[Flat tyres]

Have there been any problems with riders(or their parents) looking to hold trail builders responsible for injuries?

I seem to get nervous when the groms and hacks show up to ride. I used to treat them like crap and give them a long lecture about the rules and digging and trash and brakes and other stuff that was going in one ear and out the other. It sucks to always be the fat old a**hole that dosnt want anyone to ride. Thats not always the case.

The youth in my area dont get it, they are not stong enought to dig all day, or even for an hour in some cases. They leave crap everywhere, cut down trees for fun, and light sh1t on fire. We spend weeks, months, years digging and stacking **** that gets F'ed in one day. Locks and cables are alway getting cut, the inevitable HACK is always on the loose, and most of the riders that come by cant even ride. My fear is that one day a grom or hack is gonna get broken up and the authorities will be involved. What happens then?

 

[TortugaTonta]

your preaching to the choir. . . .


I will say that the good times make it all worth while, afterall if it was easy everyone would do it.

 

[cmc]

build a pump track with some tables for them a quarter mile away....

 

[Flat tyres]

your preaching to the choir. . . .


I will say that the good times make it all worth while, afterall if it was easy everyone would do it.

Sorry, didnt intend for the post to appear as a rant. The question is; has anyone had any legal problems as a result of injured riders at their trails?

 

[Dirty Maestro]

Unfortunately there will always be some kind of issue. Its either you make them respect you or have enough respect in the local community that others will help you weed out the pouching punks.

This past weekend i had 2 new kids come in and had to meet a parent when the kids got picked up. They ended up being ok and helped but you have to play babysitter sometimes. One thing i always ask is "who told you about the spot". If the source is someone you respect you let them ride and make them do basic clean up(sweeping/tarps). If they mention someone that you don't like or they don't want to tell you(trying to protect the source), you tell them they will have earn to ride immediately and make them stack dirt.

I usually watch the new kids ride first and let them know where they belong. If they don't seem ready to hit something i'll let them know. I also will make them wear a helmet if they look like they need it. I have spare helmets stored at the trails.

With the parents, i always introduce myself and make sure they understand that the trails are private and not a public park. I'll ask them if they want me to make sure that their kid wears a helmet or not. That will tell you how concerned they are.

I let them know if their kid gets hurt you'll most likely be talking to me on the phone and will help their kid the best i can. We have a few first aid kits. Which has been used plenty of times to stablize the injury till the person got to the hospital.

So if you dont have spare helmets and first aid kits. I highly recommend it!

Its a constant battle on all fronts when your the Trail Boss. Gotta deal with people, weather and then stacking the dirt!

But No, I haven't been charged for anyone getting hurt.

Keep your head up!

 

[TortugaTonta]

I've had people get hurt at my house and have never had a problem.

They would have a hard time finding you responsible, unless you led someone to believe it was safe and it was not, like if you built a wooden rollin that collapsed because it wasn't built properly.

The other way would be through subrogation but for most injuries like a simple broken collarbone or something it would not be worth the time and effort for an insurance company to try to recover a couple thousand bucks.

 

[Nice Guy Mike]

Its got more to do with the ownership of the land. If you are the trail boss on poached land and someone gets hurt its not your problem, at best they will go after the landowner but probably no one will be responsible. I mean you are both technically trespassing. If its your land the situation is different. You accept some degree of liability by asking folks over to ride. They can sue you but most likely will not win, it will still cost you to defend yourself. There is also the liability of having an "attractive nuisance" on your land. Much like a swimming pool someone can trespass, get injured and sue.
My best advice is to post the land to ward off trespassers, know who you let ride as best you can, keep your trails in good shape and think twice about allowing anyone under 18 to ride unless a parent is present. Word!

 

[tonka]

all you need is a jump at your own risk sign.haha

 

[pnj]

Pretty sure it's the land owner that has all responsiblity. I'm no lawyer though....

 

[igz-]

build a pump track with some tables for them a quarter mile away....

Best solution.

 

[Flat tyres]

Thanks for the insight. If there is a problem it looks like it will fall on someone else's back. Moving to a new spot is not an option, we will just continue to stack until they loose interest.

Any ideas for an in ground locker for the tools?

 

[jonKranked]

Squirrel catcher.

I'm surprised this wasn't mentioned yet. But if you look at all the issues, it really only serves as a means to prevent inexperienced riders from riding more advanced lines. It doesn't help solve the issues of littering and vandalism, or morons setting things on fire.

