[Dwdrums00]

Here is the deal. My buddy and I have had our M6's for almost three weeks now. We noticed at full travel that the rear tire hits the frame (maxxis 2.5 highroller that is pretty bald) on our bikes. After many different tuning adjustments, we talked to intense about the issue. They told us that the tire does in fact hit the frame at full travel . They say this is due to the tight geometry that was accomplish while designing the bike. I guess that is why my BB height is a half I inch lower than advertised (13.34" BB height.) I wish I would have known this before buying the bike. This is my third intense bike and I have never had such an issue in the past. So just thought i would give the future M6 owners a heads up.





MOD EDIT: See this post on the last page of this thread for the official solution to this problem from intense.

 

[Eastern States Cup]

 

[jonKranked]

time to get smaller tyres!!

 

[sriracha]

what's wrong with a little bit of tire rub???

it's not like you ride around all day long with the suspension bottomed out.

 

[Rye_Bread]

thats some bull****

 

[dan wask]

Tire rub isn't really all that big of a deal. A look at the underside of the rear fender on most motocross bikes will reveal some nice thick streaks of rubber left from tire rub.

 

[General Lee]

Here is the deal. My buddy and I have had our M6's for almost three weeks now. We noticed at full travel that the rear tire hits the frame (maxxis 2.5 highroller that is pretty bald) on our bikes. After many different tuning adjustments, we talked to intense about the issue. They told us that the tire does in fact hit the frame at full travel . They say this is due to the tight geometry that was accomplish while designing the bike. I guess that is why my BB height is a half I inch lower than advertised (13.34" BB height.) I wish I would have known this before buying the bike. This is my third intense bike and I have never had such an issue in the past. So just thought i would give the future M6 owners a heads up.

while the rubbing should have no negative impact on performance, if you really want to do something about it you could always fit some sort of spacer behind the bottom out bumper. A Boxxer preload spacer would probably do just the trick. if you cut it into a 'C' shape with an opening just smaller than the diameter of he shock shaft it should go right on and hold itself in place, or just dab a bit of super glue on the back of the bumper it you like.

thats some bull****

Somehow I feel Kovarik is not likely to agree with you. If people want geometry identical to what the best pros run they are going to have to learn to live with the result.

 

[Dwdrums00]

while the rubbing should have no negative impact on performance, if you really want to do something about it you could always fit some sort of spacer behind the bottom out bumper. A Boxxer preload spacer would probably do just the trick. if you cut it into a 'C' shape with an opening just smaller than the diameter of he shock shaft it should go right on and hold itself in place, or just dab a bit of super glue on the back of the bumper it you like.

I am going to try an fit a second bottom bumper on the shock shaft. If that doesn't solve the problem, I am going to give your idea a try. Thanks

 

[Dwdrums00]

what's wrong with a little bit of tire rub???

it's not like you ride around all day long with the suspension bottomed out.

That is true, but for a $3,000 frame I would expect a little more. Wouldn't you?

 

[Curious_George]

Tire rub isn't really all that big of a deal. A look at the underside of the rear fender on most motocross bikes will reveal some nice thick streaks of rubber left from tire rub.

When you "Know" its there...it can't get f*ing annoying since that all you seem to hear

 

[General Lee]

I am going to try an fit a second bottom bumper on the shock shaft. If that doesn't solve the problem, I am going to give your idea a try. Thanks

a second bumper is likely to be overkill, remember with the leverage ratio anything you use will be magnified in size at the rear wheel.

 

[Ian Collins]

Somehow I feel Kovarik is not likely to agree with you. If people want geometry identical to what the best pros run they are going to have to learn to live with the result.

yeah, but a production frame should be designed so that doesn't happen....

 

[kidwoo]

Somehow I feel Kovarik is not likely to agree with you.

great point!


Tell me again why someone should care about what some pro who gets free frames says about a company that's supported him forever?


Spending 3 grand on a frame and expecting it to cover the basics (like not hitting the frame with a tire) isn't unreasonable.....regardless of who rides for them. If they want the chainstay measurements, then move the seat tube. If they want the seat tube where it is, move the rear axle. Every other frame maker can manage this. Somehow I doubt there's a very specific seat tube placement that's vital to a dh bike's performance.

Dwdrums: You running a dhx? Look for someone with a spec demo 7. More than likely they took out the spacer that was put on those things stock to limit the travel. It's a lot less restrictive than an entire bumper.

 

[jefedelosjefes]

Sounds like their engineers screwed up on that one. They will probably try to play it off like it is a feature. Like when rocky mountain claimed that flex in the swingarm of the RMX helped it "carve" corners. Problems like that are expected in prototypes, but customers should never see a product like that

 

[Ian Collins]

great point!


Tell me again why someone should care about what some pro who gets free frames says about a company that's supported him forever?


