right can anyone recomend me a 1.5>1 1/8 headset, zero stack, deep press. the only ones ive seen that fit this criteria are the sunline ones but after reading some reviews on mtbr it would appear that their tollerences are a bit wack. can anyone confirm this? suggest anything else? cheers!
headset recomendations
- Thread starter MisterMental
- Start date
so the e13 cups and ANY normal 1 1/8 headset, doesnt have to be zero stack or anything?
You need an Integrated Standard headset to fit e.thirteen cups. e.thirteen lists some of the specific models that fit their headset right on the site.
IS headsets are just bearings. Here is a simple explanation of the different headset standards.
(ps - If you have a zerostack headset just lying around you can usually pop the bearings out of the cups and use them. Most are just IS bearings in alloy cups.)
-ska todd
IS headsets are just bearings. Here is a simple explanation of the different headset standards.
(ps - If you have a zerostack headset just lying around you can usually pop the bearings out of the cups and use them. Most are just IS bearings in alloy cups.)
-ska todd
I'm not a fan of the e13 cups. They leave the bearings completely exposed, top and bottom. Although it shouldn't matter since they're sealed bearings, it still seems a little janky to me. I prefer the Cane Creek XXc II Flush headset. Much cleaner design.
You can run the stock headset "covers" on the headsets w/ the e.thirteen cups but a lot of riders take them off to lower the stack even more. The e.thirteen cups are also 7075 vs the CC ones which are 6061. The bearings also press fit into the e.thirteen vs drop in on the CC. The e.thirteen cups + FSA also price out $10-15 less than the CC. And, for added dork value you can also put FSA Ceramic IS headset in the e.thirteen.
-ska todd
-ska todd
That hasn't been my experience. All the headset dust covers I've tried to use with the e13 cups rub on the surface of the cup and won't sit flush over the bearing. Plus there's the weird gap you get between the crown race and the lower bearing. Anyways, a search will give you all the info you need. There's a huge thread on here from like 4 years ago that covers the e13 reducer cups in great detail.
EDIT: For the weight weenies, the e13 system weighs about 25g more than the Cane Creek headset. And just out of curiosity, what difference does 7075 aluminum vs. 6061 aluminum make in a headset? I can't imagine it'd be much...
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the e13 with any IS headset seems to be the preffered zero stack setup for a 1.5 to 1.125 setup. You dont have a super deep insertion, but with a flush mount setup like this, there is no need.
any experience with these ones: CANE CREEK
These would be the cheapest I have came across...
These would be the cheapest I have came across...
I've always just used Cane Creek Double XC Flush converter headsets.
Seems to make alot more sense to purchase a complete headset assembly from the get go. Reducer cups from any manufacturer plus the other assorted parts to build your own headset could always work, but this is 2009. Maybe back when the 1.5 standard was in its infancy this was a viable option, but nowadays I can't help but think that it is some odd marketing exercise/study when so many people think that the best way to go about purchasing a flush converter is to buy a certain brands converter sleeve and then buy all the separate piece parts.
Seems to make alot more sense to purchase a complete headset assembly from the get go. Reducer cups from any manufacturer plus the other assorted parts to build your own headset could always work, but this is 2009. Maybe back when the 1.5 standard was in its infancy this was a viable option, but nowadays I can't help but think that it is some odd marketing exercise/study when so many people think that the best way to go about purchasing a flush converter is to buy a certain brands converter sleeve and then buy all the separate piece parts.
yeah id rather have a complete headset rather than arsing about getting reducers, bearings, crownraces, topcaps, compression rings etc etc. i saw that cheap cane creek one but really want something deeper press which was why i was looking at the sunline one. anybody have any experience with it?
I've only ever uninstalled a Sunline. Tolerances were on the overly tight side and I'm not the biggest fan of the non-compression ring setup they use.
Is there any reason that you need something that is any deeper insertion than say the Double XC? Have you ovalised one of these headsets/headtubes? If it is worth anything, I've never had or have heard of anyone had a problem with the Cane Creek.
im just paranoied about ovalising headtubes as ive done it a few times before and this headset will be going into a turner rail so theres gonna be no chance of warranty/ getting spare mainframe.
http://www.canecreek.com/component-headsets?product=XXcFlushII
I have used this one and have been very pleased with the results.
