a DH tire is nice on the pedaly stuff.

The 2.35 single ply DHF is ~870gr if I remember correctly, but non the less I'm very impressed with your lack of punctures and that your 717 rims hold up!

I'm gonna look Gorilla Tape up for sure. Do you run (Stan's) muck with that?

micheline comp24's in a 2.2 have been extremely durable for me. I've ran a set a year for the past two seasons on my pedally AM bike, UST tubeless on a set of crossmax sx's. Seriously, not one issue with them, ever. Not one flat, not one slashed sidewall. that includes a fair amount of bike park and shuttling and lots of riding sharp rocks in pemberton. their round profile makes them a bit interesting on wet roots, but it isn't horrible with a bit of attention. when it's dry these things absolutely slay all comers in my opinion, climbing they find traction where there really should be any, and I've been able to crawl my way up things I wouldn't think I could. anyway, if you can find them, they're awesome.

Yeah, I ran a 2.2 as a rear for DH on my HT back in 2003 and i loved it as long as it was dry (however I did not like the 2.5" c16 I had up front). Those middle knobs could do with some cutting.

I checked Michy site up yesterday and most of their tyres have a similar pattern to the c24, but I don't know how good their rubber is in comparison to SuperTacky. They had some single ply dual compound FR tyres with 127TPI but I don't know what that translates to in duro's.

Yep, I only had one set of those. They were the same tread pattern and size of the old Hot S tires, but with the DH compound and wire bead.
Good tires.

To the OP, you may want to consider Specialized's line of SX tires. They are inbetween a 1 and 2 ply and weigh in at 950 for a 2.3 tire.

Right, good tip!!




Cheers to everybody for your input!

 

[Lelandjt]

You're concerned with weight and pinch flat resistance but you're running tubes. Why?

 

[Gary]

Have you tried simply running higher tyre pressure?

 

[scrublover]

The 2.35 single ply DHF is ~870gr if I remember correctly, but non the less I'm very impressed with your lack of punctures and that your 717 rims hold up!

I'm gonna look Gorilla Tape up for sure. Do you run (Stan's) muck with that?

Cheers to everybody for your input!

Depends on the model - I'm on the 60d 2.35 version, and it's right ~700gms.
With those on the Mavic x17 series rims, it's great for me - I'm riding chunky, rooty, rocky stuff but am not a big hucker type, and tend to ride fairly smooth. Plus weigh about 150 soaking wet - can get away with lighter stuff. I also live in a non-pointy plant area - no cactus or goathead thorn stuff to puncture with, if that matters.

http://www.maxxistires.com/Bicycle/Mountain/Minion-DHF.aspx

Yes on the Stan's goop, though I made my own version with Mold Builder liquid latex stuff. The whole thing with Gorilla Tape, Mold Builder, and buying some tubes with removable valve stems ran about half the price of Stan's or other kits. Got the rear of three bikes with it now, and have been problem free.

The back of the DH bike has a Mavic 321 rim/Minion 2.5 DHF 2ply and it's been running great so far, though hasn't had much time on that setup.

 

[FlipFantasia]

I checked Michy site up yesterday and most of their tyres have a similar pattern to the c24, but I don't know how good their rubber is in comparison to SuperTacky. They had some single ply dual compound FR tyres with 127TPI but I don't know what that translates to in duro's.

I found the dual compound rubber to last significantly longer than the SuperTacky Maxxis compound. I know it's all very subjective, but one set of c24's has lasted me a whole season here in whistler, each of the past two seasons, and I ride that bike at least 3 days a week, and ride it hard too, both xc and a bit of park to keep things interesting, very impressive all around tire.

 

[rockwool]

You're concerned with weight and pinch flat resistance but you're running tubes. Why?

I've been on dual ply's up untill now and wanted to try something lighter, and hardly anybody rides tubeless or ghetto tubeless over here y'know..






Yes Gary, 3 kees (Bolivian flake ).

Depends on the model - I'm on the 60d 2.35 version, and it's right ~700gms.
With those on the Mavic x17 series rims, it's great for me - I'm riding chunky, rooty, rocky stuff but am not a big hucker type, and tend to ride fairly smooth. Plus weigh about 150 soaking wet - can get away with lighter stuff. I also live in a non-pointy plant area - no cactus or goathead thorn stuff to puncture with, if that matters.

http://www.maxxistires.com/Bicycle/Mountain/Minion-DHF.aspx

Yes on the Stan's goop, though I made my own version with Mold Builder liquid latex stuff. The whole thing with Gorilla Tape, Mold Builder, and buying some tubes with removable valve stems ran about half the price of Stan's or other kits. Got the rear of three bikes with it now, and have been problem free.

