[A Grove]

Hey all..

This post is directed at anyone riding a fall guy.. or molly at that. I'm def. building up a deuce quad ride here in the next month and have a few questions..

Firstly, stays. Fall guy sits at 14.25" cs w/ 12" bb. Molly sits at a bit less aggressive/street at 14.70" cs w/ 12.30" BB... I want my ride to feel super "light" and want some quick aggressive geo. BUT... I also want it to be stable on the DJ's, etc.

Are 14" stays "too short" per 24" wheel standards? Realistically, I think you can build the frame to have almost identical geo to that of a newer BMX ride... but is it what is ideal?

This is more a post for my thoughts/to recieve feedback from those who ride what I'm lookin' for...

Thanks.

 

[swerve76]

I have a molly. I ride mostly street and some park. The cs length feels perfect to me. I think you start to take away stability with shorter chainstays. 14" for a 24 seems too short.

 

[A Grove]

I was thinking that it might almost be "too short" at some point as well. But I want a bike that can hit up the skatepark and feel like it belongs where as on my current ride it just feels too big and bulky.

 

[v-digit]

i've been riding a fallguy for years. best frame i've ever had and i've had a few. stable, pops like a dream and the quality is superb.

 

[don]

The Molly is one of a very very small number of frames that I have bought twice. I have the rear axle all the way forward in the chainstays and it works good for me. Very tossible bike but stable too.

 

[Stoked]

after riding these frames, i think you could feel comfy with 14" stays. i rode a 24 w/ 13.75 stays and it felt stable. i wouldn't want to go any shorter haha.

fallguy is such a wild frame. fit and finish is second to non.

 

[cmc]

A Grove, what do you ride right now ?

If you're coming off a 26" the Molly will feel very quick to pull up. The combination of a shorter cs and a smaller wheel makes a big difference.

 

[A Grove]

Riding a boat of a two-six now. Long frontend, but short ass. Its pretty fun on the jumps... but park/street it really sucks. I ride a lot of tight DJ's made for twenties so a deuce-quad would work wonders methinks....

 

[sittingduck]

NS capital looks nice too. I've been eyeballing this thing, wishing I had a spare $1200.....

http://www.pinkbike.com/buysell/387587/

 

[pastcaring]

I loved my molly! Ran it with a nem-pro maz, lowered to 80mm.Thought the 14.7 cs were perfect. I now run a Brooklyn acl 14.25 cs but run it at 14.5.
Haven't had much time on the acl due to a ****ed ankle, so may end up slammed.

 

[A Grove]

Awesome man, thanks for the info.


Everyone...Feel free to post up some pics of your set-ups as well. Shameless bike porn never hurt anyone

 

[Stoked]

don't have to ask me twice haha. a few little things are different, pics are a lil old.

 

[Landon]

Definitely possible to go shorter than 14" on one of these bikes with a yoke.

The FG is 14.25", has ample tire clearance, can achieve an appropriate chain-line and run up to a 30t sprocket.


Where'd you get 12" BB height for the FG? That's wrong.

It has 0 BB drop. Hey..there's actually information about it on our new site?!?!?

As far as stability on trails...it's generally the nut behind the bars which determines that more than anything else.

Nathan is a damn good trails rider, and he prefers a FG.
New Fall Guy on dirt.

 

[A Grove]

Well.. being in my "learning phase" I had figured that 0 BB drop meant that it would be at the same level as f&r axle... Being it sits on 24" wheels, I got it to be 12". I must have something wrong, how much Dia. does an actual tire add? Never really measured myself...

Thanks for the pics, all!

EDIT:: How big of tire-clearance do these things have? I'm thinking enough for a 2.5 is ample enough...

 

[Mr Tiles]

If I were to go back up in wheel diameter, it'd be another molly simply b/c it just felt right for me. I was able manual that bike like nobody's bidnez. Sorta miss the ol' gal from time to time. I'm totally hooked on da twenties though...

 

[A Grove]

Sick molly dude!! I figure I'll be making my transition down to twenties in a year or two... but I figure can't hurt to do it gradually

 

[A Grove]

Here are some pics of what I've been tryin out lately.. an old diamondback cruiser. Not great geo for street/park by any means, but it definitally holds it own in the jumps!! Its a fun ride.. Just want to refine it of sorts.

and a fun lil snow jump I built in a measely ten minutes...

Riding this cruiser has really got me aching to try out a dialed deuce-quad frame for sure....

 

[t1maglio]

Hey. My link to my Tonic is below. Totally good with short stays, I would be happy to go a tad shorter to be honest. Long stays, to me, make sense for racing stuff, hauling and lifting up for roller and whatever, but for all other purposes I like tight backends.

 

[grom-dom]

the molly is far more street oriented than the fall guy is.

 

[jerseydirt]

don't have to ask me twice haha. a few little things are different, pics are a lil old.

Hey man are those the boon trails? Your bike looks sick.
I wish I lived an hour closer to those, I would be very happy to throw down some digging time to ride those.

 

[t1maglio]

the molly is far more street oriented than the fall guy is.

If your talking street in the grinding sense, then I would agree, but if your talking about manualing and flickability (short back end) not to mention a lower bbrkt (and I believe a steeper HT, but I could be wrong on that) then I would say the FG might be better. Just depends on what sort of "street" you ride.

