Manitou?

dropmachine · Jun 27, 2006

The strange thing about Manitou is the forks that shouldn't break do, and the ones that should break don't seem to.

Thier DH forks seem to hold up with little complaint, as do some of the lower travel abuse forks.

Everything else blows up. My new Nixon, dead in under 20 hours. Every Sherman one shop here sold had to go back for warranty. The splice line was the worst thing I've ever seen. I could make better forks with 3 straws and a hockey puck.

As for thier customer service being so good, well.... you ever seen a guy drowning that was a prick to anyone that could help him out?

Transcend · Jun 27, 2006

I should preface: I don't hate manitou or any other manufacturer for that matter.

This weekend at Ste Anne, i think I saw at least 3 dozen blown Travis'. WTF?

I think a major reason for the hate is the current crop of horrendous durability issues?

sayndesyn · Jun 27, 2006

I bought a sherman jumper when it was the only 80mm fork on the market and I must say it is a piece of crap. I continue to ride it, but it's not even worth replacing the blown seals that you will get every other month. And the axle system on it sucks as well...

julian_dh · Jun 27, 2006

a buddy of mines travis blew up when he was at the local mtn.
some type of spring flew off and was chilling inside the fork limiting it to only 5" of travel. got it rebuilt with some moto X fluids and its budda now. but every manitou ive owned i hated with passion, the only good fork from that camp is the 02-03 dorados.

sanjuro · Jun 27, 2006

Stance is a great fork. I have four brand new, never ridden, for sale, each only rebuilt once.

offtheedge · Jun 27, 2006

i loved my 03 breakout........

except for the leaky seals
oh and the stupid axle
and there was that issue with a 1.5 steerer before anyone made a good 1.5 stem
also, the adjustments did nothing

i miss that piece of crap

.:Jeenyus:. · Jun 27, 2006

sayndesyn said:
I bought a sherman jumper when it was the only 80mm fork on the market and I must say it is a piece of crap. I continue to ride it, but it's not even worth replacing the blown seals that you will get every other month. And the axle system on it sucks as well...

Hrm, I rather like my Jumper. My old Breakout +, on the other hand, was complete sh!t.

offtheedge · Jun 27, 2006

Li'l Dave said:
But what about the Boxxer? I've blown every boxxer that I've ever owned at least once, and the customer service at Rockshox has always been terrible. The 2 hour long wait times were always fun, and the person you ended up talking to was always really helpful Manitou has always been quick and helpful when I've needed help. I didn't know about the Travis's blowing up though, I really haven't seen enough of them to actually see it happen.

lightweight bandwagon

Transcend · Jun 27, 2006

See, I've owned quite a few boxxers, and never blown one up besides destroying the base valve in the older plastic incarnation.

Spitfired · Jun 27, 2006

I've so far had a great time with my gold label jumper fork.
I had a black for a while and I didn't have any problems with that either.

snowskilz · Jun 27, 2006

Personally the stiction that my breakout has is enough of a turn off for me.

I did have a dorito for a few months and it was super super butter. I was lucky and it got stolen before i had to have it rebuilt multiple times.

Theres a lot of forks out there to choose from personally your preference determine which fork you would be best with.

Stiff/smooth/reliable = marz
lightweight = boxxer or fox

Granted each and every fork has their issues (40 arch casings, orig 888 casings, boxxers snapping) But over time the most reliable has been marz. Many people will try to object to my point but theres only 3 fork manufactures that have been in the game since suspension forks became popular. Then fox came in many years later.

Now if rs made a bigger stanction stiff as a brick wall fork that had motion control. yum. oh wait marz is making the triple 8 air for next year

konabiker · Jun 27, 2006

Li'l Dave said:
But what about the Boxxer? I've blown every boxxer that I've ever owned at least once, and the customer service at Rockshox has always been terrible. The 2 hour long wait times were always fun, and the person you ended up talking to was always really helpful Manitou has always been quick and helpful when I've needed help. I didn't know about the Travis's blowing up though, I really haven't seen enough of them to actually see it happen.