 

[Gookis]

build a pump track with some tables for them a quarter mile away....

****, I'll ride that! Then again, I'm a fat old man who can't ride. It's all good, I hate douche-bags too.

 

[WhoRyder]

Is this a public place? Does the property belong to you? if it doesn't then you bare the brunt of it... you can't tell anyone to leave a public place you don't own, unfortunately...

If you do tell them to "beat it" you risk them coming back and destroying everything... it sucks.....

 

[Jeremy R]

If you walk into a courtroom, don't expect to hear..... all rise for the Trail Boss.
That term don't mean squat in a court of law.
You might as well call yourself "Dirt Jump and Unicorn Protector" as far as the judge goes.

 

[TheTruth]

At my trails, I am the mayor and my pick axe is the police...and no we don't carry tazers.

 

[WhoRyder]

At my trails, I am the mayor and my pick axe is the police...and no we don't carry tazers.

See u At Cunningham, Officer Mofo!

 

[sittingduck]

The best trails are the ones where the TBs are not a-holes, and nobody thinks they "own" anything.
The guys that decide the best way to act is to be mr. toughguy because they dig trails - always end up crying in the end.
These types need to stick to private spots on land they own, or have permission to use.

 

[demo 9]

The best trails are the ones where the TBs are not a-holes, and nobody thinks they "own" anything.
The guys that decide the best way to act is to be mr. toughguy because they dig trails - always end up crying in the end.
These types need to stick to private spots on land they own, or have permission to use.

 

[sittingduck]

Good trails are like good food and drink.... they are enjoyed the most when shared. If only a few people have access to the trails, you end up riding alone far too often. Yeah, it's a lot more work to maintain well used trails, but at least you have someone to ride with most of the time.

 

[WhoRyder]

The best trails are the ones where the TBs are not a-holes, and nobody thinks they "own" anything.
The guys that decide the best way to act is to be mr. toughguy because they dig trails - always end up crying in the end.
These types need to stick to private spots on land they own, or have permission to use.

I TOTALLY AGREE.....

100%....

Especially if they "DON'T" own the land... i find that really amusing...

 

[kidwoo]

You might as well call yourself "Dirt Jump and Unicorn Protector"

Way ahead of you.

The guys that decide the best way to act is to be mr. toughguy because they dig trails - always end up crying in the end.

Or just have trails that stay in really good shape.







Hippy

 

[sittingduck]

Hippy

LOL!!!!

 

[scag]

Good trails are like good food and drink.... they are enjoyed the most when shared. If only a few people have access to the trails, you end up riding alone far too often. Yeah, it's a lot more work to maintain well used trails, but at least you have someone to ride with most of the time.

Except when you offer a bite, they eat the whole ****ing thing...then litter the trash and steal your fork and knife. Maybe they are bread differently where you live....Most kids would rather hurry home to their xbox or fingerbang their emo gf at the skating rink than hang out with the elders and dig/fix their divots, and cover the jumps...

 

[demo 9]

fingerbang their emo gf at the skating rink

 

[TheTruth]

The truth says that smaller jumps must be built so that the ****ty riders will learn to respect the jumps because those are the only ones they can ride.

 

[sittingduck]

So much anger. I hope you're able to heal yourself someday.

 

[WhoRyder]

lolzzzzzzzz

 

[WhoRyder]

i'm old school, i enjoy riding street now more than dirt jumps!!!! but i do enjoy a pump track or two...

 

[Zach Dank]

Awe, the dead horse beating is back.


Unless you have spent 20 to 40 hours a week digging at a spot off and on for a couple years, so you and your good homies, and anybody else who respects hard work, and good trails can ride, and enjoy quality trails, then you have no clue what actions are justified to control poaching/disrespecting biatches.

Sittingduck, i've heard it countless times from you. It doesn't piss me off, i just giggle a little to myself every time i hear it.


Here is a little scenerio for you to contemplate.

You have a spot with some jumps. They suck. Nobody digs, maintains, or barely even rides.

You want some better trails, but you don't have a private spot, or a hidden spot is just not in the cards where you live.

So you go ahead, and spend the next 2 months putting in 30 hours a week of shovel/pick action just to get a descent 10 pack going.

At the end of each week, you are broke the fvck off, your back is shredded, your hands are blistered, but you see light at the end of the tunnel, after about 120 hours of hard labor. And you are still only half way to your goal of an epic 10 pack.

