Kowa Forks?
- Thread starter weimie
- Start date
Looks nice man!!!! Good luck with the sales!!!!!Team bike pics...
Enjoy.
Hey CovicRacing...according to your website, looks like you guys are local (at least to me). Will you be at any of the MSC races with the forks so people can see them?
Yes, we plan to attend most if not all of the MSC gravity events. Probably hit the G3 series and the closer (to us) Nationals also (Park City, Snowmass). If you go look us up, I'd be happy to hook you up with a demo...
Thanks,
L
LFB
Guest
A one week turn-around from Japan is good. That's about the normal time to ship goods to the US; so with that time frame, they're reacting as quickly as they can.
As I mentioned, I didn't think it was Kowa. Even though THE was local for me, and TH actually lived down the street, they simply couldn't get their act togeter.
I'm glad to see that someone is picking up the ball with Kowa in the US. Kowa has always made top-shelf product, and I expect that they could be a real player in the US. Hopefully, you'll help them.
LFB,
Thanks for the vote of confidence!
I cant speak to what went down 5-6 yrs back between Kowa and THE. All I know is (now in 2007) Kowa is super motivated to get back into this market and will do whatever it takes to succeed.
The guys at Kowa and I have been in almost daily discussions for the past 8+months just to make sure we had all our ducks in a row before we pulled the trigger this time. All we need to do now is get the word out.
Thanks,
Hello everyone,
We will be at the Chalk Creek Stampede (MSC#1) race this weekend. If you plan to attend, feel free to stop by and check out the forks first hand. We'll be sporting the blue EZ-up with the KOWA banner.
See you there!
We will be at the Chalk Creek Stampede (MSC#1) race this weekend. If you plan to attend, feel free to stop by and check out the forks first hand. We'll be sporting the blue EZ-up with the KOWA banner.
See you there!
...how about a decent 20mm TA 29er fork?
Ironically you are not the first to suggest this. It has been suggested to Kowa as a future project, but I do not know how quickly they are planning to implement....how about a decent 20mm TA 29er fork?
I am not really plugged into the 29er world, what kind of demand do you think there would be for a Thru-axle 29er fork? If its attractive enough, I am sure I can light a fire under their arses to release a product like this.
Thanks,
What kind of damping system is in there?
Shim-controlled compression piston(s)?
Is rebound a simple bleed or also controlled by shims?
Can you put different shims in for different characteristics?
Low speed vs. high speed damping characteristics?
Close cartridge or fully open bath?
If not open bath, how is it lubricated?
Etc.
These are the types of questions people want to know.
Shim-controlled compression piston(s)?
Is rebound a simple bleed or also controlled by shims?
Can you put different shims in for different characteristics?
Low speed vs. high speed damping characteristics?
Close cartridge or fully open bath?
If not open bath, how is it lubricated?
Etc.
These are the types of questions people want to know.
...probably the MOST sought after piece in the current marketplace. Frames/ tires are finally catching up & now forks are lagging behind. Try posting a thread on the 29er board of MTBR & poll for interest there.
Thanks for the suggestion, I will do this. I am going over to Japan next month, if this turns out to be hot I will happily propose a 29er fork to them!
Thanks,
I believe that some of you don't get over to MTBR, where there is a similar thread to this one. I had the opportunity to meet Joe Covic yesterday, and check out his goods. Here is a copy of the post I recently wrote there:
Yesterday afternoon I had the opportunity to meet with Joe Covic at his home, to check out some Kowa forks. Joe had two of the forks installed on bikes; the 160SS air freeride single crown mounted on a Nicolai UFO DS, and the 180 dual crown mounted on a trek session 7 [or 77, I didnt notice which]. I focused most of my time on the 160 single crown during the brief visit. If youve been following this thread, Im going to avoid rehashing previously discussed material, and simply report my observations. This was a brief meeting of no more than 30 minutes, and I only rode the bikes around in the driveway and street, so I dont have any idea how that performance will translate to real riding, nor will I speculate so. We didnt disassemble the forks to reveal the innards, or look over any schematic drawings. This is just pure parking lot test observations. I brought my RFX with me, which has a 66SL ATA on it, for comparison purposes. In no particular order:
Overall appearance: The lower casting appears and feels beefy; as much or more than my 66. The stanchions have that kashima coating on them, which apparently is being widely used in the MX industry, to provide smooth operations between moving parts. The coating was evenly applied, and the action was smooth. More on that below. The crown was simple.
Adjustments: On the bottom of the right leg was a rebound adjuster. It is very effective, with a wide range. On the bottom of the left leg is a shraeder valve for the air spring. I do not know if there is a negative air spring that is filled along with the positive, but more on that below. I adjusted the air pressure to about 80 pounds for my 180 pounds.