Spending 3 grand on a frame and expecting it to cover the basics (like not hitting the frame with a tire) isn't unreasonable.....regardless of who rides for them. If they want the chainstay measurements, then move the seat tube. If they want the seat tube where it is, move the rear axle. Every other frame maker can manage this. Somehow I doubt there's a very specific seat tube placement that's vital to a dh bike's performance.

Dwdrums: You running a dhx? Look for someone with a spec demo 7. More than likely they took out the spacer that was put on those things stock to limit the travel. It's a lot less restrictive than an entire bumper.

an easy fix for this(if intense is smart) is they could re-machine some new rear dropouts(to adjust axle positioning) and just mail them out to people who already have the bikes, and install them on the other bikes....should be easy seeing how they do everything in house.....for some reason i'm willing to be they'll F it up......

 

[Dwdrums00]

Kidwoo: I am running a CCDB and I also have the revox it came with. I have been testing out both of them.

 

[kidwoo]

an easy fix for this(if intense is smart) is they could re-machine some new rear dropouts(to adjust axle positioning) and just mail them out to people who already have the bikes, and install them on the other bikes....should be easy seeing how they do everything in house.....for some reason i'm willing to be they'll F it up......

An easy solution would be to go out and ride the damn things before they sell them

Small M1s did the same thing. I had a buddy get back at least one (maybe two) front triangles when he brought this up. Nothing changed.

To intense's credit, he did end up with an m3 either for free or a pretty small 'upgrade' charge eventually. But he was riding a pretty clapped out sounding bike for a while before this happened.


Dwdrum: see if you can find out the shaft diameter (just grab some calipers) of the shock you decide you want to use. The one off the demo 7s might fit or be made to fit if your shock shaft is larger.

 

[dropmachine]

Somebody please explaint o me why its completely forgivable that Intense can put out a frame that bottoms the wheel out on itself, but when Azonic did it they are called a crap company with no engineers?

 

[ChrisKring]

Ian Collins has a good idea there for a business opprotunity for someone willing to make a "fix kit". A couple of $50 cnc machined parts for $200.

 

[kidwoo]

Somebody please explaint o me why its completely forgivable that Intense can put out a frame that bottoms the wheel out on itself, but when Azonic did it they are called a crap company with no engineers?

ooooohhhh................kovarik is gonna beat you up



edit: and he can ride a bike fast!!

 

[DirtyMike]

I am not fond of any bike that allows the rear wheel to contact the frame. I know alot of people say it isnt that big of a deal, But If I am going to spend 3K for a frame, it damn well better not have issues such as this. Of coarse I am not saying that the M6 is a bad bike, its just a race bike, not an everyday rider. Remember eventually that tire contact is going to wear a hole in the seat tube. Maybe not at first, but it will have a shorter life than a bike that doesnt deal with this issue

 

[General Lee]

I am not fond of any bike that allows the rear wheel to contact the frame. I know alot of people say it isnt that big of a deal, But If I am going to spend 3K for a frame, it damn well better not have issues such as this. Of coarse I am not saying that the M6 is a bad bike, its just a race bike, not an everyday rider. Remember eventually that tire contact is going to wear a hole in the seat tube. Maybe not at first, but it will have a shorter life than a bike that doesnt deal with this issue

Even Kenda tires can't go through aluminum, and even if they could it's doubtful the contact is that profound anyway.

what i'd really like to see is a pic of an m3 fully compressed with the spring removed so we can see just how much contact we're talking about here.

 

[Boxxer]

If its significant contact and done often enough, a tire could eat through aluminum surprisingly fast. Bottom out spacers on the shock shaft seem like the cheap fix-it-now solution.

 

[DirtyMike]

Even Kenda tires can't go through aluminum, and even if they could it's doubtful the contact is that profound anyway.

what i'd really like to see is a pic of an m6 fully compressed with the spring removed so we can see just how much contact we're talking about here.

Close ups on the shock in that state as well. It would be good to see how close the tire is and how compressed the shock bumper is

Oh and on wearing through, sory Ive seen it before on swingarms with and seatubes before on other bikes. Not something that happens over night, but it does cause a problem. It make be nominal but still, not something I am comfortable with

 

[Ian Collins]

Ian Collins has a good idea there for a business opprotunity for someone willing to make a "fix kit". A couple of $50 cnc machined parts for $200.

ooohhhh.....you read my mind.....i was biting my tongue.....i'd like to see them f it up and watch some one else profit from their lack of planning.....

 

[kidwoo]

ooohhhh.....you read my mind.....i was biting my tongue.....i'd like to see them f it up and watch some one else profit from their lack of planning.....

Let's not forget the entire industry specialized created for aftermarket bits designed to 'get it right' from mrp, risse, and betd

 

[kidwoo]

Even Kenda tires can't go through aluminum, and even if they could it's doubtful the contact is that profound anyway.

Have you honestly never seen a tire cut into a chainstay or other frame piece?