The back of the DH bike has a Mavic 321 rim/Minion 2.5 DHF 2ply and it's been running great so far, though hasn't had much time on that setup.

Wow, so foldable works fine (870gr must have been wired 2.5" 42's)? Do you ever find the 60 to be too slippery in the rear?

I found the dual compound rubber to last significantly longer than the SuperTacky Maxxis compound. I know it's all very subjective, but one set of c24's has lasted me a whole season here in whistler, each of the past two seasons, and I ride that bike at least 3 days a week, and ride it hard too, both xc and a bit of park to keep things interesting, very impressive all around tire.

Nice to know, but I checked the prices and they're from +50% more expensive than Maxxis LUST tyres..

 

[dsb18292]

I dunno, looks like DH has moved on from the smaller dual ply tires. Honestly the HR 2.35 is closer to 2.2 in all actuality. I have really been a fan of the tire in that size since moving to a rocky SE city.

over the last year I have tested out:
HR 2-ply 42a (1110g, I have 2 at this weight)
HR UST 42a (920-950g, no longer in production)
HR LUST 60a (870-900g)

I have run the single ply wire bead in the past in 60a.

Honestly there is no comparison, the dual ply is way more durable and stable. It is worth the extra couple hundred grams in the rough stuff. The ust models are somewhere in the middle and decent, but they do roll a bit more when pushed hard. They are also easier to puncture on sharp rocks.

 

[karpi]

sorry, I havent read through any of the other posts, but a couple of options pop up in my mind when talking about running single ply tires. If weight plus durability are a concern (and they seem to be), what I would simply do is run the singly ply tire with xc tubes well inflated for maximum roll and speed, plus I would put a bit of tubeless juice in the the tubes for those punctures that your talking about. If your not going through tires to much, or simply dont change them around so much, by a double ply and use make yourself a home made tubeless set. Both of these always work for me, and I can totally forget about punctures.

 

[rockwool]

I dunno, looks like DH has moved on from the smaller dual ply tires. Honestly the HR 2.35 is closer to 2.2 in all actuality. I have really been a fan of the tire in that size since moving to a rocky SE city.

over the last year I have tested out:
HR 2-ply 42a (1110g, I have 2 at this weight)
HR UST 42a (920-950g, no longer in production)
HR LUST 60a (870-900g)

I have run the single ply wire bead in the past in 60a.

Honestly there is no comparison, the dual ply is way more durable and stable. It is worth the extra couple hundred grams in the rough stuff. The ust models are somewhere in the middle and decent, but they do roll a bit more when pushed hard. They are also easier to puncture on sharp rocks.

I have another wheelset for DH with 2.5 2ply's and I'm not going 1110gr for FR. Sprint sprint sprint..

sorry, I havent read through any of the other posts, but a couple of options pop up in my mind when talking about running single ply tires. If weight plus durability are a concern (and they seem to be), what I would simply do is run the singly ply tire with xc tubes well inflated for maximum roll and speed, plus I would put a bit of tubeless juice in the the tubes for those punctures that your talking about. If your not going through tires to much, or simply dont change them around so much, by a double ply and use make yourself a home made tubeless set. Both of these always work for me, and I can totally forget about punctures.

Yeah, juice could be it.

 

[dsb18292]

I have another wheelset for DH with 2.5 2ply's and I'm not going 1110gr for FR. Sprint sprint sprint..

So dual ply is too heavy and single ply is too many pinch flats...

...then UST is about your only option for the middle ground
Many options in the 800-1000g range. Biggest issue you are going to run into with tubeless is the lack of soft compounds. Most, if not all, current UST are in the 60-70a range.

There are an increasing number of offerings in tubed tires with beefed up sidewalls. Continental has "protection", Scwalbe has "snake skin", Maxxis is starting to roll out "EXO-Protection". I have tried out a schwalbe and it is fairly tough without a major weight penalty. Not sure I would trust it if I were doing any gaps/jumps on a converted tubeless wheelset though

 

[rockwool]

So dual ply is too heavy and single ply is too many pinch flats...

...then UST is about your only option for the middle ground
Many options in the 800-1000g range. Biggest issue you are going to run into with tubeless is the lack of soft compounds. Most, if not all, current UST are in the 60-70a range.

There are an increasing number of offerings in tubed tires with beefed up sidewalls. Continental has "protection", Scwalbe has "snake skin", Maxxis is starting to roll out "EXO-Protection". I have tried out a schwalbe and it is fairly tough without a major weight penalty. Not sure I would trust it if I were doing any gaps/jumps on a converted tubeless wheelset though

I hear ya, but instead of buying even more tyres I'm going a cheaper route. I ordered some Joe's No-flats from CRC (it was about $15 cheaper than Stan's), as I'm really curious about trying tubeless. I'll stay away from the gaps.

Cheers