help a newb out (build a jumper/downhiller???)

bjanga · Mar 16, 2006

How much would you want to spend if you built one? Do you want more of a trail-riding DH bike or a street bike? The differences can be important.

livetheride514 · Mar 16, 2006

-You definetly want a disc up front over the rear if you are only gunna get one cuz the front provides something like 80% of the stopping power.

-A redline DH bike?!?!

- A DH bike is quite slack (slower reaction in the front end), while a street bike is steep (quicker/sharper reaction in the front end. A dh bike has mainly 6" - 8" up front and 6" - 11" in the rear for suspension, and a street bike would have about 3" - 5" up front. A Dh bike is usually dual suspension (with a few exceptions such as an evil Imperial), and a street bike is usually a hardtail ( except when Cameron McCaul rides...). a dh bike is usually heavier too because of beefier parts... there is more but it's homework time...

-it will be hard to get a trail bike to feel anything near a bmx bike. closest thing would be: a evil DOC or Sovereign ( or something with a steep headangle) with a rigid fork or something like a 80mm sherman jumper with a firm spring, or a pike.

Changleen · Mar 16, 2006

I think you should look at bikes that advertise themselves as being suitable for 4X racing. I think that sounds like the style of bike you are after.

4X bikes tend to have short chainstays and steeper head angles for fast handling. They are also built strong enough for abuse but try to stay light enough to be thrown around easily.

Google for some images of 4X racing / 4X bikes / just 4X and see if you like the bikes you see. There are often a mix of hardtails and shortish travel rear suspension frames.

Changleen · Mar 16, 2006

Should have though of this, my bike is actually a 4X frame, but I have put really stiff DJ forks on it, BMX style tyres and made it single speed so it's really set up for street riding.

This frame is 24" wheel specific but Revell also make one with the same geometry for 26"s.

Changleen · Mar 16, 2006

Also have a look through the 'Freeride Hardtails' section in the image gallery on this site, although be aware some of those bikes are more set up for so called 'Northshore' or Freeriding, and tend to have slacker geometry and tend to be more overbuilt than you might want.

Also go to www.unrealcycles.com and look through their gallery - Same deal, a mix of street, jump, 4X and freeride bikes.

Aman77 · Mar 16, 2006

If i were you i would go with a Cannondale Chase frame and start there. It is a small but durable frame. Then go crazy. Don't go to much on the fork because youll want speed. Also get a bash guard cranks break!

Changleen · Mar 17, 2006

You'll probably like the general style of the P series bikes or the C'Dale Chase, but you might find the head angles too relaxed for you coming from BMX. As they are mass market bikes, they don't have the super fast handling a lot of people coming from other MTBs would find too twitchy.

Also personally I hate Cannondale, and being a BMXer you should too!

The new (06) P series looks pretty awesome though if you can deal with the geometry. You should also check out Norco, and maybe Giant's STP range.

bjanga · Mar 17, 2006

For a buildup (opposed to a complete bike) look at the soul cycles loki. www.ridesoul.com

Do a search for them in the downhill forum, they are going for $185 right now.

If you want singlespeed, check out this guy:

http://www.unrealcycles.com/item.php?view=58

I have never hear of voodoo but this frame looks good. It will allow you to run either a geared or singlespeed, disc or no disc.

Changleen, do you ever have clearance problems with your front rotor?

Changleen · Mar 17, 2006

bjanga said:
I have never hear of voodoo but this frame looks good. It will allow you to run either a geared or singlespeed, disc or no disc.

Voodoo are pretty cool.

Changleen, do you ever have clearance problems with your front rotor?

Yes, that's why I'm running an 8" disc. Actually now I've had 8" I won't go back (it just feels so good

ink: ) but yeah I think you'd need to have the wheel dished off centre to run a 6".

Changleen · Mar 17, 2006

dooktruck said:
i think i'm looking for something along the lines of this.
http://www.unrealcycles.com/gallery_view.php?view=593&Bare+Bones+ns-streetlegal+Dirt+Jumping,+Freeriding,+Skatepark,+Urban+Assault

That is nice. Halo rims are way heavy though,and not neccassarily that much stronger than a well built set of average weight rims.

except i need a cassette on the rear to ride trails i bet, do people run a 24" rear and 26" front rim ever?

Yeah, you need a few gears to tackle nearly any real trail unless you have legs like an elephant. People do run 24/26, but mostly for DH because it slackens the head angle. I love 24" but I know a lot of people don't - It's certainly great for street and DJ because there is less weight to throw , but on a rough trail it doesn't roll quite as well. If you're going to be 'mountain biking' 26" is probably more suitable,but if you wanna ride park and street too, 24" may be more your bag.

finding the right frame and fork is gonna the be the hardest part.

