[LordOpie]

Dude, you're an asshat. And you're not even making a point with your asshattery.

What, exactly, does a handful of bad cops in Chicago have to do with either of the cases that you've brought this up in?

I think RR is suggesting that the cops in NY won't completely tell the truth of this situation. He's saying that cops refuse to rat on other cops and referenced a former assistant U.S. attorney who investigated 18 CASES where he was stonewalled.

18 is pretty substantial and is more than just a handful of cops.

I suspect nearly all cops are decent people, but by keeping silent, they're accessories to crimes and that's intolerable.

 

[Echo]

I think RR is suggesting that the cops in NY won't completely tell the truth of this situation. He's saying that cops refuse to rat on other cops and referenced a former assistant U.S. attorney who investigated 18 CASES where he was stonewalled.

18 is pretty substantial and is more than just a handful of cops.

I suspect nearly all cops are decent people, but by keeping silent, they're accessories to crimes and that's intolerable.

I don't see how that warrants him being a dick to manimal, who happens to be one of the nicest and most helpful people on the forum.

 

[RenegadeRick]

I don't see how that warrants him being a dick to manimal, who happens to be one of the nicest and most helpful people on the forum.

I love manimal. His kid is the coolest. It is totally not personal.

 

[binary visions]

I don't see how that warrants him being a dick to manimal, who happens to be one of the nicest and most helpful people on the forum.

RR is generally an obstinant prick in many of these discussions and doesn't seem to get that you can have a productive discussion and back your points up without being a jerk about it.

Just like when he brought it up in the last thread and tried to call out manimal by issuing that nasty challange to "prove him wrong" about it.

edit: RR, it totally is personal when you can't figure out how to participate in these discussions without aggressively attacking someone.

 

[LordOpie]

I don't see how that warrants him being a dick to manimal, who happens to be one of the nicest and most helpful people on the forum.

oh, missed that... personal attacks are so common that they start to become background noise.

Like dhracist calling me names, just seemed so natural

 

[MMike]

oh, missed that... personal attacks are so common that they start to become background noise.

Like dhracist calling me names, just seemed so natural

you dirty jew

 

[LordOpie]

you dirty jew

hawt!

 

[Changleen]

you dirty jew

I like 'soap bar'. :biggrin: Opie says he is invulnerable to 'kike' too.

 

[LordOpie]

I like 'soap bar'. :biggrin: Opie says he is invulnerable to 'kike' too.

When you curse, you know I have to wash your mouth out with my soap bar.

 

[MMike]

hawt!

 

[RenegadeRick]

edit: RR, it totally is personal when you can't figure out how to participate in these discussions without aggressively attacking someone.

Oops! My bad! Would it be wrong of me to say that you are obviously correct since you are the voice of reason?
I can't help but poke fun at people sometimes, but then I include a happy little smiley and hope that everyone knows I am just kidding.

I selected the smiley since I would totally buy manimal (or any of you) a beer if I ever get the chance. I think that all of you are lots of fun and I have learned much in my time here. I am truly appreciative. If I say something that offends you, I am probably joking. Please don't take it seriously.

Oh, and before you think I have completely wussed out, I was attacking DHBuilder with the "waiting, and waiting" comment. I can't wait to see the facts he has to back up his statement.

 

[manimal]

See? The blue wall of silence is real.
Care to threaten me with violence again manimal?

i never said it didn't exist, just that i've never seen it and know that my friends wouldn't risk their job over me and visa versa.

...and the threat of a "swift kick in the nuts" is as violent as a titty twister, if i were to threaten you with violence it wouldn't be in this forum


on a different note. i think that all police, nationwide, should go on strike for 1 week and then see how the public views our duties afterwards. when all those people who "sleep peacably in their beds" are suddenly faced with impending violence that is normally kept at bay by "those ready to do violence on their behalf"; perhaps then, will people realize why we do things the way we do. it's a "damned if you do, damned if you don't" kind of job that the majority of the population has no understanding of.

 

[RenegadeRick]

on a different note. i think that all police, nationwide, should go on strike for 1 week and then see how the public views our duties afterwards.

I like your idea, but I suggest that a week would not be long enough.

All kinds of chaos would break out for a week due to the novelty of no police, but I believe it would return to business as usual as soon as the police come back.

With a lengthier hiatus, most criminals will be killed off by a population forced to defend itself, and their genetic material will have been removed from the gene pool. This will allow us peaceable types to enjoy the freedom our forefathers imagined.

Please take note of the lack of smileys in this post.

If you would like a bit of somewhat on-topic humor, you can click here.

 

[Jeremy R]

.

