Hey guys, does anyone know when the IronHorse 6Point bikes are going to be avaliable? More specifically, when the 6Point8 will be out and how much is the retail price? There are not any IronHorse dealers near by so I can't ask them. I also saw that there will be a 15", 17" and 19". This summer I rode my friends 19" MkIII with a 50mm stem around and it felt great for the type of riding I was doing. Will the 19" 6Point be similar or will a 17" be better? Any help would be greatly appreciated.
IronHorse 6Point8 questions?
- Thread starter speedster
- Start date
I've got some questions.
I'm going to replace my Foes 04 FXR, Ti Curnut, Z1 freeride 150mm Travel. I mostly use it in the longer travel setting.
I ride mainly fireroads up and tech trails down
I'm also planning on doing the equivalent of Super D races over here in France.
Which bike will suit me best the MKIII or the 6point series?
I'm leaning heavily towards the 6point but any input would be nice.
Another question, what do you think about the choice of 150mm hub/83mm BB on the 6point? Personaly the lack of light-weight out-board bearing crank options, and running ISIS is annoying to say the least.
O yeah, I saw the 6pont8 at the roc d'azur this weekend and it is a really nice bike in the flesh!
Cheers
I'm going to replace my Foes 04 FXR, Ti Curnut, Z1 freeride 150mm Travel. I mostly use it in the longer travel setting.
I ride mainly fireroads up and tech trails down
I'm also planning on doing the equivalent of Super D races over here in France.
Which bike will suit me best the MKIII or the 6point series?
I'm leaning heavily towards the 6point but any input would be nice.
Another question, what do you think about the choice of 150mm hub/83mm BB on the 6point? Personaly the lack of light-weight out-board bearing crank options, and running ISIS is annoying to say the least.
O yeah, I saw the 6pont8 at the roc d'azur this weekend and it is a really nice bike in the flesh!
Cheers
I do not know pricing or delivery. Sorry I can't help there.
I can tell you a little about the bikes. First, you can buy either in kit or FRAME ONLY form.
The 6POINT frame weighs 7.3 lbs with shock for a medium size.
The bike easily fits a 2.5 tire, and with a LOT of clearance. You could fit a 2.8 in there. The chainstays are not super long either.
Here is why. As the name suggests, the bike is based on the 7POINT platform. The frame has its own custom triple butted tubeset, derived from the Type 6 prototype.
The bike uses an 83-150 BB/ chainstay setup.
Some people think this means some huge weight increase. Its not the case.
Here are the #s.
The rear 150 hub adds a total of 19 grams to the bike weight over a 135 QR. (Based on WTB hubs)
The extra BB width BB and extra tubing for the rear end (about 16mm total length worth) weighs in at a WHOPPING 12 grams.
I am not sure what the extra crank weight is, but a 10mm section of hollow 20mm diameter steel axle and a 10mm piece of thin plastic tube does not weigh much. I'd bet less than 25 grams but I don't know.
SO on the frame side this brings an extra 31 grams, or 0.068 lbs.
Total extra weight for the 83-150 setup: Roughly 35-60 grams.
A 17 inch 6POINT frame with air shock (DHX air) weighs in the the low 7 lb range.
Geometry: OK, it gets a litte tricky. The bike is designed to run an offset seat post.
17 inch size
HA: 68
SA: Actual 73.5, with offset post 71
eff TT: 23.0 (with supplied offset post)
WB 43.6
CS:17.3
BB: 13.75
Travel: 161mm
QR rear wheel
The MKIII got a lot lighter this year. It weighs 6.25 lbs with shock for a 17 inch frame. It sports a 69 degree head angle with a 140 fork. Its a sick singletrack woods ripper.
If I were racing Super D a lot, I might be tempted to go for a 6POINT. The dw-link suspension really doesn't give any penalty for longer travel, both bikes accelerate equally well, the 6POINT just has mure cusion. I don't feel that the slacker angles really hurt climbing so much on the 6POINT, and they do help confidence descending. (edit) If you put the 150 fork up front, you'll be around 68 degrees and thats not too bad at all.
Hope this helps.
Dave
I can tell you a little about the bikes. First, you can buy either in kit or FRAME ONLY form.
The 6POINT frame weighs 7.3 lbs with shock for a medium size.
The bike easily fits a 2.5 tire, and with a LOT of clearance. You could fit a 2.8 in there. The chainstays are not super long either.
Here is why. As the name suggests, the bike is based on the 7POINT platform. The frame has its own custom triple butted tubeset, derived from the Type 6 prototype.
The bike uses an 83-150 BB/ chainstay setup.
Some people think this means some huge weight increase. Its not the case.
