I've been following Windrock developments for a coupla few years now and never had a chance to get down there til now. Two of us coming from DC, leaving tonight. Can't wait.
Windrock or bust from Washy DC
- Thread starter Stiff
- Start date
We're going to a have a group of about 10 or so up there. Introduce yourself!
The two of us hope to hook up with y'all. We're on a white VPfree/888 and blue Sinister R9/888. I have a van that can hold six bikes and riders but not sure if shuttles require 4wd or not.
Not sure when we'll get there. We might hit SS on way back to DC, or Roanoke or Hburg VA so not sure if 1 or 2 days in TN.
How much is there to ride now at WR?
I've ridden DH all over the world -- British Columbia, Chile, Korea, Bolivia, New Zealand, Bootleg, Bromont, eastern US ski resorts, etc -- and it'll be good to compare WR: the vids and pics look world class and we need a new trail fix. Can't wait!
Not sure when we'll get there. We might hit SS on way back to DC, or Roanoke or Hburg VA so not sure if 1 or 2 days in TN.
How much is there to ride now at WR?
I've ridden DH all over the world -- British Columbia, Chile, Korea, Bolivia, New Zealand, Bootleg, Bromont, eastern US ski resorts, etc -- and it'll be good to compare WR: the vids and pics look world class and we need a new trail fix. Can't wait!
Thanks Jeffro - will be good to finally ride with you after all these years. Heading out the door now.
next time, stiff and i are going to plan a little bit more ahead of time to organize shuttles. we were kind of stuck up there with some slower than wanted shuttle turn-around times, but at least with good folks 
we didn't really plan this trip in advance and kind of decided at the last minute to head out to windrock.
the trails were a blast to ride... the upper windmill section was very fast and flowy. i wish there were more trails that were "open" though... it wasn't as technical as i thought it would be. steep dirt chutes and off camber dusty turns made things a bit tricky compared to our super steep sustained rock faces and choppy rock gardens up here at our local spot that is vertically challenged compared to windrock. let us know if any of you locals are up in the NoVa/DC area and want to ride. there are a few pretty good trails up here if you know the right folks to take you down them.
here are the only windrock photos we managed to take time to snap:
atvs on their way up!
stiff going down the rock face.
me hitting one of the freeride jumps...
we didn't really plan this trip in advance and kind of decided at the last minute to head out to windrock. the trails were a blast to ride... the upper windmill section was very fast and flowy. i wish there were more trails that were "open" though... it wasn't as technical as i thought it would be. steep dirt chutes and off camber dusty turns made things a bit tricky compared to our super steep sustained rock faces and choppy rock gardens up here at our local spot that is vertically challenged compared to windrock. let us know if any of you locals are up in the NoVa/DC area and want to ride. there are a few pretty good trails up here if you know the right folks to take you down them.
here are the only windrock photos we managed to take time to snap:
atvs on their way up!
stiff going down the rock face.
me hitting one of the freeride jumps...
Did you guys ever hit the lower dropoff runs? On Sunday, we hit the ungroomed but rideable Southern Rocks which is a half mile long non-stop rock garden and way gnarlier than what you guys rode. You'll have to make sure to get your fill of it next time.
About the shuttle - sorry if I or anybody in our crew came off as dicks but I told Steve before we started riding that our crew would get dibs on the runs but if/when we had room y'all were welcome to hop on. You should've said something once bike/body part attrition set in - nobody ever asked to hop on once the crowd thinned that I know of. That said, because of coaching first timers and addressing bike issues trailside, our turnaround wasn't much better than yours. It's usually just Brady (Turner DHR, truck owner), Brian (new DHi) and Jason (Big Hit) so the runs come around quicker.
Edit: Road gap footage
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=1958152077256257096
About the shuttle - sorry if I or anybody in our crew came off as dicks but I told Steve before we started riding that our crew would get dibs on the runs but if/when we had room y'all were welcome to hop on. You should've said something once bike/body part attrition set in - nobody ever asked to hop on once the crowd thinned that I know of. That said, because of coaching first timers and addressing bike issues trailside, our turnaround wasn't much better than yours. It's usually just Brady (Turner DHR, truck owner), Brian (new DHi) and Jason (Big Hit) so the runs come around quicker.