On the top of the left leg is the travel adjuster. I do not have any idea how it works, so dont ask me. But it is slick. You turn the top cap knob 180 degrees, and it unlocks the adjuster, then you simply grab the lowers and uppers, and slide them to your desired travel. In this state, the air spring is neutralized; there is no resistance from the air spring whatsoever. I dont know how that happens, but it is trick. This also gave me the opportunity to feel the sliding action of the fork unhindered, and its real smooth. Anyway, slide the fork to where you want it, turn the knob back 180 degrees to its previous position, and youre ready to go. This is not an on the fly adjustment. Also, there are no travel markings on the stanchions, so you either guess at the position, or you measure it with a scale to set it where you want it.
Although the fork will extend to 170mm, that is not a setting you can used, the fork tops out at a hard stop at that setting; it needs to be set no higher than 160mm so that there is a soft top out. And yes, the fork can be set all the way down to zero, if you wanted to. I played around on it at settings between 160 and 130mm.
The feel: Real nice; the kashima coating must be real slick. Absolutely no stiction that one would associate with an air fork, it is so much smoother than my 66SL, which has honed bushings, and is well broken in. The feel of the compression and rebound stroke is real nice. These days, manufacturers are striving to get that coil fork feeling in an air fork, and this fork has gotten the closest yet of forks that Ive tried, including the 06 and 07 66SL, and the totem solo air. It felt great. It blatantly showed me that I needed to tune my 66 a little better; it felt crappy by comparison [ later in the evening, I did just so, and improved it by speeding up my rebound, but it still didnt come close to the kowa].
The fork feels somewhat linear in the first half of the compression stroke, then it ramps up noticeably later in the stroke, but much earlier than either of my 66 sls ever did. Id like to see how that ramp up feels on drops and jumps; that opportunity didnt present itself yesterday.
Stiffness: Im not even going to try to comment on this, because a parking lot test wont reveal any info about it.
Axle to crown measurement: Setting both forks at 150mm of stanchion showing, I twice measured this with a tape measure. The kowa was longer by .25 and .375 inches, so somewhere in between those to numbers is the real difference. Where I think that length comes from is the crown. It doesnt have a similar design as the 66 crown, to minimize the a/c height. The kowa crown has more drop to it.
Overall, I liked this fork. The longer A to C measurement is a little bummer to me. The wide range of the travel adjustment, and the ease of it, rocks. The guessing at how much travel youve set the fork for without measuring it is a minor peeve. The quality of the stroke of the fork was a big positive.
The 180 dual crown coil sprung fork. I spent a few minutes on this fork/bike. It felt really good. Sorry, I have no more feedback for you there.
Yesterday afternoon I had the opportunity to meet with Joe Covic at his home, to check out some Kowa forks. Joe had two of the forks installed on bikes; the 160SS air freeride single crown mounted on a Nicolai UFO DS, and the 180 dual crown mounted on a trek session 7 [or 77, I didnt notice which]. I focused most of my time on the 160 single crown during the brief visit. If youve been following this thread, Im going to avoid rehashing previously discussed material, and simply report my observations. This was a brief meeting of no more than 30 minutes, and I only rode the bikes around in the driveway and street, so I dont have any idea how that performance will translate to real riding, nor will I speculate so. We didnt disassemble the forks to reveal the innards, or look over any schematic drawings. This is just pure parking lot test observations. I brought my RFX with me, which has a 66SL ATA on it, for comparison purposes. In no particular order:
Overall appearance: The lower casting appears and feels beefy; as much or more than my 66. The stanchions have that kashima coating on them, which apparently is being widely used in the MX industry, to provide smooth operations between moving parts. The coating was evenly applied, and the action was smooth. More on that below. The crown was simple.
Adjustments: On the bottom of the right leg was a rebound adjuster. It is very effective, with a wide range. On the bottom of the left leg is a shraeder valve for the air spring. I do not know if there is a negative air spring that is filled along with the positive, but more on that below. I adjusted the air pressure to about 80 pounds for my 180 pounds.
On the top of the left leg is the travel adjuster. I do not have any idea how it works, so dont ask me. But it is slick. You turn the top cap knob 180 degrees, and it unlocks the adjuster, then you simply grab the lowers and uppers, and slide them to your desired travel. In this state, the air spring is neutralized; there is no resistance from the air spring whatsoever. I dont know how that happens, but it is trick. This also gave me the opportunity to feel the sliding action of the fork unhindered, and its real smooth. Anyway, slide the fork to where you want it, turn the knob back 180 degrees to its previous position, and youre ready to go. This is not an on the fly adjustment. Also, there are no travel markings on the stanchions, so you either guess at the position, or you measure it with a scale to set it where you want it.
Although the fork will extend to 170mm, that is not a setting you can used, the fork tops out at a hard stop at that setting; it needs to be set no higher than 160mm so that there is a soft top out. And yes, the fork can be set all the way down to zero, if you wanted to. I played around on it at settings between 160 and 130mm.
The feel: Real nice; the kashima coating must be real slick. Absolutely no stiction that one would associate with an air fork, it is so much smoother than my 66SL, which has honed bushings, and is well broken in. The feel of the compression and rebound stroke is real nice. These days, manufacturers are striving to get that coil fork feeling in an air fork, and this fork has gotten the closest yet of forks that Ive tried, including the 06 and 07 66SL, and the totem solo air. It felt great. It blatantly showed me that I needed to tune my 66 a little better; it felt crappy by comparison [ later in the evening, I did just so, and improved it by speeding up my rebound, but it still didnt come close to the kowa].