I have used this one and have been very pleased with the results.
That looks like its a perfect setup for what your looking for.
And just out of curiosity, what difference does 7075 aluminum vs. 6061 aluminum make in a headset? I can't imagine it'd be much...[/QUOTE]
Chemistry and strength. 7075 has almost 2x the yield and tensile strength.
6061-T6
Ultimate Tensile Strength 290 MPa 42.0 ksi
Tensile Yield Strength 255 MPa 37.0 ksi
Elongation at Break 12.0 %
Modulus of Elasticity 68.9 GPa 10000 ksi
Shear Strength 186 MPa 27000 psi
7075-T6
Ultimate Tensile Strength 524 MPa 76.0 ksi
Tensile Yield Strength 462 MPa 67.0 ksi
Elongation at Break 11.0 %
Modulus of Elasticity 71.7 GPa 10400 ksi
Shear Strength 317 MPa 46000 psi
www.matweb.com
Chemistry and strength. 7075 has almost 2x the yield and tensile strength.
6061-T6
Ultimate Tensile Strength 290 MPa 42.0 ksi
Tensile Yield Strength 255 MPa 37.0 ksi
Elongation at Break 12.0 %
Modulus of Elasticity 68.9 GPa 10000 ksi
Shear Strength 186 MPa 27000 psi
7075-T6
Ultimate Tensile Strength 524 MPa 76.0 ksi
Tensile Yield Strength 462 MPa 67.0 ksi
Elongation at Break 11.0 %
Modulus of Elasticity 71.7 GPa 10400 ksi
Shear Strength 317 MPa 46000 psi
www.matweb.com
That's only for zero stack headtubes. Won't work with standard setups.
Its a 1.5 to 1.125 reducer headset, yes it is a zero<or near zero if you will> but its one peice, deep fitment, like what the OP was looking for. Is there something I am missing that shows it wont work for a 1.5 HT application
gonna take a gamble on the sunline one i think. its only 25 quid. seems easier than pissing about getting reducer cups, bearings, spares n all that crap. fingers crossed on the tollerance issues!
I run a DoubleXC Flush on my nomad. It has worked fine and held up to light DH/shuttling, trips to the BMX track, and XC riding for almost a year now.
I did have to remove the Low Speed Compression nob from my lyric to get it to clear the down tube. You can order the bottom cup from a DoubleXC (Cane Creek said they would send me one if I wanted) and mix and match if you need more clearance. I like my front end low so I decided just to loose the nob.
Cane Creek has always worked well for me, I consider it to be a poor man's Chris King.
I did have to remove the Low Speed Compression nob from my lyric to get it to clear the down tube. You can order the bottom cup from a DoubleXC (Cane Creek said they would send me one if I wanted) and mix and match if you need more clearance. I like my front end low so I decided just to loose the nob.
Cane Creek has always worked well for me, I consider it to be a poor man's Chris King.
Don't do it... there's a reason Sunline isn't making those headsets anymore. It's a poor design that's super hard to work on.
Sorry to revive an old thread, but I wanted to give an update on my personal headset situation. Although I voted for the Cane Creek XXc Flush II earlier in this thread, I gotta say that I'm no longer pleased with it. I can't get it to stop creaking, no matter how many times I pull it out, grease it, and re-press it. I would guess that it has to do with the super-shallow cup insertion depth. I just ordered some e13 reducer cups, so hopefully those will solve my problem.
Have you faced your frame? I have the same headset on my Socom, and it did the same thing until I had the shop face it. Hasn't made a noise since.
Negative, have not faced the frame, but the top and bottom of the headtube are clear of all paint and it all looks pretty damn kosher, straight from the factory. And I don't have access to a 1.5" headtube facing tool anyways, so I'll keep my fingers crossed and hope the new headset solves the problem.
With as low as the insertion is, you need it faced, or your never going to cure that creek.
Even though the paint is gone, part of the facing process is to ensure the mating surface is in perfect alignment.....You guys would **** if you new how many bikes, even from teh factory, still need to be properly faced.
With the insertion level, youll probably still get that creek if you dont face it even with the e13 cups.