Please take note of the lack of smileys in this post.

You would not be able to see the smileys anyway because of the blinding ignorance.

 

[ALEXIS_DH]

I like 'soap bar'. :biggrin: Opie says he is invulnerable to 'kike' too.

lol.
i have a jewish cousin whose nickname is "kike", which is short for "enrique". everybody calls him kike, even at work "dr. kike!". amusing.

 

[Secret Squirrel]

lol.
i have a jewish cousin whose nickname is "kike", which is short for "enrique". everybody calls him kike, even at work "dr. kike!". amusing.

Heh...An oboe teacher that my wife studied with had a license plate on his car that was custom. He's Portugese and the plate said "fodase". Once a valet came up to him at a restaurant...they said, "Mr. Fodase, I can park that for you." My wife (who knows Portugese) just about died laughing....good times...good times...

 

[lugnuts]

I like your idea, but I suggest that a week would not be long enough.

All kinds of chaos would break out for a week due to the novelty of no police, but I believe it would return to business as usual as soon as the police come back.

With a lengthier hiatus, most criminals will be killed off by a population forced to defend itself, and their genetic material will have been removed from the gene pool. This will allow us peaceable types to enjoy the freedom our forefathers imagined.

Please take note of the lack of smileys in this post.

If you would like a bit of somewhat on-topic humor, you can click here.

I'll bite.

I agree that it should be longer only on the pretense that us more violent types would easily kill off all you peacable types (hello? you are peacable types, no?). Then the wussies would be removed from the gene pool and we could have a chance at a kick ass future like Biff would have given us in Back To The Future 2.

 

[blue]

In addition to my original post:

If the cops didn't identify themselves, they should not be treated as police officers in this situation, they should be treated as civilians and booked into jail for homicide.

 

[escapeartist]

In addition to my original post:

If the cops didn't identify themselves, they should not be treated as police officers in this situation, they should be treated as civilians and booked into jail for homicide.

Thats an interesting idea.

 

[JRogers]

Would an undercover officer who had just identified himself as such be justified in unloading into a moving vehicle that was trying to run him over? i sure hope so.

Oddly enough, they are not justified according to NYPD regulations: "officers can fire only when they or another person is threatened by deadly physical force, but not if that physical force comes from a moving vehicle alone."

 

[LordOpie]

I stand by my assertion that a cop should take no action to protect his own life if those actions directly put innocent bystanders in danger.

And two of these cops certainly sound like they were not concerned with anyone but themselves.

 

[Reactor]

Oddly enough, they are not justified according to NYPD regulations: "officers can fire only when they or another person is threatened by deadly physical force, but not if that physical force comes from a moving vehicle alone."

Maricopa County DA put Chandler officer Dan Lovelace of trial for murder after he shot into a moving vehicle. He claimed it tried to run him over, while the evidence showed he shot the occupant from just behind and five feet to the side of the car and was never in any real danger. He managed to sow the seeds of reasonable doubt but lost his peace officer certification.

 

[lugnuts]

I stand by my assertion that a cop should take no action to protect his own life if those actions directly put innocent bystanders in danger.

By this logic, all a bad guy has to do is make sure that he breaks the law in public places? If a cop confronts him, he could just start shooting, right? I mean the cop can't shoot back?
Wow, imagine what a real sicko could do at, say, a parade. All those cops surrounded by all those innocent bystanders. It'd be like shooting fish in a barrel.

But hey, that would have prevented this tragic death in NY, so you do have a point.

 

[JohnE]

By this logic, all a bad guy has to do is make sure that he breaks the law in public places? If a cop confronts him, he could just start shooting, right? I mean the cop can't shoot back?
Wow, imagine what a real sicko could do at, say, a parade. All those cops surrounded by all those innocent bystanders. It'd be like shooting fish in a barrel.

But hey, that would have prevented this tragic death in NY, so you do have a point.

Or a mall. But assume the Weaver ready stance, and all will be right with the world...

 

[BMXman]

All I have to say is much respect to Manimal....one of the few who has "real world" expereince and views...some of you in this thread...I just don't know where you came from or where you lived but.....just amazing is all I can say...D

 

[LordOpie]

By this logic, all a bad guy has to do is make sure that he breaks the law in public places? If a cop confronts him, he could just start shooting, right? I mean the cop can't shoot back?
Wow, imagine what a real sicko could do at, say, a parade. All those cops surrounded by all those innocent bystanders. It'd be like shooting fish in a barrel.

But hey, that would have prevented this tragic death in NY, so you do have a point.

so then it's ok for cops to shoot innocent bystanders?