Edit: Road gap footage
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=1958152077256257096
there is not a lot of freeride built up stuff up there. looooong descents... about 3 times as long as anything at the watershed. as far as technical, it depends on what you mean. if you mean riding steep rock faces then no.... nothing of that sort that i know of or was told exists currently at windrock. there are doubles and drops, but nothing we ran across was super scary. keep in mind though that we didn't hit ALL the trails since some were closed off... so i'm only speaking only from my experience of riding the handful of trails off the windmills and waterfall trail network. stiff and i are also "expert" riders and this place is definitely not a place to bring a beginner.
most of the trails were smooth and had a LOT of flow to them. it was a blast to ride. to me, it felt almost like riding a plattekill trail (except replace the steep shale with dust) on top of the massanutten race course for about a total of 10-15 minutes from top-to-bottom depending on where you started. good stuff, but have your shuttle situation set up before making the trip out there.
most of the trails were smooth and had a LOT of flow to them. it was a blast to ride. to me, it felt almost like riding a plattekill trail (except replace the steep shale with dust) on top of the massanutten race course for about a total of 10-15 minutes from top-to-bottom depending on where you started. good stuff, but have your shuttle situation set up before making the trip out there.
no, we didn't get to the southern rocks. we were told it was closed. the waterfall trail was a lot of fun that led to the road gap.
i understand about the shuttle situation. once we set up with the folks we were riding with, we didn't want to just leave them hanging since they were cool. we will definitely have to make a trek out there again sometime. we usually ride locally with about 5-6 fast folks (stiff, _bp, DBR, etc...) and take turns as shuttle b*tch to make it the most efficient and fun... especially with our limited vert.
we got off to a bad start because the guys that we did our first run with led us in the wrong direction up the mountain to set up a shuttle that killed about an hour.
i'll be out that way toward the end of june and will probably either bring my r9 or my semi-DH worthy heckler that i raced most of the MAC series and rode at diablo, whiteface, and bromont with all last year. i swap out wheel sets to do all mountain or DH with the 66 and DHX air.
Yeah, trail network is definitely being put together with a lot of thought. My favorite was upper windmill - super pinnable - although I personally usually go for the rockpicking gnarl that seems to be out of favor with the kids these days.
JeffD - No we didn't see that rock garden but I think we hit all the other open trails.
G1ant - WR to me seems like E in feel and flow, but 3x as long. Nothing like Pantyline or Tosser or the so-called drop trails.
Tech question: we were aching to do top-to-bottom non-stops from the Windfarm to the end, and when we did, Will and I both had total frno and back brake loss at the same exact point, just a couple hundred yards up from the lower parking lot/staging area. We're both running Juicy 7s. Anyone else have this problem? With non-stop runs, fluid has less time to cool down, and this is going to be critical when we hit British Columbia in August. Two natural trails I know are vertical miles and sustained steeps and I'd prefer to do full non-stop runs because nothing's better than that drug. I'm thinking of getting Codes or even Avid mechs....
JeffD - No we didn't see that rock garden but I think we hit all the other open trails.
G1ant - WR to me seems like E in feel and flow, but 3x as long. Nothing like Pantyline or Tosser or the so-called drop trails.
Tech question: we were aching to do top-to-bottom non-stops from the Windfarm to the end, and when we did, Will and I both had total frno and back brake loss at the same exact point, just a couple hundred yards up from the lower parking lot/staging area. We're both running Juicy 7s. Anyone else have this problem? With non-stop runs, fluid has less time to cool down, and this is going to be critical when we hit British Columbia in August. Two natural trails I know are vertical miles and sustained steeps and I'd prefer to do full non-stop runs because nothing's better than that drug. I'm thinking of getting Codes or even Avid mechs....
I run J7s but have experiuenced the opposite - mine tend to pump a little on the windmill trail. Sometimes enough that if/when a slow moment comes around, I'll franticlaly spin the reach adjusters out between hits to keep the lever engagaement point close to the bars.
you didn't ride any of the burly stuff at Windrock apparently. Dark Hollow, Southern Rocks, etc. Next time you come, speak up and ask a true local to show you the trails. If there's one thing Joey will do, it's show people every nook and cranny.
I'm a first year Code user coming off Juicy 7's last year and they did fade less. Not sure I noticed any fade...just pad wear by days end meaning I had to spin the contact adjuster. And the pad contact adjuster on the Code's works quick. I had to spin them once all day.
i did notice that my juicy 7s got a little pumped a few times, but when we say fade... they completely faded away. after sitting still for a few minutes and bringing in the pad adjustment, they were super tight when they finally cooled off and i had to back them out again.
it was really strange that they completely faded at the same spot on the mountain and both brakes on both bikes at the same time.
it was really strange that they completely faded at the same spot on the mountain and both brakes on both bikes at the same time.
sounds good! were you guys hitting those runs on saturday?
we saw a bunch of shuttles set up at the waterfall. the trail above the waterfall on the other side of the road looked
. we were told that that section was closed due to a gas line or something? say it ain't so!As mentioned, we hit Southern Rocks on Sunday. It had some leaves and a little deadfall but was rideable. Brady made a good observation - when in doubt because of heavy leaves, look for the rocks with the chainguide scars on them and head that way.
