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Dirt jumps in Virginia (was Richmond)?!!

Dartman

Dartman

Old Bastard Mike
Feb 26, 2003
3,911
0
Richmond, VA
Bad news...

Some hidden dirt jumps and berms were discovered by City Park staff below Oregon Hill. The tool stash was confiscated.

Good news...

Rich Edwards from IMBA Trail Solutions was in town this weekend teaching a trailbuilding seminar for us at RaMORE. Rich was one of the persons along with NOVA MORE that worked to save the 495 jump park.

The discovery of the jumps sparked a discussion among the park managers in how to fill this user need sucessfully while minimizing risk. Rich was there to answer questions and use 495 along with a free ride park in Florida that he rebuilt as success stories of how such a facility could be managed. It was decided that the risk precedent
was already established by the BMX park at Gilles Creek, rock climbing and the use of white water kayaking on the river. They were convinced they could build onto that to provide a legal area for dirt jumps and freeride.

More good news. I have built over many years a great working relationship with the park staff. I would love to work with the local dirt jumpers and BMX riders to establish a sanctioned area where your work would be sustained and not destroyed. They recognized the effort and skill level to create such jumps and would love to harness your energy and skill sets into the park.

Your tools can be retrieved from Nathan Burrell at JRPS headquarters. Be cool with him, he's just doing his job and really wants to help. I was really stoked to hear "How can we make this work?" instead of "How can we keep this from happening?"

Contact me if you want to work to have a place to build your jumps and enjoy them permanently. I can't say definietly if this will become reality but if we don't get together and try it really won't.

There is also a pump track in the works at a park near Poor Farm in Ashland. We need skilled jump and berm builders to make this a reality.

Mike
 
Dartman

Dartman

Old Bastard Mike
Feb 26, 2003
3,911
0
Richmond, VA
BIRDMAN111 said:
cool, i wish theyd do that in c-ville. maybe i should do something about it
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You should. There was interest in the local parks, Walnut Creek I think to do something like that. The local mtb club CAMBC has enough to do to work on the XC trails up there but when I contacted them they said they would support the freeriders. I tried to get Woody to do it. Rich Edwards is an excellent resource. There is a charge for his services but he's worth it. Check out what was accomplished at Santos down in FL near Ocala...

http://www.imba.com/news/trail_news/19_1/itn_19_1_santos.html
 
Westy

Westy

the teste
Nov 22, 2002
54,446
20,248
Sleazattle
Dartman said:
You should. There was interest in the local parks, Walnut Creek I think to do something like that. The local mtb club CAMBC has enough to do to work on the XC trails up there but when I contacted them they said they would support the freeriders. I tried to get Woody to do it. Rich Edwards is an excellent resource. There is a charge for his services but he's worth it. Check out what was accomplished at Santos down in FL near Ocala...

http://www.imba.com/news/trail_news/19_1/itn_19_1_santos.html
Click to expand...
Their have been several messages sent out by CAMBC over the past few years about building jumps and stunts and it seems no one responded. If you want such things get involved.
 
D

dairy_dude

Chimp
Nov 19, 2004
56
0
I'd love to have some legal jumps. I'm not great at jumping but it would be nice to have some to learn on. I'd love to help build but unfotunatly I don't think can can help much due to an accident at powhite that is preventing me from using my right arm until I get my cast off in about five weeks. But afterthat I'd love to help.

B.T.W.- What would be involved in getting some jumps legalized? Who has to approve them?
 
BIRDMAN111

BIRDMAN111

Turbo Monkey
Jan 28, 2006
1,034
0
at school dreaming about trails
Dartman said:
You should. There was interest in the local parks, Walnut Creek I think to do something like that. The local mtb club CAMBC has enough to do to work on the XC trails up there but when I contacted them they said they would support the freeriders. I tried to get Woody to do it. Rich Edwards is an excellent resource. There is a charge for his services but he's worth it. Check out what was accomplished at Santos down in FL near Ocala...

http://www.imba.com/news/trail_news/19_1/itn_19_1_santos.html
Click to expand...
yeah ive heard of talk about jumps a walnut creek, they definatly have the land to do it
 
Dartman

Dartman

Old Bastard Mike
Feb 26, 2003
3,911
0
Richmond, VA
dairy_dude said:
I'd love to have some legal jumps. I'm not great at jumping but it would be nice to have some to learn on. I'd love to help build but unfotunatly I don't think can can help much due to an accident at powhite that is preventing me from using my right arm until I get my cast off in about five weeks. But afterthat I'd love to help.

