Yeah but going from 14 down to 9, you're gonna need some of the gears from each of the two sets of 7. Ah forget it...this is getting too confusing to describe.zedro said:
G-BOXX 2 is born !
- Thread starter EVRAC
- Start date
Alex,bcd said:
How is the new bike coming along?
Hey Alex props for the article in Decline, you are truly a pioneer, great stuff.
I like the looks of that rb. Chain routing is neat. And it's got all those cool machining marks all over.
I like the looks of that rb. Chain routing is neat. And it's got all those cool machining marks all over.
i dont think you understand how it works, it's like having the shimano hub, and add a "transfer case" to double the gears. Ever wonder why the shift is so crappy at 8th gear? thats because the transfer kicks in and the gears reset. Like it goes 1-hi upto 7-hi (gears 1 to 7), then 1-low to 7-low (gears 8 to 14).ChrisRobin said:Yeah but going from 14 down to 9, you're gonna need some of the gears from each of the two sets of 7. Ah forget it...this is getting too confusing to describe.
The Evil hardtail modded the hub by removing the "transfer case"
Yeah I know this, but say you take out that transfer case, you're stuck with all the 1-hi to 7-hi gears. All those gears aren't necessarily usefull for DH riding. You need a few of those 'high' gears as well as the 'low' gears to make a useful gear range for Dh riding.zedro said:
well it's a "racing" range at least, i went on their site and using their calculator gears 14 to 8 using a 42t/16t gear combo is equivalent to a standard mtn cogset with 11-12-14-16-18-21-24 rear cogs and a 42t chainring. But again, i doubt simply dropping those transfer gears would lower the weight significantly.ChrisRobin said:
Right now I am recovering from a broken leg, so I am riding the couch more than anything. Yesterday I took my motorcycle out for a short spin to make sure everything is in good working order. It almost wouldn't start because it has sat around for 5 weeks.bcd said:slow, i have so many other things going.
what you riding right now? irondonkey?
i might get you a new frame this year
if i have time.
thanks OGRIPPER.
I have a ride for this year, so I covered for this race season, but I would love to be riding BCD's again some day.
Ok, well that's not too bad. I never did the calculations. But I agree getting rid of that transfer mechanism probably wouldn't do much in terms of weight savings.zedro said:
Dear friends,
The Taipei bicycle show was a great success for the news born company UNIVERSAL TRANSMISSIONS. We thank all of you for the interrest and encouragement on the G-BOXX product. But anyway, time is running for Eurobike and in order to get bikes ready until then, you need the news andyou need to start now :
1)
All 2D-files reg. geometrie of the GCON-Standard is online now. Please keep an eye on the updated www.g-boxx.org. More information including 3D files and a "public domain design" of an Enduro MTB gearbox bikeframe will be added soon.
2)
For all of you who like to play with "real stuff", instead of virtual reality, a G-BOXX dummy will be ready April 15th. Everbody who wants one of these, need to order now. The dummy represents he maximum housing dimensions, all GCON connection points plus the output sprocket position. More infos upon request.
3)
For all of you who were not on the Taipei show: Universal Transmissions is not only producing the G-BOXX product, but also doing VIP-support on the design and manufacturing of the bicycle frame. Just give us a call or an email and we can offer you the different possibilities.
best regards,
Karl Nicolai; CEO
Universal transmissions GMBH
Külftalstr. 18
31093 Lübbrechtsen
Germany
www.g-boxx.com
www.g-boxx.org
phone: (-49) (0)5185-60266-15
fax.: (-49) (0)5185-957192
The Taipei bicycle show was a great success for the news born company UNIVERSAL TRANSMISSIONS. We thank all of you for the interrest and encouragement on the G-BOXX product. But anyway, time is running for Eurobike and in order to get bikes ready until then, you need the news andyou need to start now :
1)
All 2D-files reg. geometrie of the GCON-Standard is online now. Please keep an eye on the updated www.g-boxx.org. More information including 3D files and a "public domain design" of an Enduro MTB gearbox bikeframe will be added soon.
2)
For all of you who like to play with "real stuff", instead of virtual reality, a G-BOXX dummy will be ready April 15th. Everbody who wants one of these, need to order now. The dummy represents he maximum housing dimensions, all GCON connection points plus the output sprocket position. More infos upon request.