Even though the paint is gone, part of the facing process is to ensure the mating surface is in perfect alignment.....You guys would **** if you new how many bikes, even from teh factory, still need to be properly faced.
With the insertion level, youll probably still get that creek if you dont face it even with the e13 cups.
Your LBS doesn't have a 1.5 facing tool?
Nope. I work at the LBS, and we definitely don't have one. In fact, I've never worked at a shop that had a 1.5 facing tool.
Any other local shops have one???? Maybe its time to have the boss get one.
Well, its actually a great investment for a shop to get now. There are alot of bikes you need the 1.5 facer/reamer, alot of road bikes with 1.5 lowers, alot of xc bikes that are the same way.
We use ours ALOT..Specially seeing how noone else has it.
We use ours ALOT..Specially seeing how noone else has it.
So you're going from a headset with one interface on an unfaced headtube, to reducer cups, still on an unfaced headtube, and an integrated headset. You now have 2 potentical interfaces that can/will creak and smaller headset bearings.
I'd have thought the reducer cups were a completely redundant product these days with numerous 1.5>1.125" reducer headsets about, any plenty of zero stack options.
Hope make a zero stack stepdown.
I'd have thought the reducer cups were a completely redundant product these days with numerous 1.5>1.125" reducer headsets about, any plenty of zero stack options.
Hope make a zero stack stepdown.
I know it's a bite late, but I bought an Acros 1.5-1 1/8" reducer headset and the quality seems great. Mine is going into a 4130 headtube, will the Park facer work on 4130 tubing?
My two experiences with 1.5 headsets have been less than stellar. I have the E.13 reducer cups in my bike now and I have to admit that it is the only E.13 product I haven't been totally satisfied with. Their customer service has been great and it would really help if they would step up and sell this as a complete headset or even a kit minus the bearings but with the crown race and dust cover for the top. I have it installed with some FSA bearings and the crown race/dust cover/o-rings from and older FSA headset that was on my last bike. The gap between the crown race and the dust cover is too large to capture the o-ring correctly. Now that I think about it more I might have even binned the dust cover as it was really just useless.
One of the guys I ride with just got a Cane Creek zero stack headset, I'm not sure what model it is, and it sits much lower than mine and has a very nice integrated look and gap between the pieces. I'd say the fit and finish is better but I don't know how long it will last compared to my set up.
One of the guys I ride with just got a Cane Creek zero stack headset, I'm not sure what model it is, and it sits much lower than mine and has a very nice integrated look and gap between the pieces. I'd say the fit and finish is better but I don't know how long it will last compared to my set up.
Patent infringment!! They cannot do that without clearly violating CC's aheadset patent.
The crownrace/dustcap to bearing/frame gap issue is an issue with IS headsets in any application. Because the bearings do not key off of the face of the headtube (they sit against a beveled surface within the headtube), the bearing depth of IS headsets (from the headtube face) varies significantly. Pull apart any OEM IS headset and you will find a stack of microspacers under the dust cap to 'adjust' the fit. Most road forks designed for IS frames are deisgned to hide the crown race gap.
E-13 could have sunk the bearings further into the cups to hide the cosmetic gaps, but that would run the risk of having some crownrace/dustcap contact the cups. Certianly a worse situation than a visual discontinuity that does not affect the function.
Well... just called 8 different shops, 4 of which are in my area, 4 of which are only kinda-sorta near where I live, and NOBODY has a 1.5 facing tool. Two of the shops focus heavily on downhill bikes too. Crazy.
had the same problem about a year ago. Had a friend take it to a shop in San Jose I forget the name and it's a long way form Tahoe but I can get it for you if you want.
P.S. Do deep cups really do anything?
P.S. Do deep cups really do anything?
That was my my guess too. With the rest of the goodness that comes out of E.13 it was kind of disappointing to have the fit and finish issues I've had with the reducer cups. I will say that they have not been treated that well (lots of rain and sand and dust) and headset is holding up well. *knocking on wood now*
Yup, you were right. Replaced the top Cane Creek cup with an e13 cup and it was silent for half a day of riding, but then started creaking again. Super lame. Guess I'm gonna have to make some sort of roadtrip to track down a shop with a 1.5 facing tool.