Here are the #s.
The rear 150 hub adds a total of 19 grams to the bike weight over a 135 QR. (Based on WTB hubs)
The extra BB width BB and extra tubing for the rear end (about 16mm total length worth) weighs in at a WHOPPING 12 grams.
I am not sure what the extra crank weight is, but a 10mm section of hollow 20mm diameter steel axle and a 10mm piece of thin plastic tube does not weigh much. I'd bet less than 25 grams but I don't know.
SO on the frame side this brings an extra 31 grams, or 0.068 lbs.
Total extra weight for the 83-150 setup: Roughly 35-60 grams.
A 17 inch 6POINT frame with air shock (DHX air) weighs in the the low 7 lb range.
Geometry: OK, it gets a litte tricky. The bike is designed to run an offset seat post.
17 inch size
HA: 68
SA: Actual 73.5, with offset post 71
eff TT: 23.0 (with supplied offset post)
WB 43.6
CS:17.3
BB: 13.75
Travel: 161mm
QR rear wheel
The MKIII got a lot lighter this year. It weighs 6.25 lbs with shock for a 17 inch frame. It sports a 69 degree head angle with a 140 fork. Its a sick singletrack woods ripper.
If I were racing Super D a lot, I might be tempted to go for a 6POINT. The dw-link suspension really doesn't give any penalty for longer travel, both bikes accelerate equally well, the 6POINT just has mure cusion. I don't feel that the slacker angles really hurt climbing so much on the 6POINT, and they do help confidence descending. (edit) If you put the 150 fork up front, you'll be around 68 degrees and thats not too bad at all.
Hope this helps.
Dave
good numbers dee dubs. i always wanted to know just how much a 150mm rear end would cost me on the scale.
See above. The spacing doesn't give any noticable weight penalty (35-60 grams) so why not? Because its not the norm?
The bike shares the rear triangle and lower pivot forging with the 7POINT, both of which were lightened considerably for 07.
Dave
wow cool!
I don't have any problems with the 83/150 design, it's the lack of BB's to fit it... Most 83mm bb frames are DH frames and the bb on that gets the snot kided out of it so it's big and heavy.
I HATE ISIS and the 6point forces you to run it.
Only complaint about the bike. As I said, I saw one this weekend and I think I need one.
I don't have any problems with the 83/150 design, it's the lack of BB's to fit it... Most 83mm bb frames are DH frames and the bb on that gets the snot kided out of it so it's big and heavy.
I HATE ISIS and the 6point forces you to run it.
Only complaint about the bike. As I said, I saw one this weekend and I think I need one.
any pics?
If you are smart about your wheel build, the weight difference should be negligable. Spoke length isn't incredibly longer, hubs, we covered that, there are plenty of light options, rims and spoke nipples cancel out. No way your 150 wheel should weigh any more than 30 grams more than your 135 wheel. If you think about it, on the 150 hub, the only thing that grows is the center section of the hub and there is not much meterial in there at all. Its 2 hollow sections basically..
Dave
What do you mean? You can't find 150 hubs or 83mm cranks to buy? Call your LBS, they exist and in many flavors.
Dave
Approx 10mm less on the virtual TT. You can slide your seat back to compensate no problem. I run a straight post on mine with the seat back.
Dave
I gotcha. There are a bunch of options available now for cranks, Several makers have lightweight integrated setups if thats your thing.
Personally I am still partial to the FSA ISIS Afterburner DH setup. Its light, works well. I've messed up a LOT of external bearing and ISIS cranks. In the end I'm not sure that ISIS or some integrated setup really have a lot of advantages over one another. Thats just my take.
Dave
With sizing and geometry I am guessing depending on stem/seat choice:
15-5'6" or shorter
17-5'6-5'10"
19-5'10" or larger
I'm around 5'10-11" and I like my current all mtn bike which is a medium/17", geometry feels perfect with straight post, 70mm 0 stem, 23.4" eff TT, medium riser bars, and 44.45" WB.
I guess that would make a L/19" with straight post 50mm about the same in a 6point8
15-5'6" or shorter
17-5'6-5'10"
19-5'10" or larger
I'm around 5'10-11" and I like my current all mtn bike which is a medium/17", geometry feels perfect with straight post, 70mm 0 stem, 23.4" eff TT, medium riser bars, and 44.45" WB.
I guess that would make a L/19" with straight post 50mm about the same in a 6point8
It is an advantage when all your bikes are 150mm.
I am missing your point on the "outboard systems" and the bike comes with a 12mm vertical dropout.
Dave
well FSA, Shimano, Raceface all can be bought with the outboard bb in 83mm.
yea i'd rather have my rear wheel bolted on.
do you take off your rear wheel a lot?
