[jonKranked]

What happened to riding for fun?

There's nothing wrong with organizing a team. Even if never grows to anything more than an am team, as long as everyone has fun who cares? Not everyone gets their jollies by wearing a matching race costume errrr kit and posing for Facebook.

 

[Daz]

Hey DHDreams, anybody trying to get more bodies out on trails is worthy of a thank you from a lot of us in my book. I see you have plenty of supporters in here focus on them, don't worry about the negative haters who only see things one way. Make your team/club/whatever your own thing.

 

[thom9719]

You guys are a bunch of pointless pricks.

The dude is trying to start a team that he thinks will be fun. It'll bring some positive contributors to a sport.

The elitist dicks here think that being on a team or arranging a sponsorship is some kind of privilege that they alone should possess. Guess what? If the original poster wants to arrange a "buying club" - which, by the way, is a lousy way of describing a group of riders who all want to go out and race - what, exactly, is wrong with that? It's another team out on the hills bringing dollars into the biking and racing markets. It's another team supporting local riding events. Maybe they will only show up to a race if they can say they're sponsored. Who cares? It's dollars flowing into an industry that you should all be excited to have dollars flowing into.

And for those less cynical among you who might see that it's not just dollars: it's also support. This guy seems positive and excited at the prospect of starting something that he and others can enjoy. He's well spoken - more and more a rarity - and has some energy. Do you not see that this kind of person is a good ambassador for the sport? A good person to have out on the hills?

Goddamn. Is it really so hard to just think things through before posting a knee-jerk negative response? If you have constructive criticism, post it. Post it in a manner of educating someone who doesn't know better.

I don't have a problem with "teams" but be realistic, Does this guy have a grand plan to really do something for the sport or is he looking for a discount? I don't know the guy and haven't seen his proposal, but by throwing an open invitation on a forum I would make the assumption that it isn't going to be anything other than looking for a discount.

There are plenty of local "teams" out here, most of them are buying clubs. There are a few teams that are really well known for doing a lot of trail work, working with land owners on opening new trails, hosting safety days for local kids, hosting local races, and developing numerous younger riders, but that number is very small (ie 1-2 teams, compared to the 8 or so I can name off the top of my head, and no, I am not a member of any of them.) However, all of those things are accomplished because the team was carefully started locally with a group of riders who were on the same page and can work together toward a common goal. None of that stuff would happen if these guys didn't live in the same area.

As for the financial aspect of it, is this "team" really going to help or hurt the industry? The cycling industry is screwing itself so many ways right now with how it handles sponsorships. I've seen beginner racers who havent been riding for a year, let alone do anything to give back to the sport, get "sponsored" (at dealer cost). All this is doing is hurting the local dealers, the guys who really have the abilty (not that all of them actually would) to help the community. Companies throughout the industry are hurting their dealer networks by selling out the back door to every Joe Dick and Harry that comes along. The reality is that these people would still buy product, but instead of spending money and creating a profit for local shops, they are just getting product handed to them for no return to the industry itself. Exposure is worth money, true, but how many bikes does your cat 3 race result sell?

-KT

 

[Huck Banzai]

I don't have a problem with "teams" but be realistic, Does this guy have a grand plan to really do something for the sport or is he looking for a discount? I don't know the guy and haven't seen his proposal, but by throwing an open invitation on a forum I would make the assumption that it isn't going to be anything other than looking for a discount.

There are plenty of local "teams" out here, most of them are buying clubs. There are a few teams that are really well known for doing a lot of trail work, working with land owners on opening new trails, hosting safety days for local kids, hosting local races, and developing numerous younger riders, but that number is very small (ie 1-2 teams, compared to the 8 or so I can name off the top of my head, and no, I am not a member of any of them.) However, all of those things are accomplished because the team was carefully started locally with a group of riders who were on the same page and can work together toward a common goal. None of that stuff would happen if these guys didn't live in the same area.