B.T.W.- What would be involved in getting some jumps legalized? Who has to approve them?
Click to expand...
The City management has to approve them. I am willing to help with the political process as a RaMORE representative. I am a board member with them and have many mutually respective relationships with the people managing our city parks. What I need to do is first involve the local riders so that they can take ownership and help out. It will be most beneficial if the local dirt jumpers, BMX riders and freeriders can get together and work to make this happen. Their skill and energy is appreciated in the work done to build these bootleg jumps and berms, but park managers cannot turn a blind eye to them while knowing they exist that if someone gets hurt on them and the city is sued they are in danger of losing their jobs. It's just a reality of playing on public lands.

Mike
 
bigmclargehuge

bigmclargehuge

Chimp
Dec 3, 2006
69
0
WB
Mike,

Sounds like you are on top of things up there in Richmond. I'm trying to work thru the EVMA down here in Williamsburg to lobby James City County for a bike park or pumptrack. I haven't made any headway yet. You wouldn't happen to know anyone in the EVMA to lend a hand would you?

Matt
 
Dartman

Dartman

Old Bastard Mike
Feb 26, 2003
3,911
0
Richmond, VA
bigmclargehuge said:
Mike,

Sounds like you are on top of things up there in Richmond. I'm trying to work thru the EVMA down here in Williamsburg to lobby James City County for a bike park or pumptrack. I haven't made any headway yet. You wouldn't happen to know anyone in the EVMA to lend a hand would you?

Matt
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Not personally but I will find out. They were able to put some freeride type ladder stuff in New Quarter Park so there must be someone there into it.

Mike
 
ridetoofast

ridetoofast

scarred, broken and drunk
Mar 31, 2002
2,095
5
crashing at a trail near you...
bigmclargehuge said:
Mike,

Sounds like you are on top of things up there in Richmond. I'm trying to work thru the EVMA down here in Williamsburg to lobby James City County for a bike park or pumptrack. I haven't made any headway yet. You wouldn't happen to know anyone in the EVMA to lend a hand would you?

Matt
Click to expand...
kirk moore is evma pres, he is cool with that stuff, but, he has NO clue how to build jumps/berms so its a little frustrating. i was there both weekends when the elevated stuff was built at new quarter which was VERY!!! cool, however, we(he) built a small table at the bottom of a huge (over 6') elevated bridge, and it is simply just too small. you either have to brake check going down the 37 degree off ramp (no that is not a typo or a guess, we measured it), or you completely overshoot the landing tranny rendering it useless. so having said all of that he is cool and receptive, however, be forewarned that you and he might have conflicting visions of what it should look like...
 
mud'n'sweat

mud'n'sweat

Falcon
Feb 12, 2006
1,250
0
I'm interested in building some at Walnut creek. I'd like to see some skinny's, small ladders and drops off some of the XC trails. Something that the XC riders could hit if they chose to and make them lines off the regualr trails to have the normal bail out. Another spot for some DJ's and such would be nice as well. There is already one uber-wide lame "skinny" that was set next to one of the lesser traveled trails up there.