Dark Hollow isn't anywhere near rideable right now from what I saw of it.
The upper rockgarden above the waterfall is permanenently closed. Sucks big time but aside from the water line or whatever went in, I think Joey wanted to do away with all the road crossings for safetly reasons. That said, Southern rocks is basically five minutes straight worth of that rock garden you saw.
Dark Hollow isn't anywhere near rideable right now from what I saw of it.
The upper rockgarden above the waterfall is permanenently closed. Sucks big time but aside from the water line or whatever went in, I think Joey wanted to do away with all the road crossings for safetly reasons. That said, Southern rocks is basically five minutes straight worth of that rock garden you saw.
Yesterday I realized I have had my brake levers too close to the grips.
The old index finger doesn't get as much leverage when it's pulling closer to the brake lever pivot.
Alex and Garret really enjoyed it. Garret is now in the market for a DH rig.
On the way home I almost bet Garret $20 he couldn't eat a quadruple Whopper. Not only did he eat it but he also ate a chicken sandwich as an appitizer.
Must be nice to be 18, throw your body on the ground all day, eat 1/3 of your body weight in fast food and not feel any of it.
The old index finger doesn't get as much leverage when it's pulling closer to the brake lever pivot.
Alex and Garret really enjoyed it. Garret is now in the market for a DH rig.
On the way home I almost bet Garret $20 he couldn't eat a quadruple Whopper. Not only did he eat it but he also ate a chicken sandwich as an appitizer.
Must be nice to be 18, throw your body on the ground all day, eat 1/3 of your body weight in fast food and not feel any of it.
first of all.
another big round of thanks to brady for his dodge shuttle mule.
he always seems to be there with it when the crowds are as big as they were this past weekend.
and with fuel costs being what they are, that's more of an effort than ever.
thanks.
as far as some of the older trails are concerned, nobody is more dissapointed that all of them aren't open and groomed to my standards than myself.
there's so many combinations of steep gnarly runs that i miss terribly.
darkhollow.
southernrocks.
middlefinger.
railyard.
trail 14 to twisted.
and everything above the waterfall is more than likely gone for good.
all of these above runs are as steep, rocky and as high speed as it gets.
it's just now we have so much to maintain.
and i just recentlly spent 35-36 hrs. over the last two previous weekends and a weekday just getting the entire windmill trail weedeated and cleaned.
that leaves zero time to work on the other trails.
and now after some stuff was busted up on upper windmill, i'll be spending next weekend and a few $$$ to get that section to where it's rideable by a wider skill range than as it sets now with that new jump and sketchy landing zone.
pre-planning as whale said, is the key to quick turnarounds here.
for the most part shuttling is pre-arranged and a self sufficient system.
and having your bike properly built and prepped before you get here goes along way too.
waiting until you get here to realize that your brakes suck, puts a slowdown to the turnaround for everybody.
FRONT brakes are vital up here to control runaway speed.
after the repairs to upper windmill are complete.
southernrocks is the next cleaning project.
after that, it'll just be maintaning what's open for the rest of the year.
that's going to be a good size project as it is.
another big round of thanks to brady for his dodge shuttle mule.
he always seems to be there with it when the crowds are as big as they were this past weekend.
and with fuel costs being what they are, that's more of an effort than ever.
thanks.
as far as some of the older trails are concerned, nobody is more dissapointed that all of them aren't open and groomed to my standards than myself.
there's so many combinations of steep gnarly runs that i miss terribly.
darkhollow.
southernrocks.
middlefinger.
railyard.
trail 14 to twisted.
and everything above the waterfall is more than likely gone for good.
all of these above runs are as steep, rocky and as high speed as it gets.
it's just now we have so much to maintain.
and i just recentlly spent 35-36 hrs. over the last two previous weekends and a weekday just getting the entire windmill trail weedeated and cleaned.
that leaves zero time to work on the other trails.
and now after some stuff was busted up on upper windmill, i'll be spending next weekend and a few $$$ to get that section to where it's rideable by a wider skill range than as it sets now with that new jump and sketchy landing zone.
pre-planning as whale said, is the key to quick turnarounds here.
for the most part shuttling is pre-arranged and a self sufficient system.
and having your bike properly built and prepped before you get here goes along way too.
waiting until you get here to realize that your brakes suck, puts a slowdown to the turnaround for everybody.