And the most important, and the most fun.

bjanga · Mar 17, 2006

Changleen, I was referring to obstacle clearance and the rotor, being that your bike is all streety and stuff.

I would not want to do the 24" thing because, like chang said, they do not do quite as well on rough trails.

EDIT: this is my bike. It is in the same 'extreme riding' class as Changleen's, but mine is more set up for riding up and down gnarly, rocky hills.

Changleen · Mar 18, 2006

OK so:

P3 2006 - Head Angle 69 degrees, 15.7" chainstay, Top tube 21.25" or 23.5"

Norco 416 - Head Angle 70.5 degrees, 15.9" Chainstay, 22.4" Toptube.

GT Ruckus DJ - Head angle 69-68 degrees, 16.14" Chainstay, 22.4" Top tube

Revel 250R - 72 degree head angle, 15.75 -14.5" chainstay, 21" top tube.

.243 Racing - 69 degree head angle, 15.1 - 16.7" Chainstay, 22.7 Top tube.

Giant STP - 69 Degreehead angle, 16" Chainstay, 22.1 - 23" Toptube.

scurban · Mar 18, 2006

Changleen said:
Should have though of this, my bike is actually a 4X frame, but I have put really stiff DJ forks on it, BMX style tyres and made it single speed so it's really set up for street riding.

This frame is 24" wheel specific but Revell also make one with the same geometry for 26"s.

hmmm XT cranks, the light dirt jumper, single speed 24" wheels, Thomson,

Dude how much does that thing weigh?

Changleen · Mar 18, 2006

scurban said:
hmmm XT cranks, the light dirt jumper, single speed 24" wheels, Thomson,

Dude how much does that thing weigh?

I'v never actually weighed it. If I did I'd be opening a whole new can of anal obsesiveness.

It's lighter than my heavy ass BMX and my AC1 though. I think it's roughly the same as my wife's tiny hardtail Stumpjumper.

Bicyclist · Mar 18, 2006

Get an Evil D.O.C.! Search for Evil in the DJ forum and you'll see my setup.

bjanga · Mar 19, 2006

DOC could be kinda pricey for your budget, depending on how much you want to spend on other components like your suspension fork. It is a very versatile frame though, with the dropout system and frame geometry it has.

livetheride514 · Mar 19, 2006

Changleen said:
Yeah, you need a few gears to tackle nearly any real trail unless you have legs like an elephant. People do run 24/26, but mostly for DH because it slackens the head angle. I love 24" but I know a lot of people don't - It's certainly great for street and DJ because there is less weight to throw , but on a rough trail it doesn't roll quite as well. If you're going to be 'mountain biking' 26" is probably more suitable,but if you wanna ride park and street too, 24" may be more your bag.

there really arnt many dh'ers with a 24 in the rear because it is a much harsher ride and doesnt like to roll over as many things as a 26 would. a big hit is the only kinda dh bike i know of that is built to be rear 24 only.

I ride 26/24 for street/park and love it. it's a great set-up.

Changleen · Mar 19, 2006

dooktruck said:
man there is an azonic steelhead pro length (not proxl) for $149......
maybe i should consider a build with a budget frame and good components......

any thoughts?

I think the Steelhead is a good strong frame. They are very popular for DJ in the UK.

Bicyclist · Mar 19, 2006

I would personally ride a Steelhead over a Soul Cycles.

bjanga · Mar 19, 2006

Bicyclist said:
I would personally ride a Steelhead over a Soul Cycles.

Why?

I think the Loki is the more DJ oriented one.

I do not know anything about angles. You might try emailing soul cycles and asking.

Changleen · Mar 19, 2006

The Titan appears to have a slacker head angle and seat tube by a degree or two. I guess it also has a slightly longer wheelbase. However the Titan also looks more like what I'd expect a DJ built frame to look like, but the colour and range of the shot may be decieving about that.

I'd guess the Loki is supposed to be the more DJ/4X model and the Titan is the freeridey model...

(I know nothing about Soul Cycles BTW)

formermtboarder · Mar 19, 2006

ok soul cycles=best bang for the buck, and the guys r super cool

i have a roscoe, which i love btw. DJ BEAST, wish the chainstays were a little shorter though

email me if you have specific questions-- buckboxley@alltel.net

also you can email chad@ridesoul.com for pricing etc, i dont know when the new site will be ready, hopefully soon.

i reccomend the soul's--not top end but solid and cheep (did i mention the roscoe looks AWESOME?), but its up to u, good luck

help a newb out (build a jumper/downhiller???)

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