Quantcast

talk me out of a 951.

frorider

frorider

Monkey
Jul 21, 2004
971
20
cali
ok unfortunately i have to make this decision soon, since the window for getting my alternative choice (TR 450) is closing very soon.

me: imagine a world cup rider, but without the skills :D, and with a healthy fear of injury due to my age (83 approx) and intense career obligations, who casually rides N* and Mammoth a few times a month. 6'3", longish arms and legs, usually ends up on a 24" ETT bike. i would say i only punish my bikes moderately.

i've talked directly, and via internetz, with a few 951 owners; the takeaway is sorta mixed. for some the bike seems to rip corners very well, and is not a plow bike but does ok in loose rocky sections. others seem to feel that if you set up the geo for a slack HA, the static BB ends up fairly low but the actual BB while riding ends up too low due to the shock curve's tendency to induce some mid-range wallow. btw I'd be putting on a push-tuned MX (i.e. with the Avy damping), which could help compensate somewhat (?).

besides the adj dropout/CS, and adj travel, another plus is the 1.5 HT...suggests to me that I could slacken the HA w/ K9 angled HT inserts and preserve some flexibility to maintain a higher BB if needed.

another question -- size. I don't see a reach meas on the Intense site, but i gots to believe that with a WB of 47.5" and CS of 17.75, and ETT of 24", this would not feel small, but occasionally people say the Lg 951 feels too small for them. ?

bonus question -- with a weight w/ shock of 10.6 lbs or so, I'm figuring the 951 mostly avoids the Socom super thin tubing issues. Yes?

thx. sorry for the long blog, but wanted to cover the bases.
 
frorider

frorider

Monkey
Jul 21, 2004
971
20
cali
xy9, my plan is to manual 100% of the time, and thereby reduce all stresses near the head tube.

srsly tho -- i thought the infamous green 951 failure had a story behind it and some sort of resolution. it's not like a socom, which can dent from being washed with a hose. ;)

edit to add: william's post seemed to cover it.
 
bdamschen

bdamschen

Turbo Monkey
Nov 28, 2005
3,377
156
Spreckels, CA
I'm 6'4" with longish arms and long legs. I'm in to running the shortest stem I can on everything. People say a large looks really small under me, but it doesn't feel too strange to me.

When I first got the frame, I dropped the crowns as far down as possible on my 40 because I like a super low front end. I was clipping pedals on everything and the BB felt super low.

Once I set my fork back to a sane height, I only really noticed the low bb issue when sitting down pedaling on a fire road or something. The rest of the time, no pedal clipping. The bike does seem to want to ride pretty deep into the travel, but once you're hauling butt, you don't notice it.

If I had to pick frames all over again, I'd still buy the 951. It's fun.
 
frorider

frorider

Monkey
Jul 21, 2004
971
20
cali
bdamschen said:
I'm 6'4" with longish arms and long legs. I'm in to running the shortest stem I can on everything. People say a large looks really small under me, but it doesn't feel too strange to me.
... If I had to pick frames all over again, I'd still buy the 951. It's fun.
Click to expand...
thx.

so what geo settings are you running on the rear dropouts and shock travel? what's the unsagged BB height? what shock?
 
W

WBC

Monkey
Aug 8, 2003
578
1
PNW
It's a tough call. I think the 951 has the best traction and cornering of any bike I've ridden. In the long/low position, I've never had problems with my pedals being too low (you learn to ride it), and while it doesn't handle square edge hard hits as well as other bikes I've ridden, it does a decent job and is probably more or less comparable to the TR (based on my experience with my 08 DHR, which has a relatively low pivot singlepivot like the TR). Despite shuttling on all sorts of sketchy, unpadded tailgates, my 951 is still dent free. It pedals much better than my 5" trailbike. It takes big hits really well due to the suspension ramp up and once up to speed it likes to pop and jump real easy. I haven't had any issues with the bearings yet despite a full northwest fall/winter - I just grease the zerk fittings every few rides which takes less than 5 minutes.

Overall I am really happy with my decision to go with the 951.