3)
For all of you who were not on the Taipei show: Universal Transmissions is not only producing the G-BOXX product, but also doing VIP-support on the design and manufacturing of the bicycle frame. Just give us a call or an email and we can offer you the different possibilities.
best regards,
Karl Nicolai; CEO
Universal transmissions GMBH
Külftalstr. 18
31093 Lübbrechtsen
Germany
www.g-boxx.com
www.g-boxx.org
phone: (-49) (0)5185-60266-15
fax.: (-49) (0)5185-957192
Check out the SR Suntour website for more:
http://www.srsuntour-cycling.com/SID=siac7c305f04e4022df20ad4fac89ea3/index.php?screen=ne.detail&pid=59&type=news
http://www.srsuntour-cycling.com/SID=siac7c305f04e4022df20ad4fac89ea3/index.php?screen=ne.detail&pid=59&type=news
Here are two pics of Karlheinz NICOLAI´s new G-BOXX 2 equipped Nucleon, he presented in Taipei ("Taipei International Cycle Show 2006" [http://www.alutech-bikes.com/de/news/taipeicycleshow06.html]).
Tame Ape said:
I don't think it's much of a big deal if you're using air shocks...they weight nothing. Even coil shocks weight nothing compared to the gearboxx which is at the bottom bracket.
I'm sure that todays Gearboxes are weighty indeed, but from a mass centralization perspective a pull shock makes sense. Its more compact and self-cleaning.ChrisRobin said:
A lot of the designs that are out there are filled with compromises because of limited shock push/pull types.
edit: Variety is nice. The Pull shock could just be to MTB suspension what the internal combustion engine is to the engine.
A production air pull-shock model does indeed exist, made by SCOTT for the "Genius RC" and "Genius MC" (developed by Peter DENK, produced by GIANT/Taiwan, so far I know. Check out for more information http://www.scottusa.com/category.php?UID=509, http://www.scottusa.com/category.php?UID=510).
except the pull shock already came and went years ago...Tame Ape said:
not much need IMO, tons of great designs out there already, its not much of a hinderance on creativity
I know, but it was one of those things that could easily brought back. Design a bike around that for the purpose of putting all the weight by the BB. One of things that always irritated me about my Heckler was the higher center of caused by the 5th Coil sitting so high up in the frame.zedro said:
yeah but plenty of those around, and i dont think they designed it that way because of no altenative, but rather they wanted the shock high and out in the open. Lots of designers aren't that big on the whole low shock arrangment, otherwise we'd see more Foes and other like-minded designs around which seem to get around the problem fine. Anyways, pull-shocks just irk me for some reasonTame Ape said:
You robots have always loved pull-shocks, its not a surprise.zedro said:yeah but plenty of those around, and i dont think they designed it that way because of no altenative, but rather they wanted the shock high and out in the open. Lots of designers aren't that big on the whole low shock arrangment, otherwise we'd see more Foes and other like-minded designs around which seem to get around the problem fine. Anyways, pull-shocks just irk me for some reason
I figured the SC guys put the shock up high to get the proper leverage ratio on it. Its not like they were trying to reinvent the wheel with their SP line. They spent more time on making it look badass then anything else. Besides, to put the shock down low, you'd need links of some sort like on the DHR.
Pull shocks are far superior.You loose one whole dimension of stress from it not wanting to resist squashing and push out in another direction,you also have more space for dampening on the shaft.
Great to hear the G-Box was well recieved. ****mano will be souping up whatever they've had designed for years no doubt.Letting the G-Box break the ice,hopefully my guess is wrong.
Great to hear the G-Box was well recieved. ****mano will be souping up whatever they've had designed for years no doubt.Letting the G-Box break the ice,hopefully my guess is wrong.
Besides pull-shocks, why not use rotational dampers like in formula 1 racing cars (Ferrari, Sauber) 
[http://www.schwab-kolb.com/zf-sachs/en/sachs002.htm, http://www.zfsachs.com/owx_medien/media241/24133.doc]?
[http://www.schwab-kolb.com/zf-sachs/en/sachs002.htm, http://www.zfsachs.com/owx_medien/media241/24133.doc]?
speaking of pull shocks, ancillotti has stickers that say "pull-shock" on their bikes - even though they use conventional push shocks. crazy, huh? i think they're kinda neat, so here's a couple pictures:
Actually, Ancilotti use Push shocks. The sticker on the swingarm refers to the linkage "pulling" the shock up.
I have a question: the two points of conection of the Gearboxx are not "welded" as the G-Con standar says. It's that the final version??? I supose that the box is strong enough (And heavy) and it's not necesary to close the front triangle of the bike.
Referring to "AR_", Alberto ANCILLOTTI indeed does not use pull-shocks with his patented rear suspension system. The term "pull shock" (as seen on the stickers of the rear swingarm of his actual bikes) is misleading referring to this. It should rather be called "pull rod", because this suspension system makes use of a rear swingarm driven pull rod that pushes the push-shock. For more information see http://www.ancillotti.com/pull_shock.htm.