If you want a beefier bike, then yes, the Molly would be better.

 

[swerve76]

not to mention a lower bbrkt (and I believe a steeper HT, but I could be wrong on that)

The molly has a steeper head angle.

 

[t1maglio]

^^^^^

True. .75 degrees difference. Fork height can play into that as well, but with frame builder specs you have .75 difference.

 

[Cru Jones]

Where'd you get 12" BB height for the FG? That's wrong.

It has 0 BB drop. Hey..there's actually information about it on our new site?!?!?

I also thought 0 bb drop was the same as a 12" high bb on 24s. Are we missing something?

 

[Landon]

If you are into pegs / grinds / steeper HT angles / 990's the Molly is a (far) better choice.

Horses for Courses.

To me, a clicked euro 6 ft out of the Arvey Wall is very heavy street move. The Fall Guy frame in this photo has been holding up fine to this sort of riding.

As for BB height...

I don't want to be Captain Obvious..but tires change BB height.

Cru...check the drawing of your Cruiser. Specifically the wheel radius.

If your bike had zero drop with those tires, what would the BB height be?

-L

 

[Bicyclist]

I also thought 0 bb drop was the same as a 12" high bb on 24s. Are we missing something?

Tire height...

 

[Cru Jones]

Tire height...

Yeah, but even with the tire height, the total wheel height is roughly 24 inches, depending on the tire, right? Making the bb 12" high. Is 0 bb drop just a more accurate way to say it to account for varying tire sizes?

 

[Bicyclist]

Nah, the wheel is 24" w/o a tire. Add the tire sidewall and you've got maybe an extra inch of height.

BB drop is more accurate, since it negates tire height differences.

 

[Cru Jones]

Nah, the wheel is 24" w/o a tire. Add the tire sidewall and you've got maybe an extra inch of height.

You sure about that? I have a 24" wheel sitting right next to me. Bottom of tire to top of tire is about 24.25" (it has a 2.2 dmr moto tire on it). Bottom of wheel to top of wheel (without tire) is less than 21". I think all wheel sizes include an average tire height.

 

[Bicyclist]

You might be right, I've honestly never bothered to measure.

Although on second thought, that would make sense, given the 700c/29er rim thing...

 

[Landon]

I think the point is that that tire radius is all over the board. That "board" is about 3/8" of an inch.

Now that most frames are designed around a low suspension fork (460 is somewhat of a standard), BB drop is a little better way to describe BB height I think. Could be wrong though.

-L

 

[Cru Jones]

I think the point is that that tire radius is all over the board. That "board" is about 3/8" of an inch.

Now that most frames are designed around a low suspension fork (460 is somewhat of a standard), BB drop is a little better way to describe BB height I think. Could be wrong though.

-L

Makes sense. Definitely seems more accurate. I just think that people understand that a 12" high bb (in this case, and regardless if the measurement is actually 12") is basically a different way of saying 0 bb drop. I think it's understood that varying tire sizes and fork heights play into that. On the other hand, if you had a 420 a2c fork on the bike and the zero drop was based around a 460 fork... it wouldn't be 0 drop anymore. Ahhhh... geeky bike stuff. Just wanted to make sure I wasn't totally missing something.

 

[buckoW]

I think bb drop is easier to understand once you start thinking in those terms. It takes away the setup differences and is associated with an a2c length. The width of a tire and rim width can cause pretty big differences in bb height. With bb drop there is only one variable which is a2c instead of having to know rim width, tire width and a2c to get an idea. I think it is easier to design with bb drop than bb height. To measure it is just as easy when you measure the bb height versus the axle heights.

 

[Leethal]

Lots of good stuff in this thread, it has been eluded too but not said so I will say it Chainstay length is only one part of the equation, BB height is every bit as important as is the headangle thus adjusting the front center distance.

My adice for A Grove is simple, look at the grearing you intend to run and build according to that.. since your making a one off frame you get that extra luxury.

 

[arcadecycles]

This is the Jugegrnaut, and we are running 14" flat chainstays. They work great feel real responsive and run great either on street/park or at the trails. I personally would go with a fall guy, nice clean frame and nice geometry. If i wasn't riding this i would be on a fall guy.

 

[grom-dom]

If you are into pegs / grinds / steeper HT angles / 990's the Molly is a (far) better choice.

Horses for Courses.

To me, a clicked euro 6 ft out of the Arvey Wall is very heavy street move. The Fall Guy frame in this photo has been holding up fine to this sort of riding.

-L

not saying it isn't good for street. you know i beat the hell out of mine. i just think of trails when i think of tonic, and i think more of street when i think of usb. different strokes...

 

[gackrider24]

just one consideration in itself is that the usb molly is now on sale goin for $400

 

[A Grove]

I have a machine-shop in my basement with any and all tools I could ever need to make a frame. but thats STUPID cheap!

 

[cmc]

I have a machine-shop in my basement with any and all tools I could ever need to make a frame. ....

really.......... can you make me some bars ?

 

[A Grove]

CMC- PM me with details as to what you're wanting and I'll let you know if I can help you out or not