If anyone wants to get together to try and come up with a plan or talks with whomever (cambc, etc.) let me know.
 
mud'n'sweat

mud'n'sweat

Falcon
Feb 12, 2006
1,250
0
Westy said:
Their have been several messages sent out by CAMBC over the past few years about building jumps and stunts and it seems no one responded. If you want such things get involved.
Click to expand...
I think the issue here is that a newsletter through cambc is not going to reach anyone interested. If the messages are only sent to cambc members, it may not be reaching an appropriate demographic.
 
bigmclargehuge

bigmclargehuge

Chimp
Dec 3, 2006
69
0
WB
Dartman and ridetoofast thanks for the feedback. I've sent an email to Kirk and am waiting for his reply. I'm hopeful that he'll be receptive and after your feedback I feel more confident that he will.
Yeah I've ridden the freeride area at New Quarter Park and it's definitely a start but we need something more "challenging..." as far as how to build jumps, I think we might be able to scrounge up enough collective brain power to do the job right. there's also plenty of info on the leelikesbikes website on how to lobby, build, and maintain. so i think it's a real possibility. especially now that i know that there are others into this kind of riding.
 
Dartman

Dartman

Old Bastard Mike
Feb 26, 2003
3,911
0
Richmond, VA
Kirk was the name I got for EVMA.

IMBA also has some excellent resources as well...

http://www.imba.com/resources/freeriding/index.html

Rich Edwards whom I've mentioned lives in Harrisonburg, VA, and while he doesn't work for free (he has to eat), he is an excellent resource for us. Perhaps we can make a regional freeride conference happen with C-Ville, Richmond and Williamsburg park management and clubs.

I thought the same thing riding New Quarter that the table needed to be bigger. But hey it's a start.

The important thing is that a precedent has been set by allowing it there that Richmond and C-Ville can use as well for the risk managers.

For this to be successful we need to be organized and professional. I believe dedication and ownership will come from having built the facilities.

"Don't just go big, think big!"

Mike
 
Dartman

Dartman

Old Bastard Mike
Feb 26, 2003
3,911
0
Richmond, VA
I used my super moderator powers to stick this thread.

We could use those with experience in the 495 jumps in here as well!!

Mike
 
Westy

Westy

the teste
Nov 22, 2002
54,446
20,248
Sleazattle
mud'n'sweat said:
I think the issue here is that a newsletter through cambc is not going to reach anyone interested. If the messages are only sent to cambc members, it may not be reaching an appropriate demographic.
Click to expand...
My point is folks interested in stunts and jumps should join CAMBC or get on the listserve so they can work with a willing organization to get the stunts and jump they want.
 
Tattooo

Tattooo

Turbo Monkey
Jun 5, 2005
1,859
0
OV
Let me know if the VB monkies can kick in to help.
We have a right to do dumb things involving leaving the planet for a few seconds.
 
Dartman

Dartman

Old Bastard Mike
Feb 26, 2003
3,911
0
Richmond, VA
Tattooo said:
Let me know if the VB monkies can kick in to help.
We have a right to do dumb things involving leaving the planet for a few seconds.
Click to expand...
Your help will be appreciated but we won't be approaching this like we have "a right" to do anything. We'll be asking for the "privilege" to use some of the public space and we'll be "grateful" if we get it.

I know you're just using a figure of speech Tattoo, but I want to set the tone now for the way we'll have to present ourselves to accomplish this task.

Mike
 
Tattooo

Tattooo

Turbo Monkey
Jun 5, 2005
1,859
0
OV
Dartman said:
Your help will be appreciated but we won't be approaching this like we have "a right" to do anything. We'll be asking for the "privilege" to use some of the public space and we'll be "grateful" if we get it.

I know you're just using a figure of speech Tattoo, but I want to set the tone now for the way we'll have to present ourselves to accomplish this task.

Mike
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Honestly, that wasn't a figure of speech. We have the same access rights as any other group, that whole Constitution thing kind of told me that. Personally I think the approach of "No prisoners" is the way to roll, especially with local trail groups who have no idea of how this all works.
 
Trouble

Trouble

Chimp
Sep 16, 2004
56
0
Funky Town
Tattooo said:
Honestly, that wasn't a figure of speech. We have the same access rights as any other group, that whole Constitution thing kind of told me that. Personally I think the approach of "No prisoners" is the way to roll, especially with local trail groups who have no idea of how this all works.
Click to expand...
:plthumbsdown:

To follow your logic.. since it's public land I could go put a meth lab there.. since it's our land and all.