As for the financial aspect of it, is this "team" really going to help or hurt the industry? The cycling industry is screwing itself so many ways right now with how it handles sponsorships. I've seen beginner racers who havent been riding for a year, let alone do anything to give back to the sport, get "sponsored" (at dealer cost). All this is doing is hurting the local dealers, the guys who really have the abilty (not that all of them actually would) to help the community. Companies throughout the industry are hurting their dealer networks by selling out the back door to every Joe Dick and Harry that comes along. The reality is that these people would still buy product, but instead of spending money and creating a profit for local shops, they are just getting product handed to them for no return to the industry itself. Exposure is worth money, true, but how many bikes does your cat 3 race result sell?

-KT

Why do you care to dissect the scenario. Maybe you're right, maybe you're not - What's the difference? If its just a 'discount club' then good for him, why the hatorade?

Whatever the reason, support it, or ignore it.

I can be a reactionary simpleton sometimes, but this is just Fail at its worst!

 

[thom9719]

Why do you care to dissect the scenario. Maybe you're right, maybe you're not - What's the difference? If its just a 'discount club' then good for him, why the hatorade?

Whatever the reason, support it, or ignore it.

I can be a reactionary simpleton sometimes, but this is just Fail at its worst!

The point is that if it is a discount club, then it's NOT a good thing for the industry IMO. I don't have anything against the OP, but I figured I would at least express why discount clubs are bad.

-KT

 

[Kanye West]

Nothing wrong with a "buying club", or group-buy that will promote the brand at races. In fact, that's what most "teams" you see at races actually are. They don't get free product or real factory support. They just get a price cut. Sometimes part of the deal is they attend x number of races at certain locations. A few individual racers might get free product of some kind, but rarely is anything ever really being "given away" at the grassroots level.

But seriously.....dead fvcking parrot?

No offense man, but if I were a marketing director/sponsorship coordinator for a bike company, and a proposal came across my desk to help support and give a price break to two groups where I could only choose one: "Central Ohio Gracity Racing" (something nondescript) or...."DEAD PARROT RACING". Guess which one I would choose? I probably wouldn't even give something that had "dead animal" in the title a second look, unless it were to laugh at it and show to coworkers then immediately discard. Might as well call it "roadkill". I can't believe the name is doing any favors as far as the teams/clubs wellbeing is concerned.

 

[Kanye West]

The point is that if it is a discount club, then it's NOT a good thing for the industry IMO. I don't have anything against the OP, but I figured I would at least express why discount clubs are bad.

-KT

That's up to the discretion of the company. It doesn't make any sense to me either, but if beginners can get product cheaper, why the hell shouldn't they? Novices/weekend warriors are the ones paying retail for gravity gear anyway, so I don't understand why the manufacturers would even entertain such a request other than being charitable, but I guess that also explains how teams called "dead parrot" get hooked up. From the manufacturer standpoint, it seems like shooting yourself in both feet.

 

[Pslide]

Hmm, I didn't mind "dead parrot." It's quite dinstinctive and instantly memorable, which is considered a good thing in marketing. And it's made you talk about it.

With brands like "Evil" and bikes called "Handjob" and "Hooker" or even "Stinky", is Dead Parrot really that bad?

 

[Kanye West]

And to that, I say ---->

That should explain that.

Not sure what's wrong with "Evil", although I ride a "Sinister". Those at least sound cool. Dead Parrot sounds....stupid.

I guess there are two approaches to promotion - one being that any attention is good attention, and the other being to display professionalism. For example, one of the members on here posted a letter from Intense where they revoked his teams sponsorship after seeing the team website. Something about lesbians, firearms, heavy metal and some other redneck sh*t. I dig lesbians/guns/metal as much as the next straight red blooded American, but I can see why Intense doesn't want that to be the ambassador for their product.

Lately TLD and Fox have been subscribing to the former.

 

[Pslide]

Well, all I know is that Missy wore a dead animal around her neck, and sponsors were falling over each other to sign her up and she still is an icon of the sport.

 

[Pslide]

Wow, we will argue about anything won't we?!?

 

[sundaydoug]

It really sucks to see a positive idea met with such negativity. This community is awful. Best of luck to this guy and his team.

 

[jonKranked]

Well, all I know is that Missy wore a dead animal around her neck, and sponsors were falling over each other to sign her up and she still is an icon of the sport.