Glad we got that cleared up.

 

[lugnuts]

so then it's ok for cops to shoot innocent bystanders?

Glad we got that cleared up.

Intentionally? no (duh).

But I think we can trust the typical cop to use his best judgement when to engage and when not to. They do have training for that sort of thing. Of course, tragic accidents will happen. And sometimes there will be completely f**ked up situations like this one. But to limit their abilities the way you would prefer would be to take away a lot of their power.

And correct me if I'm wrong, but in this situation there weren't actually any innocent bystanders hurt, were there? I mean other than the ones they were aiming at.

 

[jimmydean]

There were nearby houses that were struck with gunfire, but no reported injury. I'm not saying it was ok to shoot or not in that situation, but I would think 50 rounds is a bit much in any case. Even if they had a gun, 50 rounds is on the etreme end of things.

 

[LordOpie]

That's really the point... 50??!!

Sounds like someone panicked and was more concerned about their life than ANYone elses.

 

[lugnuts]

that is something I can agree with.

 

[RenegadeRick]

http://prisonplanet.com/articles/december2006/051206_b_Survivors.htm
Survivors Dispute NYPD Account of Queens Shooting

AP
Tuesday, December 5, 2006

One of two men wounded in the hail of 50 police bullets that killed their unarmed friend following a bachelor party has for the first time publicly disputed the police version of the incident.

In an interview Tuesday at a Queens hospital, Trent Benefield was asked if it was true that a fourth companion, possibly armed, fled the scene of the Nov. 25 shooting outside a Queens strip club.

"No,'' he said in a soft voice. "No fourth man.''

Benefield, 23, who was shot three times in the legs, was released from the hospital on Tuesday and was scheduled to meet with the Rev. Al Sharpton, according to Sharpton's office.

"My friend's dead,'' Benefield said in an interview with NY1. "I'm shot up. We need justice.''

Lawyers for Benefield and the still-hospitalized Joseph Guzman, 31, say both men also have claimed that none of the five undercover and plainclothes officers identified themselves as police before opening fire. The barrage of bullets killed 23-year-old Sean Bell on the morning of his wedding.

The officers "never'' identified themselves, Guzman said, speaking from his bed at Mary Immaculate Hospital in a separate interview published Tuesday by the New York Daily News.

About Bell, Guzman said, "I took 16 shots, but a superstar died that night. I loved him.''

Guzman also called on New Yorkers outraged by the shooting to exercise restraint.

"No violence, man,'' he said. "No violence. Not in my name.''

Police have said an undercover officer -- part of a team investigating the club for prostitution and drugs -- began following Bell and his friends to their car after overhearing Guzman threaten to retrieve a gun in a dispute with another man.

As the car started to pull away, it bumped the officer and then smashed into an unmarked police van, police said.

Through his lawyer, the undercover officer has insisted he believed Guzman was pulling a gun when he opened fire on the car; no gun was found. He and other witnesses also have said there was a fourth man in or near the car who escaped on foot.

The five officers have been put on paid administrative leave pending the outcome of a grand jury investigation by the Queens district attorney's office.

shall we start this one up again?

 

[Secret Squirrel]

Let's see if I can hit a home run on my first try....

The cops in this case were sooooo justified. Take as many shots as possible is what I say. When else can you get that kind of field training. I mean really, where are you going to find a car with actual real live people in it with a potential weapon that you can try shooting at. Once in a lifetime opportunity. Who cares if you don't identify yourself, you're on a sting!! You could be killed by the Russian Mob at any moment. Besides, a bunch of really drunk happy guys who are partying shouldn't be allowed to have a better time than you. Yeah!! Kill 'em all I say......







lthumbsdown: lthumbsdown: lthumbsdown:

 

[LordOpie]

Black people are statistically far more likely to be in the act of crime and are more likely to be packing 9s. The police had to be sure the situation was contained and the easiest way to do that is to put a cap in the black man's ass.

 

[Secret Squirrel]

Black people are statistically far more likely to be in the act of crime and are more likely to be packing 9s. The police had to be sure the situation was contained and the easiest way to do that is to put a cap in the black man's ass.

Butt plug?

 

[dhbuilder]

Black people are statistically far more likely to be in the act of crime and are more likely to be packing 9s. The police had to be sure the situation was contained and the easiest way to do that is to put a cap in the black man's ass.

sounds like racist bullsh.. to me

maybe you are getting a grasp of whats out there in the real world after all.

 

[Secret Squirrel]

 

[LordOpie]

maybe you are getting a grasp of whats out there in the real world after all.

So you agree with what I said, huh?



racist.