 

[altix]

its not worse than the 06 v10s rear fender ripping off the first bottom out. although mine hasn't broken off yet...I'v seen many that have

also

 

[Pockets-o-Grey]

thats crazy.... glad i didnt go the way of the m6... might just be too early into devolpment. i wonder though what would happen when fully bottomed going at some speed or landing a somewhat flat drop... do u think the sudden impact of tire to frame would just buck the rider? ie kyle strait at crankworks. Perhaps it really is a for race only frame... like 20 days of riding max before that tire cuts through frame?

 

[jonKranked]

Have you honestly never seen a tire cut into a chainstay or other frame piece?

I've done it. But then again when I rode in the snow I would put reciprocating saw blades in my tires.

 

[kidwoo]

I've done it. But then again when I rode in the snow I would put reciprocating saw blades in my tires.

Angle grinder works too.


Really hooks up in mud. Just don't ever stop.

 

[jamesdc]

Most of the bikes I have owned including my current bike the tire contacts the seat tube at the end of the travel. It wears away the paint but I dont think it will wear away the frame for along time. You dont even notice when it contacts the frame.

 

[bdamschen]

My girlfriend's hollowpoint mtx had some tire clearance issues down by the chainstays and the previous owner ran tires that were a bit too large; there is a signifigant ammount of the frame worn away there. Tires will eat metal.

 

[gonefirefightin]

it is a new feature for that moto sound when descending the course to instil fear into your opponents and to snatch off your junk if you lean back to far. no need to get a vasectomy

 

[Kanye West]

James people notice when you ride by and it sounds like you just ripped @ss.

A tire on a nice slow bottom out spinning at WC speeds is MORE than capable of eating away at aluminum, especially if it's the usual spec'ed thin tubing that Intense uses. If it's hitting a bald 2.5" High Roller, anything more substantial will do some pretty bad stuff to it. Totally unacceptable for a $3k+ production frame to have clearance issues that there are such simple solutions for (tweak the seat tube position/angle so the seat ends up in the same place - not that damned hard).

 

[Santa Maria]

Here is the deal. My buddy and I have had our M6's for almost three weeks now. We noticed at full travel that the rear tire hits the frame (maxxis 2.5 highroller that is pretty bald) on our bikes. After many different tuning adjustments, we talked to intense about the issue. They told us that the tire does in fact hit the frame at full travel . They say this is due to the tight geometry that was accomplish while designing the bike. I guess that is why my BB height is a half I inch lower than advertised (13.34" BB height.) I wish I would have known this before buying the bike. This is my third intense bike and I have never had such an issue in the past. So just thought i would give the future M6 owners a heads up.

a high end frame at this price range should not have such issues

 

[Eurotrash]

I don't see it as too big of a problem compared to 06 V10 to links that rubbed against the frame and self destructed and current giant glory whose rear triangle hits the main frame on bottom out. Both these bikes have metal to metal contact on bottom out, I would take rubber to metal over that any day.

 

[FreeRide-Junkie]

I don't see it as too big of a problem compared to 06 V10 to links that rubbed against the frame and self destructed and current giant glory whose rear triangle hits the main frame on bottom out. Both these bikes have metal to metal contact on bottom out, I would take rubber to metal over that any day.

Ok.... so the lesser of two evils. Neither should happen though.

 

[Eren]

thats crazy.... glad i didnt go the way of the m6... might just be too early into devolpment. i wonder though what would happen when fully bottomed going at some speed or landing a somewhat flat drop... do u think the sudden impact of tire to frame would just buck the rider? ie kyle strait at crankworks. Perhaps it really is a for race only frame... like 20 days of riding max before that tire cuts through frame?

are you serious? 20 days on a frame. no company would put out a frame that lasts only 20 rides. FRO or not FRO they wouldnt do it. they know no one would buy them.



hope your not goin into business :biggrin:

 

[Eurotrash]

Ok.... so the lesser of two evils. Neither should happen though.

I totally agree. On the frame that some friends and I have designed, the software we used allowed us to see straight away if there would be any such problems. And now that the frames are beeing ridden there are no such problems.
But everyone seems to be jumping on Intense which is one of the smaller manufacturers out there, who have probably been working hard to get their frame out in time. Remember when the M3 was launched, they had a whole year where no M1s were made and the M3 wasn't out yet? I bet they didn't want to do that again.

Look at the example I mentioned: Giant is the biggest bike manufacturer in the world they make 9M bikes/year, the glory is in its third year of production and the problem still hasn't been fixed and never will be as there will be a new one coming out soon.(not a huge problem and the glory is one of the best bikes out there but still not excuseable)

I think people on here need to take a small step back. You have to balance the bling factor of having a new ride that very few people will have and the fact that you are goin to be guiney pigging especially when you buy something from a small manufacturer. I know I wouldn't buy a first generation fork from any of the top manufacturers.

Just my thoughts