The best fork I have ever owned was a 04(I think) TPC+ Sherman Slider. That thing was boss. I like Manitou, just seems they've had a lot of problems as of late. All the Travis' I've ridden have been blown or just dudu feeling. As for RS, Dave, the new stuff is really killer. The RS of old is for sure gone, even the CS is pretty good lately. You've had to deal with the end of the company a lot more than me, though. I wish Manitou would just turn my TPC+ Sherman into a travis like fork.

Let's go ride when you get that shock fixed.

konabiker · Jun 27, 2006

As a side note I would just like to say FYCK Marzdookey.

Zark · Jun 27, 2006

Dave, did you love your Dorado when it was puking oil all over the trail and your brake rotor?

You have a Fox 40 that works great, will you cut the "upgrade" crap out for at least 6 months? :rofl:

As for Manitou..... :dead:

sriracha · Jun 27, 2006

konabiker said:
As a side note I would just like to say FYCK Marzdookey.

now, now...we'll have none of that.

if you've ever rebuilt a manitou, you'll notice a lot of plastic parts...i am not down with plastic forks. i've never ridden manitou because of the plastic internals, but a friend of mine had a brand new manitou blow up in his face, 4 miles down the porcupine rim descent. oil spewed all over, the fork overheated and locked up. with 6 miles of downhill left, he was forced to ride with a ridgid fork.

DIRTWRKS · Jun 27, 2006

Transcend said:
I should preface: I don't hate manitou or any other manufacturer for that matter.

This weekend at Ste Anne, i think I saw at least 3 dozen blown Travis'. WTF?

I think a major reason for the hate is the current crop of horrendous durability issues?

Wow ! there were only about 12 guys riding a Travis in the entire World Cup field and I only know of one " on our team" that blew a seal, it was repaired in 30 minutes and the rider went on to complete his race. Other than that I have seen some cracked lowers around the pinch bolts similar to the problems the 888 had in it's first year.

I think that that these issues will be resolved for 2007 models and is not uncommon with first year models.

Transcend · Jun 27, 2006

DIRTWRKS said:
Wow ! there were only about 12 guys riding a Travis in the entire World Cup field and I only know of one " on our team" that blew a seal, it was repaired in 30 minutes and the rider went on to complete his race. Other than that I have seen some cracked lowers around the pinch bolts similar to the problems the 888 had in it's first year.

I think that that these issues will be resolved for 2007 models and is not uncommon with first year models.

If you had seen even half of the blown travis' I have in the last few weeks, you would change your tune pretty quickly. Just because you haven't seen them break doesn't mean it isn't happening.

I know of a few riders who have gone through MULTIPLE forks in one weekend (both 7 and 8 inch models). Now add to this the fact that manitou has no support at events save for one tech at the World Cups, and you have a MAJOR problem.

edit: out of 168 or so men and 35+ women...there were many more than 12 people riding Travis'.

SirChomps-a-Lot · Jun 27, 2006

konabiker said:
The best fork I have ever owned was a 04(I think) TPC+ Sherman Slider. That thing was boss.

Like this?

mmmmm, tasty.

DIRTWRKS · Jun 27, 2006

Transcend said:
If you had seen even half of the blown travis' I have in the last few weeks, you would change your tune pretty quickly. Just because you haven't seen them break doesn't mean it isn't happening.

I know of a few riders who have gone through MULTIPLE forks in one weekend (both 7 and 8 inch models). Now add to this the fact that manitou has no support at events save for one tech at the World Cups, and you have a MAJOR problem.

edit: out of 168 or so men and 35+ women...there were many more than 12 people riding Travis'.

Hey Fraser, OK I was referring only to this weekend and I did not see that occur with the 12 or so riders that I know were on a Travis. Also there may have been more than a dozen riders but not three dozen for sure.

OGRipper · Jun 27, 2006

My highly scientific analysis is that every manitou I've ridden in the last five years has felt like poo.

