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Bin Laden is Dead!!!

syadasti

syadasti

i heart mac
Apr 15, 2002
12,690
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VT
dante said:
I'm less concerned about the morality of actions as I'm a bit more of a "ends justify the means" kind of guy. It's been noted that it appears that "enhanced interrogation" techniques probably didn't lead to the killing, but of course that's not going to stop the Republicans claiming it did.

I just wish that we could have a rational conversation about a) whether it works and b) whether it's legal. I don't see that happening *anytime* soon though...
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Rumsfeld confirms, "enhanced interrogation" did not produce the intel:

http://www.newsmax.com/Headline/DonaldRumsfeld-gitmo-waterboarding-osamabinladen/2011/05/02/id/394820

Asked if harsh interrogation techniques at Guantanamo Bay played a role in obtaining intelligence on bin Laden’s whereabouts, Rumsfeld declares: “First of all, no one was waterboarded at Guantanamo Bay. That’s a myth that’s been perpetrated around the country by critics.

“The United States Department of Defense did not do waterboarding for interrogation purposes to anyone. It is true that some information that came from normal interrogation approaches at Guantanamo did lead to information that was beneficial in this instance. But it was not harsh treatment and it was not waterboarding.”
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JohnE

JohnE

filthy rascist
May 13, 2005
13,452
1,980
Front Range, dude...
"I mourn the loss of thousands of precious lives, but I will not rejoice in the death of one, not even an enemy. Returning hate for hate multiplies hate, adding deeper darkness to a night already devoid of stars. Darkness cannot drive out darkness: only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate: only love can do that."

--Martin Luther King, Jr.
 
$tinkle

$tinkle

Expert on blowing
Feb 12, 2003
14,591
6
syadasti said:
Rumsfeld confirms, "enhanced interrogation" did not produce the intel:
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leon says, "hold on, girl!"
“We had multiple series of sources that provided information with regards to this situation… clearly some of it came from detainees [and] they used these enhanced interrogation techniques against some of those detainees,” he told NBC anchor Brian Williams.

When asked by Williams if water-boarding was part of the “enhanced interrogation techniques,” Panetta simply said “that’s correct.”
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http://dailycaller.com/2011/05/03/torturous-evasions/
 
JohnE

JohnE

filthy rascist
May 13, 2005
13,452
1,980
Front Range, dude...
"The United States Department of Defense did not do waterboarding for interrogation purposes to anyone."

So it was done as a punitive measure? Or was it just for fun? Don is still a dick...
 
kidwoo

kidwoo

Artisanal Tweet Curator
Aug 25, 2003
42,146
13,340
Squirtin ketchup n' mustard on charred flesh
JohnE said:
"I mourn the loss of thousands of precious lives, but I will not rejoice in the death of one, not even an enemy. Returning hate for hate multiplies hate, adding deeper darkness to a night already devoid of stars. Darkness cannot drive out darkness: only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate: only love can do that."

--Martin Luther King, Jr.
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http://weblogs.baltimoresun.com/entertainment/books/blog/2011/05/martin_luther_king_fake_quotef.html

Martin Luther King fake quote/faked Osama death
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IH8Rice

IH8Rice

I'm Mr. Negative! I Fail!
Aug 2, 2008
24,524
494
Im over here now
JohnE said:
"I mourn the loss of thousands of precious lives, but I will not rejoice in the death of one, not even an enemy. Returning hate for hate multiplies hate, adding deeper darkness to a night already devoid of stars. Darkness cannot drive out darkness: only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate: only love can do that."

--Martin Luther King, Jr.
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nothing like fake quotes going around the internets
http://www.theatlantic.com/national/archive/2011/05/anatomy-of-a-fake-quotation/238257/
 
syadasti

syadasti

i heart mac
Apr 15, 2002
12,690
290
VT
$tinkle said:
leon says, "hold on, girl!"

“We had multiple series of sources that provided information with regards to this situation… clearly some of it came from detainees [and] they used these enhanced interrogation techniques against some of those detainees,” he told NBC anchor Brian Williams.

When asked by Williams if water-boarding was part of the “enhanced interrogation techniques,” Panetta simply said “that’s correct.”
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http://dailycaller.com/2011/05/03/torturous-evasions/
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So a supposition that a subset of a subset which had EIT which includes waterboarding (multitiple sources, some of some) - the language is so clear, and his assumption is better than Rumsfelds direct assertion (funny how I8Rice can't read who said what?)

So which is it, the GWB administration had the information via waterboarding but was incompetent and couldn't act on it or they didn't get information vital to his capture?

“Multiple detainees have given us insights into networks of people who might have been close to Bin Laden. And beyond detainee reporting, solid information derived from other sources over many years ultimately helped solve an incredibly complex puzzle,” Vietor says. “The bottom line is this: If we had some kind of smoking gun intelligence from waterboarding in 2003, we would have taken out Osama bin Laden in 2003. So this argument just doesn’t make a lot of sense.”
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JohnE

JohnE

filthy rascist
May 13, 2005
13,452
1,980
Front Range, dude...
IH8Rice said:
nothing like fake quotes going around the internets
http://www.theatlantic.com/national/archive/2011/05/anatomy-of-a-fake-quotation/238257/
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Its the thought that counts you clowns...sheesh. How about this from MLK.