And a role model for aspiring drug dealers everywhere

 

[Eastern States Cup]

And a role model for aspiring drug dealers everywhere

enough already

 

[BC VAN]

The program being discussed here is part of a program i started when i rode for Mongoose called the Mongoose Tribe...The foundation for the idea was for riders to start their own teams teams based on a group of riders coming together for their love of riding bikes, team members get a discount on all Mongoose products and any participating co sponsors of the program,

I then personally was going to visit each region 1 time per year to ride with the team members of each respective region, these were to be called "Tribe Festivals"....team/ club/ gang/ band of pirates....whatever you want to call it or argue about is up to you guys?

But i see nothing wrong with it, If Mongoose is into it and the riders are stoked for getting a deal on product, please will all of the wise folks on here with all of the Team running experience explain to me the problem here, please remember not everyone is fast enough to garner sponsorship for free product, the idea of the program came about after i thought back to some of the times i was the most happy in my cycling career....it was a phone call i overheard with my mother and a company that agreed to a co- sponsorship for me in BMX, we bought a jersey and frame and fork and i was on the team. after all of the achievements of my career the fact that this was still a highlight to me speaks volumes, i wanted others to get that feeling as well.


So.....

Why is it bad to do a cattle call type of thing here? seriously what is wrong with it, just because in the past some posters on here have a pre set idea of how sponsorship works doesn't mean that is the only way it can happen.

to all you guys spraying negative's..... blowing someone's candle out doesn't make yours burn any brighter.

DH Dreams good luck with your new team!

 

[jonKranked]

to all you guys spraying negative's..... blowing someone's candle out doesn't make yours burn any brighter.

 

[stoney]

Re: EC
That would have been key information, given that the structure promotes cattle calls...

 

[BC VAN]

Re: EC
That would have been key information, given that the structure promotes cattle calls...

I still would like to know structured this way or otherwise, where the real problem is with " The Cattle Call"?

 

[thom9719]

I then personally was going to visit each region 1 time per year to ride with the team members of each respective region, these were to be called "Tribe Festivals"....team/ club/ gang/ band of pirates....whatever you want to call it or argue about is up to you guys?

Eric,

This makes no sense if the team isn't in a region. I fully spport growing a local scene and making something happen locally. I've been apart of that for over a decade, in numerous areas. If this guy truely wants to help the sport, he should try to set something up locally and help his community build some trails, do some advocacy work, host a race/festival etc. Getting discounts is nice, but something needs to be given back as well.

I hope whole heartedly that the OP doesn't get discouraged by any of this. I hope he just looks at what he's doing and mabye can restructure his ideas a litttle more around helping the sport, rather than just looking for a discount.

-KT

 

[Ithnu]

My only criticism when I read the OP's post was that there wasn't a commitment to racing needed. Kinda weird to call yourself a team if you don't have to compete.

Anyway, I got into racing through a "club" type team. They'd let anyone buy a jersey and join. Several of us became more serious and started our own "team" (see my link and become our fan and facebook). We're more serious and attend nearly all of the gravity races within 8 hours of Denver.

There is nothing wrong with a club, it gets people into the sport. Its a great place to start. If you want to take it further then go find a team.

One of my friends still refers to us as a club team, but I call us an amateur team.

 

[BC VAN]

Eric,

This makes no sense if the team isn't in a region. I fully spport growing a local scene and making something happen locally. I've been apart of that for over a decade, in numerous areas. If this guy truely wants to help the sport, he should try to set something up locally and help his community build some trails, do some advocacy work, host a race/festival etc. Getting discounts is nice, but something needs to be given back as well.

I hope whole heartedly that the OP doesn't get discouraged by any of this. I hope he just looks at what he's doing and mabye can restructure his ideas a litttle more around helping the sport, rather than just looking for a discount.

-KT

who's to say he isn't going to do things to help the sport and give back?

who's to say this wont be part of his team riders responsibilities.

the fact that he is asking , essentially on a global level by posting here can bring two view points.

He could have regional teams all over that are under the same "dead parrot" team name.

or he could just have riders scattered all over under the same team name...which i still don't see as bad.

It isn't like this guy is receiving the revenue from bikes sold through the program, and although some are cut out for advocacy and giving back a lot aren't... i would imagine that the % of sponsored riders of all levels that give back versus the ones that don't is minimal at best.

my point i guess is...i still don't see why this guy got flamed for asking if there is anyone out there that is interested in being a part of a team he is forming, if it is in a 1 stop sign town in Spiders Breath Montana or New York City or even Global i feel is no reason to bust balls.

