[freshwire]

I'm trying to convert from SRAM, back to SHIMANO...I just can't get used to "thumb, thumb" BUT, what do I buy? I've been told XT is ok and that I should get "high norml" (I love the name!) is that correct? with 1 36t ring on the front, do I want med or short cage?

Apparently, shimano only sells pairs of rapid fire shifters so I have to buy 2 and ebay the left one!?!?!?!?

Any recommendations?

Thanks in advance for any info.

 

[DirtyMike]

If your looking at going back to Sh!tmano, then go saint for DH.


But if you want something that works great, buy SRAM

 

[ianjenn]

I'm trying to convert from SRAM, back to SHIMANO...I just can't get used to "thumb, thumb" BUT, what do I buy? I've been told XT is ok and that I should get "high norml" (I love the name!) is that correct? with 1 36t ring on the front, do I want med or short cage?

Apparently, shimano only sells pairs of rapid fire shifters so I have to buy 2 and ebay the left one!?!?!?!?

Any recommendations?

Thanks in advance for any info.

Get a 105 roadie and call it good. Very short, light and super stiff! I would not run a MTB rear unless it was given to me.

 

[mattmatt86]

I'm going to agree with both of those posts.

If you want the best possible rear dérailleur stay with Sram.

But if you're hell bent on Shimano, a 105 would do the trick, as long as your running a road cassette.

 

[Curious_George]

Honnestly even a tiagra would do fine

 

[SpastikSlingkee]

the new shadow Saint der is coming out this summer, looks pretty good, its what im getting

 

[DirtyMike]

the new shadow Saint der is coming out this summer, looks pretty good, its what im getting

As much of a fan of Sram I am, I am actually pretty impressed with the new saint.

 

[pelo]

You guys really think 105 works? I´ve had nothing but bad luck with those. They snap by vibrations.
Springs are very flabby too.

 

[zspecial]

You guys really think 105 works? I´ve had nothing but bad luck with those. They snap by vibrations.
Springs are very flabby too.

I've been running the same 105 for 4 or 5 years now with a 12-28 cassette. My only problem is the angle the cable and outer need to enter the adjuster, I had to add a rollamagic (or whatever they are called) to stop splitting cable outers.

 

[kuksul08]

I've been using XT for a while. They are pretty cheap and it has been smashed on several rocks, bending my dérailleur hangar twice but the dérailleur is still fine.

With a single front ring you can use short cage

 

[SpastikSlingkee]

As much of a fan of Sram I am, I am actually pretty impressed with the new saint.

yea i know, the shadow stuff and other renovations make it alot more apealling, ive already reserved mine at my LBS

OH, yea definetly get the short cage

 

[Udi]

I'm running the Dura-Ace 7800SS (shortcage), combined with an avid rollamajig. Brilliant combo, *just* lighter than X0 and far far stronger. Have been running the DA mech for over two years now, and so far no bends, no breaks, no issues. Shifting is as fast and smooth as I've ever felt when combined with the new XTR M970 shifter (another brilliant piece of gear).

 

[toodles]

I'm running the Dura-Ace 7800SS (shortcage), combined with an avid rollamajig. Brilliant combo, *just* lighter than X0 and far far stronger

Why are they stronger? After the first year SRAM mechs stopped ****ting themselves so easily and I really haven't seen anything to convince me they're any weaker. I reckon there's no difference in strength between the two brands, just a bunch of second hand info getting regurgitated about them.

IMO, the shimano stuff has smoother, lighter shifts than the SRAM gear, but the SRAM gear is far easier to tune and keep in tune.

My fav rear mech is the X.9 super short cage. I don't think the X.0 is worth the money at all.

 

[Udi]

Why are they stronger? After the first year SRAM mechs stopped ****ting themselves so easily and I really haven't seen anything to convince me they're any weaker. I reckon there's no difference in strength between the two brands, just a bunch of second hand info getting regurgitated about them.

Au contraire.
SRAM like to make their main pivot hardware out of aluminium, which is a pretty inappropriate material choice for a fairly high stress area (under impacts anyway). I've seen at least three broken, and often just while riding (probably a result of fatigue). Seen a couple of carbon cages snapped too, the new version might be better in half carbon / half aluminium.

Shimano on the other hand - weight savings where it is legitimate, and none where it isn't. Pivot hardware is heavily machined, but steel. You'll never see it break. Cages are about the same story unless you land on one at the skatepark.