Referring to "Vrock", you are absolutely right. According to the Karlheinz NICOLAI´s g-boxx website, "it´s not necesary to close the front triangle of the bike" (http://g-boxx.org/english/dateien/inhalt/faq/19.htm). The G-CON standard (i.e. "the final version") defines the shape and position of four pairwise (i.e. eight) cylindric connecting points between the gearbox housing and the frame. As far as I understand, it´s finally the choice of the frame builder if he uses the so call "Weldin" part to connect the downtube and the seat tub of the frame ("The form-lock between the cylindrical interfaces of the transmission housing and the main frame results in an extraordinary strong connection") and by this way to make the box housing a stress member of the box-frame system or not. As well as it´s the user´s choice if the gearbox housing is connected to the frame by means of 6.5mm crosstapped bolts or "directly" by means of stronger 10mm bolts with a side connection. The box housing seems to be strong enough for different ways to fit a bicycle frame to a G-CON gearbox (http://g-boxx.org/english/dateien/inhalt/faq/21.htm). However, NICOLAI´s "g-boxx 2" equipped Nucleon as well as SR SUNTOUR´s "v-box" equipped bike, shown on the "Taipei International Cycling Show 2006", both apparently use an uniform frame (built by NICOLAI), without the above "Weldin" part ([http://www.alutech-bikes.com/de/news/taipeicycleshow06.html] for a pic of the g-boxx 2 Nucleon see above).
Referring to "Vrock", you are absolutely right. According to the Karlheinz NICOLAI´s g-boxx website, "it´s not neces
funny, Brooklyn's been using that type of linkage for years, among other variations (PDC, Nicolai, GT...). Not sure what they are patenting.Wilhelm said:
As for 'bolt-together' bikes, they work fine. Hell bikes are one of the few vehicles out there where welding everything together is the norm anyways.
Well, Brooklyn use a system more similar to MX bikes, with the link the lower shock mount is mounted swinging from the swingarm rather than the frame.. I'm not a suspension tech so i have no idea of it's technical merits, but it feels freakin' Ace. And Ancilottis feel freakin' toss.
Quick tip for anyone considering an Ancilotti, get a Turner DHR. It's like a 'Lotti, but good. With a proper shock.
Quick tip for anyone considering an Ancilotti, get a Turner DHR. It's like a 'Lotti, but good. With a proper shock.
Well then the old Suzuki's claiming that they have a "full floater" must really boggle your mind.xy9ine said:speaking of pull shocks, ancillotti has stickers that say "pull-shock" on their bikes - even though they use conventional push shocks. crazy, huh? i think they're kinda neat, so here's a couple pictures:
Pro-Link = Honda
I forget the others....
:Just marketing.
ok it initially looked different on the pic...so Ancelottis frames have an even more generic linkage configuartion then....AR_ said:
edit: shouldnt of lumped the PDC and GT with the BMW, but still they all come out rather similar.
Speaking of Linkages:
From page 6 in this thread I think...
dw:
Dave.
Whatcha got cookin'?... or maybe you might be able to share when "it" will be done???
From page 6 in this thread I think...
dw:
Soooooo....
Dave.
Whatcha got cookin'?... or maybe you might be able to share when "it" will be done???
Or is it just that a motor pulling the chain on anything but a single pivot will reek havock on any reliable feel from the rear end and no shock will be able to compensate. The rear would be to inconsistent in it's movement under power. I'm sure you could work something out and yes Motos are very primitive but why sacrifice reliabillity for well for?? Performance???The bikes would become very specialised and it would be a lot for a rider to understand and explain on top of all thier settings already. I'm sure it will come but not quickly to the mainstream.
L
luelling
Guest
I thought I had read an article a while back about the lawill design being put on a motogp bike and the riders didn't like it becuase the bike wouldn't squat correctly in the corners...it made the bike handle way to different
I know that the Lawill design was grafted onto a dirt tracker motorcycle....but I haven't heard of the MX bike.luelling said:
Amp Research at one time made a thing that redirected the chainline away from the pivot to change the chain forces acting upon the MX bikes.....that was in the 80's (I
)The Dirt Tracker by Lawwill:
http://www.mertlawwill.com/images/ST_swingarm.jpg
So Yamaha is going to use a dw-link on the M1 to solve the chatter problem Rossi is fighting?dw said:
L
luelling
Guest
Thats a cool pic. I like it when you see mountain bike tech used in other industriesRhinofromWA said:I know that the Lawill design was grafted onto a dirt tracker motorcycle....but I haven't heard of the MX bike.
Amp Research at one time made a thing that redirected the chainline away from the pivot to change the chain forces acting upon the MX bikes.....that was in the 80's (I
The Dirt Tracker by Lawwill:
http://www.mertlawwill.com/images/ST_swingarm.jpg
OK, I have figured out a design for a DH bike with a V-Boxx and I'll like to know your opinion... It has 8 inches of travel, the Geo is not finished so I accept sugestions. Right now the HA is 64º, too slack? and the BB Height is 360mm, too low?
3D views will come soon
3D views will come soon