The TR's seem to be great, too and everyone I know on one seems pretty pleased with them. It's definitely nothing revolutionary at all, but it's very well executed and if you're hard on your equipment or you live in the northwest like me, it should give you easier maintenance than most bikes. The TR seems like a great working-man's DH rig - which considering the people that ride where this bike is designed, it's fair to guess they designed it for shuttles, poor maintenance schedules and guinea-pigging new gaps.

Yeah, I really can't be of much help. Flip a coin - you can't go wrong
 
bdamschen

bdamschen

Turbo Monkey
Nov 28, 2005
3,377
156
Spreckels, CA
frorider said:
thx.

so what geo settings are you running on the rear dropouts and shock travel? what's the unsagged BB height? what shock?
Click to expand...
I've only really messed with the dropouts once, and that was actually to run it in the steepest head angle setting for a really pedally dh race. If I remember right, there's three holes(slack, medium, steep) and I'm keeping it in the middle one.

I'll have to check on the unsagged bb height tonight(I'm not a big weigher or measurer), but that is also subjective to things like how thick the sidewalls on my tires are and how high I've got my crowns set on my fork.

I'm using the RC4 with a 500lb spring and love it. Like any shock, I had to get it dialed for myself and the bike before it felt good.

My buddy also just got a TR450 with a RC4 and 40. He weighs about the same as me and is almost as tall. Riding his bike on the ultimate testing grounds - the flat paved road in front of my house, it actually felt more slack and low than my 951. However, after scientifically standing both bikes side by side and attempting to lean over and compare BB heights while holding them up, my self and another friend came to the conclusion that unsagged the 951 BB is actually "a smidge" lower. How about THAT for precise. :thumb:
 
nmpearson

nmpearson

Monkey
Dec 30, 2006
213
8
not much to say about the 951...but i love my TR. It's a world cup bike that anyone can ride. I would guess it'll last longer. i love having the adjustability, it does plow through rock gardens, and corners like a master. i really doubt you'd hate either one. both are just gorgeous. It's hard to not fall in love with both those bikes. If i didn't have my TR, i'd def have a 951
 
Zark

Zark

Hey little girl, do you want some candy?
Oct 18, 2001
6,254
7
Reno 911
I don't have a ton of time on mine yet, but so far its badass! It corners better than anything I've owned before or tried. The pedaling is great, it keeps momentum really well too.

I've been running mine on the middle geo setting, 8.5" travel, with a 500lb spring. Small bump sensitivity seems great, it sits deep in the travel, but doesn't seem to bottom very easy.

I've got no idea how its going to do in the rough, but it should be fine. I came off a Shocker with only a hair more travel.
 
Kntr

Kntr

Turbo Monkey
Jan 25, 2003
7,526
21
Montana
A 2.5 Maxxis Minion will fit in the back in all three settings, but its REAL close in the shortest setting. I run mine in the middle and love it. I havent had a ton of time on it, but it corners like crazy. The tubing is much thicker than my older Socom. The suspension curve is a little odd. It ramps up real fast. I like running a REAL soft spring on mine. Im 175 and I run a 400 on a Roco with a Push tune. The bike pedals amazingly well, better than my Socom and I run a HammerSchmidt on it. I havent tried the 8.5" travel setting yet. I was told by a few people that the suspension curve gets even more ramped. Im really loving the bike so far. I ride a small and Im 5'9" and it feels perfect.
 
Last edited:
W

WBC

Monkey
Aug 8, 2003
578
1
PNW
bizutch said:
Oh, and I foresee a shortage of replacement parts for your outdated frame in 18 months.
Click to expand...
That brings up a nice point about the 951 - It uses the same box link, bearings and pivot axles as every other Intense, and uses the same rear end (right??) as the M6's the pros are running. The only thing "951 specific" is the front triangle - which granted may need replacement at some point based on those pictures of peoples' broken post-gnar-huck front triangles, but at least that's an obvious part as opposed to a shock pin that company could easily forget to keep around.