FRONT brakes are vital up here to control runaway speed.
after the repairs to upper windmill are complete.
southernrocks is the next cleaning project.
after that, it'll just be maintaning what's open for the rest of the year.
that's going to be a good size project as it is.
thanks a ton for all the effort you put in. you guys are truly blessed with terrain to work with up there.
Windmill is one of my favorites but i'd suck to eat it bad on that new jump, it's a long walk down to the parking lot.
can't wait to get back up there.
it's going to be a long, tough three or four hikes to get all the lumber etc... up there to fix that section.
but it'll be done right and will fit into the rest of the trails flow.
i'll cantilever out a tapered landing ramp that shorten up that gap from twelve to around eight ft. and yet still have good runout for the faster riders.
just like the roadgap.
again.
riding the trail at normal (a relative term) trail speed will get you over it.
but it'll be done right and will fit into the rest of the trails flow.
i'll cantilever out a tapered landing ramp that shorten up that gap from twelve to around eight ft. and yet still have good runout for the faster riders.
just like the roadgap.
again.
riding the trail at normal (a relative term) trail speed will get you over it.
Hey Joey...1 suggestion. A warning sign before the road gap. The one kid got out of sync with the guys he was riding with and followed me, Brady and Greg and somebody else down Trail 1 and didn't know what was coming up. We didn't know to tell him b/c everyone else had seen it. But b/c he'd been out with brake probs all day, he'd never even been down that section.
He got hurt pretty bad. Not your fault for no sign or our fault for not telling him. Nobody thought twice about it. We were just freight training one last run with no stops and "poot"....
He got hurt pretty bad. Not your fault for no sign or our fault for not telling him. Nobody thought twice about it. We were just freight training one last run with no stops and "poot"....
Joey: were you holding out on a new jump on the Windmill trail? I don't remember anything with 12 foot gap
here's my take on signage.
hear me out on this one.
on a full run without stopping, a sign is worthless.
as you're focusing on the trailbed that's coming up at speed and reading signs is a little out of the question at that moment.
i've had trail signs in various areas before, and most never saw them.
and i never ever like hearing about anyone getting hurt on my trails.
but just about every local here has done major emergency room time.
it's just the way it is.
this isn't a resort trail system by any means.
you have to be fully aware of the trails and your surroundings up here. (in more ways than you know.)
riding into sections blind on any trail system let alone this one, is a recipe for disaster.
it goes back to one of the paragraphs in my rules sticky about being honest with yourself about your abilities on a bike.
butch.
you have to figure that you and your riding partners are experienced downhill riders.
on a x-c ride you have time to ease up and look after lesser skilled riders.
but when you drop the hammer here or any d.h. trail.
it's game on and there just isn't the opportunity to look out for others or hold hands.
i've said before, this place was built by experienced riders for experienced riders. with no though given for lesser abilities than those up here building the trails.
anyone know what his outcome was ?
hear me out on this one.
on a full run without stopping, a sign is worthless.
as you're focusing on the trailbed that's coming up at speed and reading signs is a little out of the question at that moment.
i've had trail signs in various areas before, and most never saw them.
and i never ever like hearing about anyone getting hurt on my trails.
but just about every local here has done major emergency room time.
it's just the way it is.
this isn't a resort trail system by any means.
you have to be fully aware of the trails and your surroundings up here. (in more ways than you know.)
riding into sections blind on any trail system let alone this one, is a recipe for disaster.
it goes back to one of the paragraphs in my rules sticky about being honest with yourself about your abilities on a bike.
butch.
you have to figure that you and your riding partners are experienced downhill riders.
on a x-c ride you have time to ease up and look after lesser skilled riders.
but when you drop the hammer here or any d.h. trail.
it's game on and there just isn't the opportunity to look out for others or hold hands.
i've said before, this place was built by experienced riders for experienced riders. with no though given for lesser abilities than those up here building the trails.
anyone know what his outcome was ?
a bridge up there that we've been sailing over at speed since that trail opened, was torn up by slower riders.
and some numbskull took a few of the loose boards and stood them up to block to trail.
i came ripping down into it only to see a barricade blocking a hole that 99% of downhillers wouldn't have even noticed as they flew over it.
terry and i had talked before about it not even needing to be there if a small jump was placed in front of it.
but you know me.
i'm not too good at building small jumps.
so now there's a large jump before the second powerline crossing.
i'll finish it off this weekend.
Maybe we can get together and play checkers or something.
(my cast is already itchy)
Not more than my itch to ride though.