The fork feels somewhat linear in the first half of the compression stroke, then it ramps up noticeably later in the stroke, but much earlier than either of my 66 sls ever did. Id like to see how that ramp up feels on drops and jumps; that opportunity didnt present itself yesterday.
Stiffness: Im not even going to try to comment on this, because a parking lot test wont reveal any info about it.
Axle to crown measurement: Setting both forks at 150mm of stanchion showing, I twice measured this with a tape measure. The kowa was longer by .25 and .375 inches, so somewhere in between those to numbers is the real difference. Where I think that length comes from is the crown. It doesnt have a similar design as the 66 crown, to minimize the a/c height. The kowa crown has more drop to it.
Overall, I liked this fork. The longer A to C measurement is a little bummer to me. The wide range of the travel adjustment, and the ease of it, rocks. The guessing at how much travel youve set the fork for without measuring it is a minor peeve. The quality of the stroke of the fork was a big positive.
The 180 dual crown coil sprung fork. I spent a few minutes on this fork/bike. It felt really good. Sorry, I have no more feedback for you there.
29'r thru-axle would be so nice.
Renny - what is the comprrssion damping on this fork? Brake dive?
Added a2c would not be bad it it cleard the downtube on my small frame without the use of the 4mm Ventana crown race.
Renny - what is the comprrssion damping on this fork? Brake dive?
Added a2c would not be bad it it cleard the downtube on my small frame without the use of the 4mm Ventana crown race.
SS, as I mentioned, there is no compression adjuster. Actually Jayem has looked at some schematics of the damping system, so maybe he can comment on it. What I can say is the stroke of both the compression the rebound feels.....moto-like. A feel that I have not been able to duplicate on either of my 66's. Brake dive is something I would have to simulate on a trail; I was on a flat driveway, sorry.
Yea, I could live with a taller A2C; it just means I have a little less travel at that A2C setting. If the quality of the travel is good at that setting, the point is moot to me.
the answer to these questions is "KASHIMA". seriously, however, i'm interested in the meaning of the term:
http://dict.regex.info/cgi-bin/j-e/sjis/S=48/FG=b/inline/nocolor/dosearch?sDict=on&H=PS&L=J&T=kashima&WC=none
dict.regex.info said:
one very positive thing, is you get really good travel, plush an all, at the expense of really low weight, unlike the 66, which is heavier
these forks have always interested me, sadly enough I live in Chile, so there are no chances I get my hands on any of them unless I buy one, guys keep up the work and have some reviews posted up, don't you have a 200 mm racing fork?
have ballpark prices been posted anywhere? Especially for the DC
Hey Renegade,
Thanks for the nice review. As I said, its always nice to show the forks in person as they do really speak for themselves (in appearance, performance and quality). Let me know if you ever want to try one out on a real trail, I am sure I can arrainge a demo fork for you for a few days. Just let me know, you know my number!
Thanks,
Hey Toshi,
Not quite sure of the "real" meaning of the term "Kashima"(as I am not Japanese), but the way it was explained to me was that it is essentially a high tolerence Hard Coat Anodize similar to a MIL Spec. They just use the fancy name to differentiate it from other coatings.
Joe, E-mail sent! I'll call you too.
Hi Joe, I too stopped by to check out the forks at the Nathrop/MSC. My first impression was these are some burly forks, and have a ton of adustability. However, I didn't get to ride any since I had a camera strapped around my neck.
After seeing these in person, I think some better pictures could really illustrate just how impressive and beefy looking these forks are. I didn't exactly get that impression from the pictures in the marketing material on this thread, but would be happy to help with some photography. Just pm me....
After seeing these in person, I think some better pictures could really illustrate just how impressive and beefy looking these forks are. I didn't exactly get that impression from the pictures in the marketing material on this thread, but would be happy to help with some photography. Just pm me....
I agree: the pics on the website do not do the forks justice.
Yeah I know, I really need to get my website up to snuff. I am thinking of just plunking down the cash to get this professionally done. Anyone, know of any good, cheap web designers out there?
Thanks,
Doesn't mean anything Toshi, just a brand name like Teflon. Can also be translated as "Deer Island" if you like.
BTW- best Japanese-English/English-Japanese translation tool I know is here
www.alc.co.jp
Nice! I will be travelling to Japan in June. I think this will come in handy!
Thanks!
Got mine today.
5.34 pounds out of the box.
Will have it installed tonight and have a 3 riding day weekend this weekend so should have a good review by monday.
We just replaced our stolen cameras so before I install it tonight I will get familiar with the owners manuals and get some pictures.
5.34 pounds out of the box.
Will have it installed tonight and have a 3 riding day weekend this weekend so should have a good review by monday.
We just replaced our stolen cameras so before I install it tonight I will get familiar with the owners manuals and get some pictures.
the new 200Sx would be my new fork if it wasnt so expensive compared to others out there.