That said, I know the point you're trying to make - and I agree with you: There is only one Turner.
 
iRider

iRider

Turbo Monkey
Apr 5, 2008
5,654
3,101
WBC said:
That said, I know the point you're trying to make - and I agree with you: There is only one Turner.
Click to expand...
Hope Turner is quicker with replacement parts than with the release of new models! :rofl:
 
D

Dwdrums00

Monkey
Mar 31, 2007
224
0
gemini2k said:
2 words: leverage curve
Click to expand...
Agreed, the leverage curve is insane! In the 8.5" mode it starts off at 4:1 then ramps to almost 1:1. I rode a M6 for a year and loved it. I ordered a 951 once it hit the market. My buddy got his 951 before me so I got a chance to ride it. Lost story short, I cancelled my 951 order and got another M6. About 3 month later my buddy did the same thing.
 
p-spec

p-spec

Turbo Monkey
May 2, 2004
1,278
1
quebec
Da Peach said:
You can catch teh ghey from 951s
Click to expand...
looool

I wish framemakers would concentrate on making a frame not made of recycled tin cans ( obviously not recycled just saying how thin that **** is )

All the lbs's here try to sell me the 951 I tell them everytime its tubes are tin can thin should see their faces wen they realise they wont make 3200+$ mark up on me and have a broken frame the next year.
 
gemini2k

gemini2k

Turbo Monkey
Jul 31, 2005
3,526
117
San Francisco
Dwdrums00 said:
Agreed, the leverage curve is insane! In the 8.5" mode it starts off at 4:1 then ramps to almost 1:1. I rode a M6 for a year and loved it. I ordered a 951 once it hit the market. My buddy got his 951 before me so I got a chance to ride it. Lost story short, I cancelled my 951 order and got another M6. About 3 month later my buddy did the same thing.
Click to expand...
Ya I don't think I've ever felt a bike quite like it (not a good thing). Just blows through the first 2-3 inches or so and then feels like it hits a f-ing brick wall. Weird stuff.
 
D

Dwdrums00

Monkey
Mar 31, 2007
224
0
gemini2k said:
Ya I don't think I've ever felt a bike quite like it (not a good thing). Just blows through the first 2-3 inches or so and then feels like it hits a f-ing brick wall. Weird stuff.
Click to expand...
Funny you described it as hitting a "brick wall," that is what I told my buddy after I rode it at the bike park.
 
Kntr

Kntr

Turbo Monkey
Jan 25, 2003
7,526
21
Montana
gemini2k said:
Ya I don't think I've ever felt a bike quite like it (not a good thing). Just blows through the first 2-3 inches or so and then feels like it hits a f-ing brick wall. Weird stuff.
Click to expand...
I notice it in the 8.5" setting but not in the 8" setting. Is there a reason for this? Is the leverage ratio that different in the 8" vs the 8.5"
 
D

Dwdrums00

Monkey
Mar 31, 2007
224
0
Kntr said:
I notice it in the 8.5" setting but not in the 8" setting. Is there a reason for this?
Click to expand...
The bikes leverage curve ramps harder in the 8.5" mode than in the 8" mode. It is so extreme that Cane creek does not recommend running the bike in the 8.5" setting. So you mean to tell me you don't feel that "wall" in the 8" setting? I sure did, it wasn't as pronounced as the 8.5" setting but it was definitely there.
 
bizutch

bizutch

Delicate CUSTOM flower
Dec 11, 2001
15,929
24
Over your shoulder whispering
WBC said:
That brings up a nice point about the 951 - It uses the same box link, bearings and pivot axles as every other Intense, and uses the same rear end (right??) as the M6's the pros are running. The only thing "951 specific" is the front triangle - which granted may need replacement at some point based on those pictures of peoples' broken post-gnar-huck front triangles, but at least that's an obvious part as opposed to a shock pin that company could easily forget to keep around.

That said, I know the point you're trying to make - and I agree with you: There is only one Turner.
Click to expand...
Actually, just the bolded part is all I was saying. I respect Jeff and his craft. Having ridden his stuff back in "the day", he helped me a lot. I meant it in more of a typical meat head generic response. Didn't mean it to come as bagging on Intense. My sarcasm button wasn't on. :D
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top Bottom