"Returning hate for hate multiplies hate, adding deeper darkness to a night already devoid of stars. Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that. Hate multiplies hate, violence multiplies violence, and toughness multiplies toughness in a descending spiral of destruction."
--Martin Luther King Jr., Christmas 1957.

Since when did this place become grade 10 English class?
 
$tinkle

$tinkle

Expert on blowing
Feb 12, 2003
14,591
6
i find it odd mlk can be quoted all day long without even a whiff of offense, neverminding that the bible was his primary source of wisdom

carry on...
 
stevew

stevew

resident influencer
Sep 21, 2001
40,617
9,620
JohnE said:
Its the thought that counts you clowns...sheesh. How about this from MLK.

"Returning hate for hate multiplies hate, adding deeper darkness to a night already devoid of stars. Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that. Hate multiplies hate, violence multiplies violence, and toughness multiplies toughness in a descending spiral of destruction."
--Martin Luther King Jr., Christmas 1957.

Since when did this place become grade 10 English class?
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500 ml of vagisil stat!
 
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B

ballbarian

Chimp
Aug 12, 2010
12
0
ABQ
Do you guys think we should have waited to announce his death? We prolly could have rounded up a few more bad guys from the data on the computers if they knew Osama wasn't dead.
 
IH8Rice

IH8Rice

I'm Mr. Negative! I Fail!
Aug 2, 2008
24,524
494
Im over here now
ballbarian said:
Do you guys think we should have waited to announce his death? We prolly could have rounded up a few more bad guys from the data on the computers if they knew Osama wasn't dead.
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im sure the Pakistani military/government would have warned the rest of the terrorist after they heard a gunfight :rolleyes:
 
Pesqueeb

Pesqueeb

bicycle in airplane hangar
Feb 2, 2007
40,367
16,855
Riding the baggage carousel.
ballbarian said:
Do you guys think we should have waited to announce his death? We prolly could have rounded up a few more bad guys from the data on the computers if they knew Osama wasn't dead.
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I'd kind of wondered about that myself. Cause you know every motherfvcker in the al-Qaida system grabbed their shi* and split the second they heard the news. How many other a-holes could they have nailed if they sat on the news for a week? Though I guess they'd of heard about it when somebody went to the compound and found the blood smeared all over the floor.

*edit, Ih8rice also makes a valid point.
 
B

ballbarian

Chimp
Aug 12, 2010
12
0
ABQ
Pesqueeb said:
I'd kind of wondered about that myself. Cause you know every motherfvcker in the al-Qaida system grabbed their shi* and split the second they heard the news. How many other a-holes could they have nailed if they sat on the news for a week?
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They would have had time to replace the word "Geronimo" with something a little more PC... :D
 
Andyman_1970

Andyman_1970

Turbo Monkey
Apr 4, 2003
3,105
5
The Natural State
IH8Rice said:
there is also a "dish" covering the non-conventional tail rotor, smoothed out panels and purported main rotor mods to slow them down and make them quieter.


we be sneaking up on you with our stealthz
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Probably not so much quieter, as the blade tips would still be travelling at the same velocity, but more like to reduce the RCS with all the spinning metal bits at the tail rotor hub.

As they were close to the Islamabad MEZ (missle engagement zone) this might be an "add on" stealth kit.......very interesting for sure.......
 
IH8Rice

IH8Rice

I'm Mr. Negative! I Fail!
Aug 2, 2008
24,524
494
Im over here now
Andyman_1970 said:
Probably not so much quieter, as the blade tips would still be travelling at the same velocity, but more like to reduce the RCS with all the spinning metal bits at the tail rotor hub.
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...or possibly using more rotors to reduce noise?
Noise can be reduced and made less conspicuous by adding blades to the main and tail rotors. It can also be reduced by aerodynamic modifications and flight control changes that make it possible to reduce rotor rpm, particularly in forward flight below maximum speed. Infrared reduction measures are crucial - the Comanche had an elaborate system of exhaust ducts and fresh-air ejectors in its tailboom.

Radar cross-section (RCS) reduction measures include flattened and canted body sides, making landing gear and other features retractable, and adding fairings over the rotor hubs. It usually is not possible to achieve the same - you can’t make a helo as radar-stealthy as a fixed-wing airplane, but helicopters generally operate at low altitude in ground clutter. Reducing RCS also makes jamming more effective, whether from the aircraft itself or from a standoff jammer.
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http://www.aviationweek.com/aw/generic/story_channel.jsp?channel=defense&id=news/awx/2011/05/03/awx_05_03_2011_p0-318248.xml&headline=Bin Laden Raid May Have Exposed Stealth Helicopter
 
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