[syadasti]

Those BPA-free bike bottles/bladders may still give you moobs/cancer/anal SARs. Many BPA-free products still have estrogen mimics like BPS.

Scientists and lawyers are scheduled to debate the safety of certain "BPA-free" plastics this week in a U.S. District Court in Austin, Texas.

At issue is whether a line of plastic resins marketed by Eastman Chemical contains chemicals that can act like the hormone estrogen, and perhaps cause health problems.

The court battle has attracted attention because the Eastman resins, sold under the name "Tritan," have been marketed as an alternative to plastics that contain an additive called BPA. BPA has been shown to act a bit like estrogen, though it's not clear whether people are affected by the small amounts that come from plastic water bottles or food containers.

Eastman has sued two small companies based in Austin, Texas, that published a study showing that a wide range of plastic products exhibit what's known as estrogenic activity. Some of the products were made from Eastman's Tritan.

Eastman's suit says PlastiPure and CertiChem have made false or misleading statements about Tritan in marketing their own services. CertiChem tests plastic products for estrogenic activity. PlastiPure, a sister company, helps manufacturers make plastic products with no estrogenic activity.

Both companies were founded by George Bittner, a professor at the University of Texas at Austin and an author of the study that found estrogenic activity in most plastics. The study included tests of plastic products that had been subjected to heat, wear and radiation intended to mimic exposure to sunlight.

"We certainly thought the results were not going to be greeted with favor by at least some plastic manufacturers," Bittner says. But, he says, "by bringing suit, Eastman Chemical has effectively put its Tritan product on trial."

Eastman Chemical wouldn't comment for this story. But in an interview last year, Lucian Boldea, a vice president of the company, said Bittner's study used a screening test for estrogenic activity that is known to produce false positives.

"To misrepresent a screening test as conclusive evidence is what we have the issue with," he said.

Bittner responds that the study included a second test that ruled out false positives.

Expert testimony about the various tests is likely to be a big part of the trial, says Rebecca Tushnet, a law professor at Georgetown. "I think it really depends what the evidence shows about these tests," she says. "And that really is a matter for experts."

This case includes some complex and competing scientific arguments, Tushnet says, which are often difficult to present in court. And even when the science is less nuanced, she says, it can be a challenge for judges and juries.

"Courts have a very ambiguous relationship to science," she says. "Sometimes they really defer to it and sometimes they are really skeptical of it. So it can be hard to predict what's going to happen in any particular case."

At least one piece of evidence likely to come up during the trial could prove embarrassing to Eastman. A supposedly independent study that appears to vindicate Tritan was actually paid for by Eastman, even though that wasn't disclosed in the published article, according to court documents.

If Eastman prevails, it will probably mean the end of PlastiPure and CertiChem. The suit has already caused big problems for the companies, says Mike Usey, the CEO of PlastiPure. "More than half the people that were at CertiChem and PlastiPure before the suit are now gone," he says

Even so, Usey says he's optimistic about the companies' future. "One of the good things that should come out of this suit is more consumer awareness of what the real issues are and what solutions are immediately available."

Whether or not that happens, the suit is a strong indication that the public debate is no longer about BPA alone but about whether plastics contain any chemicals with enough hormonal activity to affect people.

 

[syadasti]

Eastman is part of the broken culture/regulation of product/medical/food testing:

 

[stevew]

as long as i don't develop thumb sized nipples.....

 

[jonKranked]

as long as i don't develop thumb sized nipples.....

or dinner plate sized aereolas

 

[jonKranked]

metal bottle. problem solved.

 

[stevew]

or dinner plate sized aereolas

aka loco aereolas...aka twin galaxy eaters...

 

[stevew]

metal bottle. problem solved.

does camelbak make a 100oz metal bladder?

 

[syadasti]

does camelbak make a 100oz metal bladder?

64 oz vacuum sealed options:

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00AZMICOY/

http://www.drinktanks.com/SearchResults.asp?Cat=1817

 

[stevew]

^
probably order two.

 

[syadasti]

^
probably order two.

I have one of the cheaper 50/50 ones from Amazon in brushed SS. I'd prefer the cap on the drinktank one but its about three times what I paid ($23) for the 50/50 version.

 

[SkaredShtles]

Do people really worry about this $hit?

 

[Jim Mac]

old news!

http://deainfo.nci.nih.gov/advisory/pcp/annualReports/pcp08-09rpt/PCP_Report_08-09_508.pdf

It is vitally important to recognize that children are far more susceptible to damage from
environmental carcinogens and endocrine-disrupting compounds than adults. To the extent
possible, parents and child care providers should choose foods, house and garden products,
play spaces, toys, medicines, and medical tests that will minimize children’s exposure to toxics.
Ideally, both mothers and fathers should avoid exposure to endocrine-disrupting chemicals and
known or suspected carcinogens prior to a child’s conception and throughout pregnancy and
early life, when risk of damage is greatest.