Seriously, I have always like the Manitou chassis, even the hex axles, but in my opinion the internals got way off track with SPV and they have never recovered. They need to solve two nagging issues: Small bump sensitivity and long term durability. Admittedly, I don't have a lot of time on Travis stuff, but enough to not be convinced.

Manitou is the fork I want to love but just can't.

Bikerpunk241 · Jun 27, 2006

I used to be with you on the forks issue, as I'm sure you remember, but lately, I've had really good luck with boxxers and RS support, whereas with Manitou, bad luck around. The thing is, the boxxer is such a simple fork, and now that they have someone backing them that has not just lighweight in mind, they've done a complete 180. Manitou, on the other hand, has given me crappier support lately, and since they started getting the larger part of their forks manufactured by RST, less reliable.

Probably helps you like Manitou in that you have a friend on the inside, no?

Eren · Jun 27, 2006

hmm iver had my 05 breakout plus 4 six months and loive it, nothings gone wrong. . . . yet. .

julian_dh · Jun 27, 2006

Eren said:
hmm iver had my 05 breakout plus 4 six months and loive it, nothings gone wrong. . . . yet. .

just wait for the stiction, then the spv clunk, and then once you send it in to get serviced two rides later its gonna blow up and shoot bushings out the seals and up the stantion :rofl:

sanjuro · Jun 28, 2006

I don't think every Manitou fork is poo. I do think the entire Stance line is garbage, I would avoid the hundreds of OEM Minutes I see for sale on the internet, and I posted a Bicycle Retailer article about Manitou poor quality.

I am sure some forks hold up fine, and I hope people have those forks. I almost bought a Sherman but I decided against it because I wanted to be sure that my fork would not stop me from riding.

The 888 I ended up with has held up without a problem.

bballe336 · Jun 28, 2006

I really like the manitou forks I have ridden. And I really like my TPC+ sherman slider. SPV is crappy but they offer TPC+ cartridges for most of the forks.

vitox · Jun 28, 2006

its their track record, they just havent been able to produce a fork for dh thats on par with the competition since 1998.
some might argue the dorado was up to the challenge against the shiver and the last US made boxxer when it came out in 2002, i dont even think for that year they had a competitive offering as the dorado was more expensive, and utterly unreliable in its first incarnation, after that, the other companies just left manitou behind with all the SPV non working dorado xworks crap.

just to recap on manitou dh forks
98 xvert ti tpc was ok although very flexy
99 xvert carbon same stuff as last year but now zocchi had the monster
00 xvert carbon tpc+ 180mm fork wicked damper, unreal flex and even more lowers cracking. IMO no contest for the 7" boxxer
01 same deal only shiver now is available
02 dorado initial fiasco with foam compensator then retrofitted to IFP and lots of maintenance issues, high price, stupid 30mm stanchions on inverted fork...
03 new even more insanely expensive dorado hard to get for the general public, taiwan boxxer at half the price of dorado....
04 dorado xworks, enough said, at the same time marzocchi comes out with 888 and rockshox has a very reliable boxxer out.

offtheedge · Jun 28, 2006

as said before.........plastic bits

wasn't there a post a few months back about key people leaving Maitou?

Polandspring88 · Jun 28, 2006

Own two Shermans and love em. No problems at all. Owned one for 2+ years and the other for a few months now.

Kevin · Jun 28, 2006

Owned a Manitou Dorado and a Black.
They both blew balls.

Owned a Marzocchi Z1 FR, a Super T and a Shiver DC.
No problems whatsoever, even after pretty hard abuse.

Owned a Vanilla RC and currently on a DHX 5.0, Fox 40 and a Fox SC fork and love m all to death. No issues so far, just good times and Im still blown away about how my 40 handles (after reducing the travel).

Cant say too much about RockShox other then that the newer boXXers seem too be pretty nice.
Ive ridden boXXers but never owned one.

No way Im ever buying a Manitou product again after 2 bad experiances.
Zocchi still makes nice forks as allways and very reliable, but Fox is definitly my cup of tea.