Yup, vertical 12mm dropouts, same as on the 7POINT since '05, same as Intense used on the M1 for years. You can use an aluminum bolt-on axle or a QR. The bikes ship with an aluminum bolt-on axle beacuase it was lighter than the QR.
Outboard BBs are readily available, and almost every major manufacturer is offereng an all mountain/ lightweight version for 07.
Dave
Only heavier DH style cranks though, certainly not needed on a 6point. Heck people are complaining that they can't run XTs on DH bikes for the same reason (frame has an 83mm bb). Several pros (Graves, for one) run special 'trail' cranks made to run on the 83mm bb. Look at all the older pro DH bikes that ran older XTR .
Both of these are heavy duty use frames. A full on DH bike and an abuse minded FR bike. In both cases, strength is much more important than weight or convenience. This is not so for an 'all mt' bike like the 6 point.
You cannot get XTs, or LXs, or Hone, or atlas (the MOST popular cranks), or afterburners, or v-drives (gaps possible but listed as 50mm chainline). No truvativ 'external' (what they call gxp), only the Howitzer team bb is available in 83mm and that bb weighs 365grams, a true DH bb.
So the point is that the 83mm bb religates you to a heavy duty DH crank set up, that is rediculous on that bike!!
Bolt on hubs are great..but a 150mm hub is a solution, needed only for the 83mm bb that, as stated above is a bad choice.
73/135 would have made MUCH more sense for this type of bike.
Dave P, I hear what you are saying, but the fact is that I have a 6POINT sitting right here, 31 lbs and not trying to save weight. (Lyrik, FSA, DHX Air, 721's, DRS, flat pedals)
Like I said earlier:
1) expect lightweight 83mm crank offerings from major drivetrain builders for 07.
2) The bike uses the rear end and forgings from a 7POINT, which coincidentally is an 83mm bike.
The Type 6 prototypes were all 73/135, and future all-mountain bike designs may be, but for this model, that was not an option, and honesly as someone who has actually ridden both bikes extensively, it hasn't held the 6POINT back in the least on the trail. Its 15mm, 5/8 of an inch roughly, 35-60 grams max. How much it affects you personally may differ, but for me it's working great.
Dave
Like I said earlier:
1) expect lightweight 83mm crank offerings from major drivetrain builders for 07.
2) The bike uses the rear end and forgings from a 7POINT, which coincidentally is an 83mm bike.
The Type 6 prototypes were all 73/135, and future all-mountain bike designs may be, but for this model, that was not an option, and honesly as someone who has actually ridden both bikes extensively, it hasn't held the 6POINT back in the least on the trail. Its 15mm, 5/8 of an inch roughly, 35-60 grams max. How much it affects you personally may differ, but for me it's working great.
Dave
Do you really go through BB's that fast? How much do you weigh? I have run FSA ISIS BBs for a while and really I have had no major problems other than general wear and tear. I've had just as many issues with external BB cranks myself. Thats me though. When my stuff starts to get worn or whatever, I buy new parts. Who knows.
Dave
The only 83mm option I see on that list, for howitzers, is the Howitzer Team.
We need to stop bitching about companies switching to 83/150 design and start bitching about why Shimano doesn't make an XT crankset with an 83mm bb.
I wish so badly I wasn't a student working for no money at an internship. I want to go work at an IH dealer so I can order one! It's the perfect all around bike.
enjoy being a student. revel in the cheap beer and plentiful coeds.
i'm considering a 6 point for next year, and i'm on the fence regarding the 83 mm BB issue.
i'm not too worried about running an Isis BB / lightish cranks, because even if it only lasts a year, by then there'll probably be some 83 mm external bearing cranks (XT hopefully) available, at which point i'd make the switch.
but for a bike that will get pedalled a lot (3 or 4,000 v ft climbs) to get to the goods, i'd prefer a normal Q factor and 170 mm crank length. and since i want a relatively low BB (which i think the 6 point has, right?) for good cornering, with those 170 mm cranks i'd expect pedal strikes. mebbe i can compensate by getting narrower pedals.
i'm not too worried about running an Isis BB / lightish cranks, because even if it only lasts a year, by then there'll probably be some 83 mm external bearing cranks (XT hopefully) available, at which point i'd make the switch.
but for a bike that will get pedalled a lot (3 or 4,000 v ft climbs) to get to the goods, i'd prefer a normal Q factor and 170 mm crank length. and since i want a relatively low BB (which i think the 6 point has, right?) for good cornering, with those 170 mm cranks i'd expect pedal strikes. mebbe i can compensate by getting narrower pedals.