All the while, you've been getting some random help here and there from some local kids, and old schoolers alike. Not a lot, but they got respect for what you are putting yourself through for the cause, so they stop by from time to time, and throw dirt for an hour or 2.

At the same time you got a truck that rolls by real slow every other day with 3 kids in their early twentys, and three 20" bikes in the back of their truck.
They stop about once a week, and smoke cigs and drink a 40 or two. They never say one word to you, and deffinately don't pick up a tool.

Now 4 weeks later you're 240 hours deep of shoveling, and you finally finished a ripping 10 pack. Time to shred.

Now, you ain't bossin nobody. You ride the line, you're fvcking stoked as hell.
Other peeps start showing up. Some that helped dig, some that didn't. But you still ain't bossin nobody, because you realize you are on public property.
You may kringe a little when somebody cases the piss out of a lander. And when they don't grab a shovel to fix it, you might ask them politely to do some repairs, but deffinately aren't a dic about it.

Now the truck with the 20 "ers that was pullin the slow drive by for the last 8 weeks shows up. They pull out the bikes, and start droppin in and casing the fvck out of your landers, and ice picking your lips. They throw zero repair attempts, and when you ask them to fix some thing, they spout some smart as$ $hit about you not owning the land.




This is a pretty comon thing that happens at most local trails one way or another.
Where i come from it ends with broken noses, or a shovel upside the head peice.

 

[WhoRyder]

No Dig, No Ride... FUX IT.....

 

[sittingduck]

Awe, the dead horse beating is back.

Yeah, it sucks that people are such assclowns when it comes to respecting hard work.
My point is that acting hard and being a dick just increases the chances that the trails will come to a bitter end.
Of course you can be as cool as a cucumber and still have shyt get fscked up by the clowns, as you well know (and illustrated with your sad story).

 

[kidwoo]

My point is that acting hard and being a dick just increases the chances that the trails will come to a bitter end.

Sometimes maybe.


And sometimes being a hard ass gets trash picked up, tools stored where they should be, and the message across that you didn't build something for a bunch of fvck ups to treat as their own.

No really

 

[sittingduck]

Can't argue that.

Did I mention the trails are fvcking sweet right now? Damp but not slick. No dust. No heat. Can't wait to ride them again tomorrow!

 

[Flat tyres]

Zack: Have you been spying on me? JK, but thats it in a nut shell, back to my hole in the ground. We just passed the 2 year mark, it wasnt until recently that the cat got out of the bag.

Tufino: Dont make DH_DAD come up to NYC and teach you a lesson.

 

[WhoRyder]

Tufino: Dont make DH_DAD come up to NYC and teach you a lesson.

What did tufino do?

 

[TheTruth]

I have been through this frustration, I have stupid ****ing kids that wreck whatever new work that I do, but they won't come back unless I have done new work. Eventually they wrecked a whole 6 foot by 8 foot lander and wrote **** you on the first lip because the rest of the jumps were completely torn down.

 

[WhoRyder]

I have been through this frustration, I have stupid ****ing kids that wreck whatever new work that I do, but they won't come back unless I have done new work. Eventually they wrecked a whole 6 foot by 8 foot lander and wrote **** you on the first lip because the rest of the jumps were completely torn down.

this will resolve any building issues...

http://www.pinkbike.com/video/96876/?trk=vtit

 

[jonKranked]

this will resolve any building issues...

http://www.pinkbike.com/video/96876/?trk=vtit

I love how they are rolling around in a poorly murdered out escalade.

 

[don]

Zack: Have you been spying on me? JK, but thats it in a nut shell, back to my hole in the ground. We just passed the 2 year mark, it wasnt until recently that the cat got out of the bag.

Tufino: Dont make DH_DAD come up to NYC and teach you a lesson.

haha, I was thinking it sounded just like your situation while I was reading it.

I think modifying that first set/berm/roller into something taller and more tech will act like a nice squirel catcher. If they can't get thru that then they won't be hurting the main stuff or themselves.

Zach summed it up real well. The only thing I can add is back in the late 90's when it was dick Trail Bosses, strict no dig/no ride rules, invite only to ride other people's trails it might have been a little bit of work but man it was worth it - lots of good days. Yeah, it's still cookin just less guys now and certainly no next generation.

I love seeing public dirt jump parks and how good some of these kids are riding wise but a little something was lost. Thankfully there are a few keeping it going.