Filtering home tap or well water can decrease exposure to numerous known or suspected
carcinogens and endocrine-disrupting chemicals. Unless the home water source is known
to be contaminated, it is preferable to use filtered tap water instead of commercially bottled
water.

Storing and carrying water in stainless steel, glass, or BPA- and phthalate-free containers
will reduce exposure to endocrine-disrupting and other chemicals that may leach into water
from plastics. This action also will decrease the need for plastic bottles, the manufacture
of which produces toxic by-products, and reduce the need to dispose of and recycle plastic
bottles. Similarly, microwaving food and beverages in ceramic or glass instead of plastic
containers will reduce exposure to endocrine-disrupting chemicals that may leach into food
when containers are heated.

 

[Jim Mac]

Do people really worry about this $hit?

For me it's situational. Having a pregnant wife, I currently do.

 

[syadasti]

For me it's situational. Having a pregnant wife, I currently do.

This court case is not old news.

Either is this:

Originally these epigenetic changes were believed to occur only during fetal development. But pioneering studies showed that molecular bric-a-brac could be added to DNA in adulthood, setting off a cascade of cellular changes resulting in cancer. Sometimes methyl groups attached to DNA thanks to changes in diet; other times, exposure to certain chemicals appeared to be the cause. Szyf showed that correcting epigenetic changes with drugs could cure certain cancers in animals.

Geneticists were especially surprised to find that epigenetic change could be passed down from parent to child, one generation after the next. A study from Randy Jirtle of Duke University showed that when female mice are fed a diet rich in methyl groups, the fur pigment of subsequent offspring is permanently altered. Without any change to DNA at all, methyl groups could be added or subtracted, and the changes were inherited much like a mutation in a gene.

 

[CrabJoe StretchPants]

The cause of Syadasti's mood swings is finally revealed.

 

[Pesqueeb]

Do people really worry about this $hit?

That's why all my water bottles are made from lead. No crazy plastic man boob chemicals. Plus, they keep out harmful radiation! Win-win

 

[SkaredShtles]

For me it's situational. Having a pregnant wife, I currently do.

Does she ever pump her own fuel?

 

[syadasti]

For me it's situational. Having a pregnant wife, I currently do.

Realistically reusable short-term use water bottles shouldn't be a big concern with cold beverages unless they are pretty acidic. The primary concern should be plastic and canned food and beverage that are heat sterilized right before packing and sit on the shelf for long periods (and/or exposed to high temps, direct sunlight, etc).

 

[syadasti]

Another sidenote - as a consultant for a small appliance OEM, I also can say that the newer Tritan parts are more brittle than the old polycarbonate ones.

 

[jonKranked]

Realistically reusable short-term use water bottles shouldn't be a big concern with cold beverages unless they are pretty acidic. The primary concern should be plastic and canned food and beverage that are heat sterilized right before packing and sit on the shelf for long periods (and/or exposed to high temps, direct sunlight, etc).

or you could just, ya know, avoid nasty a$$ canned food in the first place

 

[syadasti]

or you could just, ya know, avoid nasty a$$ canned food in the first place

Canned beer is becoming trendy unfortunately.

 

[jackalope]

FWIW, as someone in the drinking water/waste water business, we generally view the presence of endocrine disruptors and other "contaminants of emerging concern" as an infinitely more critical issue for the waste water side of things given their potential impact on macro-invertebrate, fish, and amphibian populations. Ozonation usually does a respectable job breaking down many of these compounds in the water treatment process, and quite frankly, they're usually present at such unbelieveably small concentrations (parts per trillion), if at all, its not an issue in the first place.

 

[jonKranked]

Canned beer is becoming trendy unfortunately.

just because someone is selling it doesn't mean you have to buy it. Freedom™

 

[stoney]

I think this will help win my battle against plastic in my house. I've made good headway to the BPA-free stuff, but this will help substantially more. Off to Klean Kanteen to spend money.

 

[syadasti]

FWIW, as someone in the drinking water/waste water business, we generally view the presence of endocrine disruptors and other "contaminants of emerging concern" as an infinitely more critical issue for the waste water side of things given their potential impact on macro-invertebrate, fish, and amphibian populations.

Yeah also drugs, antibiotics, etc. Who knows what will happen.

http://arstechnica.com/science/2013/02/anti-anxiety-drugs-impact-wastewater-fish-behavior/

 

[Jim Mac]

Realistically reusable short-term use water bottles shouldn't be a big concern with cold beverages unless they are pretty acidic. The primary concern should be plastic and canned food and beverage that are heat sterilized right before packing and sit on the shelf for long periods (and/or exposed to high temps, direct sunlight, etc).

That's my fear with bottled water, for example - we have no clue if that stuff has been sitting in the sun leaching chemicals, etc.

 

[JohnE]

Does she ever pump her own fuel?

Is that a euphemism for something naughty?

 

[Jim Mac]

Is that a euphemism for something naughty?

Something was pumped at some juncture...

 

[johnbryanpeters]

the cause of syadasti's moob swings is finally revealed.

ok...

 

[TN]

aka loco aereolas...aka twin galaxy eaters...