 

[boogenman]

What DHracer is doing is good, cattle calls are good. Kids eat that $hit up just like EC did when his mom got the phone call back in the day.

I don't see a problem with this and I am a guy that was sponsored and didn't really enjoy the whole sponsorship deal.

Here is how I see it, the 'cattle call' will probably get more kids and adults involved in our sport which is good. The new comers to the sport are going to buy bikes, frames, forks, tires, gear and accessories which will increase sales volume and hopefully in return lower MSRP's for us. How is that bad?

Don't give me the bull $hit of "I don't pay MSRP" either, no matter how you look at it costs will go down as volume goes up.

 

[jonKranked]

booge, you still race for a team. Now its team drunk.

 

[boogenman]

ummm I retired from racing. I guess i'm just a club member )-:

 

[Sam B]

Club Team, Buying Club, Co-Op... whatever you want to call it, this is my take on it...

Bikes are expensive, people want to save money on bikes, obviously they will hunt for a deal. Good on ya! However, if everyone and their mother is buying stuff with a "hook up" people (shops, etc) along the chain aren't making money and won't want to push that brand or even entire sector of the market. If we want DH to grow and become more mainstream (ultimately lowering all the prices); it is in everyones best interest for only "worthwhile" riders to get "hooked up" by manufacturers, shops, etc. The definition of "worthwhile" and "hooked up" are up for debate of course!

However, I wouldn't blaim the guys hunting for a deal, I would put the responsibility in the hands of the shops and manufacturers to set expectations and requirements of riders they are "hooking up".

If a shop wants to throw away all their margin by selling the only 10 DH bikes they will sell in a year to so called "team riders" that is their choice. They are bikes made for racing, most people will probably race them, that doesn't qualify you for a spot on a team. Shop owner says to the manager... "We never make any money on DH bikes, I don't want to bring any more of those in."

Likewise, for a manufacturer to bypass the dealers and "hook up" a bunch of different teams, they better have a good reason for doing so. Otherwise very few of those bikes end up with shops and shops won't want to support the brand by investing in their products.

The bummer is, if brand Y stops "hooking people up" and brand Z still does... a lot of people will likely take the deal with brand Z, since brand Y just got too expensive. That is the crappy part - manufacturers don't really have good motivation to stop the "hook ups" since they are still making money on those sales.

 

[jonKranked]

ummm I retired from racing. I guess i'm just a club member )-:

You're like the Dancing Guy in Mighty Might Bosstones. You don't really serve any specific function, but it wouldn't be the same without you

 

[UNHrider]

To all the guys saying that people shouldnt get a break on bikes because they haven't earned it, do you actually pay retail for anything you buy? cause that seems to be everyone's problem with the OP's team.

If you dont pay retail, why do you deserve breaks on prices? cause you're fast? cause you give back to the sport? if you cared that much, which some here seem to claim, why dont you pay full retail? I mean it helps out the sport and all. Why do you deserve to 'short change' the system?

Ive never worked in a shop, but I thought most shops made most of their margins on doing repair work and maint. Id think if more people are riding/racing this will mean the shops would see more people in for more repairs and whatnot, am i wrong?

This team seems like a good way to get like minded people together to ride bikes. That seems like a great thing to me.

Also this team seems to mirror what most collegiate teams are based on, albeit a bit more spread out geography wise. Do all these same people here disagree with that entire scene as well?

 

[Ithnu]

To all the guys saying that people shouldnt get a break on bikes because they haven't earned it, do you actually pay retail for anything you buy?

Ive never worked in a shop, but I thought most shops made most of their margins on doing repair work and maint. Id think if more people are riding/racing this will mean the shops would see more people in for more repairs and whatnot, am i wrong?

Only suckers pay retail, buy close outs or use the internets!

Its hard for LBS to compete with online dealers though. Chain Reaction sells some crap below wholesale prices, what's a shop supposed to do about that? I do 99% of the work on my bikes myself. So I guess I don't support local shops

What I do go to local shops for is stuff I need immediately. And that happens when you race so I think shop support can be very important.