Spunger · Jun 28, 2006

Well I have 2 Shivers (DC and SC) and.........one manitou product (04 Minute 1:00)

When I first got the fork, the rebound knob wouldn't turn, and in hence since I tried to turn it........it broke off. It was a plastic adjuster that went up inside the fork.......so I sent it into Manitou on like a Monday, got it back by Friday (if I remember correctly). New rebound assembly no charge. Since I've installed a X-firm spring setup (firm spring + booster) as it's on my DJ bike. So far it's been fine, it's stiff, light, and haven't had any SPV issues yet.

I think their forks aren't that bad, hell there's some other's out there that are just as bad if not worse. Until I have a major problem with the minute I'll ride it till it busts. That was the idea anyways

Fox and Zocchi still make the higher end/craftsmanship of forks out there. RS and Manitou are sorta similar......nothing really feels high end on their forks. Maybe it's just Fox and Marzocchi have more cool little machined parts and such? I dunno, but when I can get rid of my minute I will and grab something else.

AusRottenVirus · Jun 28, 2006

I am a huge fan of manitou for a couple of reasons. My old Dorado was amazing. It did leak a little bit, but it was a race fork and I expected to have to do more maintence on it. Second, my new Travis feels just as good as my Dorado, and is more stiff. I have ridden the fork hard for quite sometime now and have not had a single problem yet. Also, my Revox rear shock feels great on my M3. I know what feels great to people is a matter of opinion, but I love both my fork and my shock. Lastly, Manitou's customer service has been perfect thus far. I work in a shop and I have seen many blown Manitous (believe me, I know where this whole discussion is coming from) but Manitou has done a superb job dealing with the forks.

Jm_ · Jun 28, 2006

AusRottenVirus said:
but it was a race fork and I expected to have to do more maintence on it

I guess I just like to buy "race" forks that don't need much maint. Current forks blow the dorado away. It only had 170mm of positive travel, small stanchions, and wasn't the stiffest design ever. Good damping system, but poor lubrication. It basically does well in only one of out many catagories. My 66 is 1.5lbs lighter, with the same travel, stiffer, etc...

Work on manitous and then the fox/marzocchi forks. You might notice that some of the fox/marzocchis seem a little more complicated, but they are straightforward and don't use rediculous things like damping rods screwing directly into the lowers (instead of using a footnut). Other rediculous things like bottom out bumpers that crap out and other plastic parts that jam together.

The new RS really seems in line with marz and fox as far as quality and performance. Huge step up.

OGRipper · Jun 28, 2006

Jm_ said:
don't use rediculous things like damping rods screwing directly into the lowers (instead of using a footnut).

Thanks for mentioning that. One of the poorest design choices ever, IMO.

Bicyclist · Jun 28, 2006

Li'l Dave said:
But what about the Boxxer? I've blown every boxxer that I've ever owned at least once, and the customer service at Rockshox has always been terrible. The 2 hour long wait times were always fun, and the person you ended up talking to was always really helpful Manitou has always been quick and helpful when I've needed help. I didn't know about the Travis's blowing up though, I really haven't seen enough of them to actually see it happen.

Have you ridden a new Boxxer? :drool:

And they sent my buddy a brand new Boxxer Ride fork for free because his Boxxer Race lowers were bent in a crash and he needed some lowers but they didn't have any Race lowers. Now that's bad CS. :rolleyes:

dexter · Jun 28, 2006

not getting into this age old ordeal, but i have never had a bad manitou experience in 6 years with over 10 different forks

Superdeft · Jun 28, 2006

I wonder why this is is such a big trend in Manitou front suspension, as their rear offerings are ok in general.

I can only assume that it's a person, people, or some intrinsic (no pun intended) part of how the Manitou design house doing things it's own way. It just seems like some of the same old problems haunt model after model, year after year and stem from a desire to make things light and perform well. People always tease Manitou for plastic parts and such, and along those lines these trends must have something to do with doing things the Manitou way.

In a thread some weeks ago we learned about some major internal and supply-chain issues Answer was having, so that might also be part of the issue.

Who else has some ideas on WHY this might be the case?

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