As the trails were illegally built on public land, the county is only going to take them down to cover their own ass liability wise. If you follow the proper channels and do it right, and let them cover their ass by crossing the T's and dotting the I's (expert builders with plans signed off, proper signage, etc.), then you'll get your jumps.

If you go in guns blazing "This is our land" etc. Your going to be laughed out of there. Sure it's public land, but the public has to protect it self. If you follow the process and get a consensus, and approval you'll go much farther, and not look like an ass in the process.
 
Dartman

Dartman

Old Bastard Mike
Feb 26, 2003
3,911
0
Richmond, VA
Tattooo said:
Honestly, that wasn't a figure of speech. We have the same access rights as any other group, that whole Constitution thing kind of told me that. Personally I think the approach of "No prisoners" is the way to roll, especially with local trail groups who have no idea of how this all works.
Click to expand...
If that's the case I think we're going to have a problem.

Mike
 
Tattooo

Tattooo

Turbo Monkey
Jun 5, 2005
1,859
0
OV
I see the point of going in with a more gentle touch, but I think a gentle touch with a purpose is more the way to go. Think Michael Jackson at Disney on Ice...

What might be a good point to start is to pick ten or so sites in the state, of which maybe we'll get two, and start putting together some sort of a master plan. There is a place in Folsom, CA that would be a good example of what I think we're talking about. If it can get done in California, which is even more litigious then Virginia or Maryland, then it can get done anywhere.

you have anywhere in mind yet?
Are you thinking of setting up your own organization, or trying to operate with local clubs.

You've got my interest, so let's work out how to do this.
 
Dartman

Dartman

Old Bastard Mike
Feb 26, 2003
3,911
0
Richmond, VA
Tattooo said:
I see the point of going in with a more gentle touch, but I think a gentle touch with a purpose is more the way to go. Think Michael Jackson at Disney on Ice...

What might be a good point to start is to pick ten or so sites in the state, of which maybe we'll get two, and start putting together some sort of a master plan. There is a place in Folsom, CA that would be a good example of what I think we're talking about. If it can get done in California, which is even more litigious then Virginia or Maryland, then it can get done anywhere.

you have anywhere in mind yet?
Are you thinking of setting up your own organization, or trying to operate with local clubs.

You've got my interest, so let's work out how to do this.
Click to expand...
OK then.

I personally will be working through Richmond MORE (Midatlantic Off Road Enthusiasts) as I am currently a board member. I am working to create an arm of our organization to coordinate the efforts of the "advanced technical rider." I have someone we all know in mind to take lead on this. Then like they're doing at Patapsco work with IMBA Trail Solutions to come up with a presentation to the park managers here in Richmond. They got a glimpse of what could be done at our Trailbuilding seminar and it definitely piqued their interest.

I am willing to assist other areas such as C'ville and Williamsburg but they will have to gather their own organization. I can't be everywhere at once. I'm suggesting working with the established local clubs such as EVMA and CAMBC as the generally have the respect of the local land managers. Even if you create your own organization you will still need to work with these folks so I think it would be easier to do from the inside. Perhaps if MORE becomes an example by taking lead on this it will help the others see the benefit of regional cooperation. MORE has connections in both organizations so perhaps we could work something out I'm sure. To me EVMA has shown support for advanced riding by building at New Quarter park. I don't know why the ball was dropped but I'm working to find out. Perhaps it's as simple as they ran out of folks interested in carrying it.

I agree a "gentle touch with a purpose" is the way to go. (Just not in an icky MJ sort of way. :twitch: ) The land managers and risk managers are going to have to see us for responsible adults who present themselves in a professional organized manner. Not a bunch of "hoodlums with shovels" as may be the current perception. I'm not going out to turn all the trails into freeride parks but am looking for a closed area with control points near easy and fast access to EMS extraction.

I look forward to working with you. I just can't support a "scorched earth, winner take all" approach. I know that's not going to fly. Don't lose sight of why we're doing this...FUN!!!

Mike
 
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