Up until recently I always thought SRAM shifted cleaner, but with the DA/rollamajig combo I reckon it's finally a match - and the XTR shifter has a lighter action, thanks to longer paddles (and perhaps something more).

 

[toodles]

Fair call I guess. I'm just not convinced SRAM mechs are as flimsy as people think. I've run them on both my DH and street bike for the past 4 years and I've broken one. On my street/play bike I've fallen off ledges and landed on the mech several times and the unit still shifts perfectly without even an adjustment.

From my experience Shimanos offerings they seem to require fine tuning more often, have crappy cable routing and crap jockey wheels. However, I haven't owned their stuff for awhile now so maybe the new stuff is better.

 

[Udi]

Let's be fair though - you don't break anything. Q's got a lineup of busted X9 mechs and shifters (including one current shortcage, which just twisted out of shape), and I watched Kram's 06 X0 mech go pop at the pivot as I was riding behind him. It didn't even touch anything. I ride as rough as those guys, and my discard "lineup" consists of one XTR mech that after 4 years just looked too scrappy to leave on my bike.

The crappy cable routing comment is also pretty much null and void now, it's either a $10 solution or go shadow!

A couple of other points - while you might prefer X9, there's a 30-40g weight increase on X0. Shimano manages to create an X0 weight component that's likely stronger than both X0 and X9, while being priced closer to the X9 end. It's probably less of an issue on DH bikes these days though thanks to short cages, and nice thick dropouts that offer a fair amount of protection.

I think my biggest whine about shimano currently is just that they don't release a shortcage XTR shadow (Saint isn't going to compete with X0 weight wise...), but judging by pics, the new saint cage will fit the XTR. Not really a cheap solution, but at street price probably not far off 1x X0 mech.

 

[toodles]

yeah fair points... altho I don't think the X.0 mech is even worth looking at... the X.9 is less than half the price and no real penalty..

Shimano's offerings have only really gotten better as a result of competition with SRAM and taking the best points of the SRAM mech and applying it to their own stuff. TBH, I love the quick light shifts of the shimano gear, but prefer the durability of the SRAM tuning as well as their construction.

 

[big cal]

They're both nice. All you need to do is ride either, you'll soon get used to it and develop a preference for it. If you don't try the other. Save a whole lot of hassle.

Personally I rarely break mech's but i love never ever having to adjust the sram shifting after it is right, and the solid action of the x9 shifter is nice.

 

[DirtyMike]

Something for me to add, for my own preferance, I will stick with these three derailers myself, For DH racing, I use an x7 rear derailer, if i were to be using shimano, I would be using either an lx or 105. Bascially I think of it like this, I AM going to break them, and there expensive. My derailer is the last place I am looking to save weight, I just want something that is dependable and that will aslt me a race without destryoing my wallet.




Still I repeat, I cannot wait to see the new Saint shadow when we get some in, This one just might take me back to shimano.

 

[darex]

My Shimano Ultegra bent recently on Specialized demo 06. The der. hit the frame always when I went rough stuff because the spring was too soft. The chain had good tension. Ultegra has weak aluminum piece that touch the hanger. I really don't know what der. would be the best for demo 06.

 

[dhkid]

^ zip tie a rubber bumper to your frame where the rd hits. makes your bike a lot quieter too.

 

[pelo]

It´s a good solution. I just find it strange that Shimano can´t deliver a rear mech for DH that doesn´t cost a fortune or has to be modified with zipties an rubber to last and to not sound like a .... They´re just sucking out the last of those Tour de F relics.

Bring on the internal gear standard! (now I said it again, hope someone with input reads it)

 

[dhkid]

hmm, yea. as much as i cant wait for gear box bikes to be main stream. you have to admit that the dérailleurs when set up properly just work.

i wonder why no rd manufacturer has added dampers to an rd, they dont need to be complicated.

 

[DirtyMike]

hmm, yea. as much as i cant wait for gear box bikes to be main stream. you have to admit that the dérailleurs when set up properly just work.

i wonder why no rd manufacturer has added dampers to an rd, they dont need to be complicated.

Now that would be interesting.

 

[dan wask]

I'm going to agree with both of those posts.

If you want the best possible rear dérailleur stay with Sram.