Quote--"a sign is worthless"
I'm not entirely sure what windrock has against signs, but its time that somebody implements them. Not only are there no warning signs prior to stunts, road gap, broken bridges. There are no signs on the shuttle road to lead you to the trails. For the first timers it's a pain in the ass.
Clearly Windrock is becoming more and more popular and with that comes increased stress on the trails. With that being said there needs to be an increase in safety regulations. If certain sections are washed out and in dire need of repair.....CLOSE THEM. Don't throw some skethcy ass jump to a death landing. And I rode over this thing as it was broken and did notice that the last 3-4 planks were missing. Not cool.
I'm not entirely sure what windrock has against signs, but its time that somebody implements them. Not only are there no warning signs prior to stunts, road gap, broken bridges. There are no signs on the shuttle road to lead you to the trails. For the first timers it's a pain in the ass.
Clearly Windrock is becoming more and more popular and with that comes increased stress on the trails. With that being said there needs to be an increase in safety regulations. If certain sections are washed out and in dire need of repair.....CLOSE THEM. Don't throw some skethcy ass jump to a death landing. And I rode over this thing as it was broken and did notice that the last 3-4 planks were missing. Not cool.
i'm pretty sure that when i paid my $15 to access windrock this weekend that those proceeds didn't go to the trailbuilders. they do it on their own time and $$ for people like us to access it.
...and even if a chunk of that does go to some of the trailbuilders, you aren't riding at a resort and shouldn't expect that type of service. if you are riding snowshoe, mountain creek, whiteface, whistler, etc... there should be signs. resorts publicly advertise their trails and windrock is just a spot where DH biking has been accepted.
i always check out our local trails for a warm-up run before hitting them full speed. it's probably smart to do the same thing at most places you ride. if there is an unsafe looking stunt or section that someone hasn't gotten around to fixing, don't hit it.
Joey. I agree with that line of thinking. Now that you mention it, we can't have any bright blue arrow signs blinking in the sky like on Gran Turismo to indicate a place to hit the "B" button. You're right that "Ride at your own risk" is inherent with MTB. Signage shouldn't be a responsibility.
For the sake of repeat visitors and "newbie's", signs to indicate trail names would be great, but hard to keep up and let alone even notice on your way down the mountain. Heck, Snowshoe and Diablo have tons of yellow signs for trails, but I don't even notice them til about my 3rd run down.
As for your comments about safety regulations, there are NONE. And there should be NONE! Ride at your own risk! Take responsibility for your own self. Take responsibility for your actions.
Never assume a bridge is working. Never assume there isn't a gap around a corner. Never assume a trail isn't washed out.
Never assume a rock hasn't moved into a blind, off camber corner.
Take care of yourself. If you wreck or are injured, take responsibility.
If someone puts sharp pointed sticks in the trail at waist level...(OK...that was overboard.)
Safety regulations increase your liabilities. Joey, Windrock and Coal Creek have no liability to anyone.
i can only imagine what would happen if i put signage all up the road leading every renegade a.t.v. and moto rider right up to our singletrack.
oh yeah, that'd be good.
and as far as the trails are concerned.
a 50 yr. old man is designing, building and rippin the snot out of every inch of trail up here.
don't take your frustration with your lack of skills out on me pal.
i think i'd rather you go and find someplace else suitable to your needs.
as i'm not in the day care buisness.
oh yeah, that'd be good.
and as far as the trails are concerned.
a 50 yr. old man is designing, building and rippin the snot out of every inch of trail up here.
don't take your frustration with your lack of skills out on me pal.
i think i'd rather you go and find someplace else suitable to your needs.
as i'm not in the day care buisness.
"zinger"
"Running a day care? Lack of Skills? Place more suitable for my needs? Bragging, ego, and pride. Oh yeah that's why I never talk biking online. I've ridden and will continue to flash 99% of Windrock.
We're all refreshed and challenged by your unique point of view. Lets try to stay focused. Just a few signs here and there for certain sections, not lighting up the place like WalMart.
We're all refreshed and challenged by your unique point of view. Lets try to stay focused. Just a few signs here and there for certain sections, not lighting up the place like WalMart.
Wow isn't ridemonkey grand yal? hehehehehehh
with all the whining in your last post, no other conclusion can be drawn.
i mean it was you cryin like a little girl because of a few boards missing off of a bridge.
and blubbering like a coward because of a jump you couldn't hit.
am i wrong ??
and if you felt so strongly about this, why didn't you come bitch to me in person.
i was out there all weekend.
here's the deal.
i won't put up any signs.
and you won't come back here ever again.