But if you're hell bent on Shimano, a 105 would do the trick, as long as your running a road cassette.

I started running a 105 shortcage, xt shifter, and road cassette out necessity a while back, and I haven't gone back to sram yet. After blowing up numerous x9's and x7's, I grabbed what I needed from my lbs and cobbled it together. Low and behold its one of my favorite drivetrain setups.

 

[pelo]

hmm, yea. as much as i cant wait for gear box bikes to be main stream. you have to admit that the dérailleurs when set up properly just work.

Yes. They actually work very well. But sometimes I just feel ripped off, you know what I mean.

 

[dhkid]

^ hahaha.

quit riding like a hack then.

cant wait for someone to do a good copy of honda's diab. simple, effective. the next refinement of the dc special?

 

[pelo]

He...If you got the cash they work fine, if you don´t, they don´t. Short and simple for you.

 

[rockwool]

^ zip tie a rubber bumper to your frame where the rd hits. makes your bike a lot quieter too.

That has worked fine for me, but it just hit me to zip tie a cut piece of a scotch brite sponge instead. Should be even quieter. I'll make it a pink one too for the gheyness flaming that I'm expecting.

 

[rockwool]

You guys really think 105 works? I´ve had nothing but bad luck with those. They snap by vibrations.
Springs are very flabby too.

Man you've got your nose so far up your math books you've forgotten all the X7 and X9's that have shaked to pieces...

 

[dhkid]

He...If you got the cash they work fine, if you don´t, they don´t. Short and simple for you.

yea understood, some people just dont get along with rd's. everyone has a friend or two who does that.

That has worked fine for me, but it just hit me to zip tie a cut piece of a scotch brite sponge instead. Should be even quieter. I'll make it a pink one too for the gheyness flaming that I'm expecting.

flaming for a good idea, wow, has this place drop to that level?

like the sponge idea.

i got a big fat chunk of rubber that has worked fine, i think i actually transfered from one bike to another. quiet bikes are underrated. i got old road bike tires on my swingarm to quiet that down too.

 

[ronan]

i use some road bike tape on my swingarm to keep it quiet, works good

 

[DirtyMike]

i use some road bike tape on my swingarm to keep it quiet, works good

Grey camo bar wrap for me!!! Works great, best chainstay protector I have ever used!!!! Cheap effective, and easy

 

[pelo]

Man you've got your nose so far up your math books you've forgotten all the X7 and X9's that have shaked to pieces...

Hmm, true, true... They defenitely have their problems too. Especially the ring that sits against the hanger and is supposed to stop forward movement with that little knob on it. Well, If your on Mr Shaky trail, that little knob gets a lot of force and eventually the ring cracks into two halfs. They should make it in steel.

I might have to correct myself here with the 105, obviously becuase of alzheimer; now that Rockwool corrected me, I recalled why I ended 105... If you get a light hit, it easily locks the higher gear positions (from third and down) because of thin material in the wrong place that gets bent towards the adjuster screws.

That combination with soft springs and constant need of new cabels/wires to get it working reliable made me tired. The rollamajig eventually wants to bend the wire adjuster screw, I remember (no, I don´t screw them out much).

But, since Udi is riding the rollamajig (jedi tech.master of RM, doesn´t say much that isn´t true, I have found out) it is more than certain the way to go for S fans.

 

[DirtyMike]

Dude, Avid Rollamajig is another product that got a bad rap, that thing works wonders when you set it up properly. Never have I had a problem with those, and never have I had one cause any ill effects on a bike I have put them on. Great product!!!!!

 

[pelo]

Yup, I believe it is a great product. Techmaster´s got it. I probebly just €%& something up with the rollamajig.

 

[DhDork]

A lot of people can't get used to the Sram "thumb thumb" shifter because of the way that they have it set up. Many run it the same as if its a Shimano shifter. If you run it tucked up right under the brake, you may have difficulties with it. If you run it so that the upshift (to an easier gear) lever is almost vertical, you may like it a lot more.

 

[DirtyMike]

A lot of people can't get used to the Sram "thumb thumb" shifter because of the way that they have it set up. Many run it the same as if its a Shimano shifter. If you run it tucked up right under the brake, you may have difficulties with it. If you run it so that the upshift (to an easier gear) lever is almost vertical, you may like it a lot more.

Trye, if you look at my shifters, they are damn near straight down.