I would like to add that his shoulder was separated in that picture and he still managed to place pretty well.
Lowering the bar... anyone flip their riser bars upside down?
- Thread starter bigwheel
- Start date
its obviously because of the neon green. if he didn't wear that he would get dead last.
I can believe this actually got 6 pages of comments...its dumb and thats all there is to it.
As for the guy who talked about how mountain biking got invented..."A group in Marin County, California is recognized by the Mountain Bike Hall of Fame to have played a central role in the birth of the sport as we know it today. They began racing down Mount Tamalpais (Mt Tam) on old 1930s and '40s Schwinn bicycles retrofitted with better brakes and fat tires. This group included Joe Breeze, Otis Guy, Gary Fisher and Keith Bontrager, among others. It was Joe Breeze who built the first new, purpose-made mountain bike in 1977. Tom Ritchey built the first regularly available mountain bike frame, which was accessorized by Gary Fisher and Charlie Kelly and sold by their company called MountainBikes (later changed to Fisher Mountain Bikes then bought by Trek, still under the name Gary Fisher)."
-wikipedia-
PS: Gary Fisher is cool as hell to talk to.
As for the guy who talked about how mountain biking got invented..."A group in Marin County, California is recognized by the Mountain Bike Hall of Fame to have played a central role in the birth of the sport as we know it today. They began racing down Mount Tamalpais (Mt Tam) on old 1930s and '40s Schwinn bicycles retrofitted with better brakes and fat tires. This group included Joe Breeze, Otis Guy, Gary Fisher and Keith Bontrager, among others. It was Joe Breeze who built the first new, purpose-made mountain bike in 1977. Tom Ritchey built the first regularly available mountain bike frame, which was accessorized by Gary Fisher and Charlie Kelly and sold by their company called MountainBikes (later changed to Fisher Mountain Bikes then bought by Trek, still under the name Gary Fisher)."
-wikipedia-
PS: Gary Fisher is cool as hell to talk to.
he woulda gone faster if his race kit was red and his bike was white.
Oh, the incredible irony!
So I just flipped my bars and thought I'd add something useful to this thread. I can still manual, and in corners the front end feels more planted. However, I know on steeper, techy trails it would not be as good. I think I could get used to this setup for fire roads, and more flowy trails though. I'll throw a pic up in a bit.
i have to agree with the OP, this really is lowering the bar...
yeah 180 bars!!!
whats your bar end to ground?Oh baby.
IMG]
how much fork travel?
you know your stanchions aren't even right? (unless it just appears that way in the pic)
This fad will pass, just like the Macarena.
I will start off by saying, Its not fair to say bars are not as strong upside down, nor is it at all realistic to say that they are fine (unless you designed and tested them that way).
I have contacted a few manufacturers. They all say the same thing. The manufactures first design the bar for use in the upright position (which we all expect them to say). But we really know there are three options for how strong a bar is upside down- weaker (likely) equally strong or stronger. But you don’t know. And neither do they.
No matter how strong the bars are upside down you can be sure the bars are only tested installed “properly”. Easton, Raceface etc. all have extensive quality programs (which is a lot of what you pay for in your bling bling bars). These quality programs put newly designed bars through many tests including stress, and fatigue to ensure the product is safe before it hits your hands. Unless you are going to mimic those tests, running the bars upside down is a risk. You would be much better off running a +- 10 deg stem in the -10 position (these are tested both ways, hence the "+-" note that bars don’t come in +- inch rise). and like others have said a zero stack headset, and no spacers below the stem, and flat crowns (see above).
I will start off by saying, Its not fair to say bars are not as strong upside down, nor is it at all realistic to say that they are fine (unless you designed and tested them that way).
I have contacted a few manufacturers. They all say the same thing. The manufactures first design the bar for use in the upright position (which we all expect them to say). But we really know there are three options for how strong a bar is upside down- weaker (likely) equally strong or stronger. But you don’t know. And neither do they.
No matter how strong the bars are upside down you can be sure the bars are only tested installed “properly”. Easton, Raceface etc. all have extensive quality programs (which is a lot of what you pay for in your bling bling bars). These quality programs put newly designed bars through many tests including stress, and fatigue to ensure the product is safe before it hits your hands. Unless you are going to mimic those tests, running the bars upside down is a risk. You would be much better off running a +- 10 deg stem in the -10 position (these are tested both ways, hence the "+-" note that bars don’t come in +- inch rise). and like others have said a zero stack headset, and no spacers below the stem, and flat crowns (see above).
my biggest concern is that some stupid kid with rich parents is gonna stumble across pics of people running their handlebars upsidedown and he's gonna think to himself.... "hmmm hurrrr dee durrrrrr i've seen pics of people running their bars upsidedown on the internet... it must be ok!!" then little jimmy gets dropped off at the mountain in his parents escalade, talks smack about how sweet his new upsidedown bars are then proceeds to have them catastrophically fail on his first run, resulting in jimmy losing his teeth and fracturing his mandible. mommy and daddy fly out of their SUV sh*tting bricks when they see blood running down his chest. Once little jimmy explains what happened, common sense and logic fly out the window, and jimmy's parents call their lawyer. Since they can't sue the internet, and heaven forbid they have their son take responsibility for his own stupidity, they decide to sue the next closest thing: the company that manufactured the handlebar. This spells bad news for the company. And when good companies get sued b/c some kid is too stupid to realize this was a bad idea, we all lose.
As stupid as running bars upside down is, it sounds almost normal compared to the suggestion that people don't manual during the course of going down a dh course.
I guess that would be the definition of a plow rider.
you've never been to diablo, have you?
re-read what i just posted. next time you are at diablo, take a look around at all the 14 & 15 y/o kids that are on brand new high end bikes (sundays, demos, etc). not to mention the fact that it is NJ. I know when I was that age I sure as hell couldn't afford a bike that nice. So who's paying for it? also, think about the fact that a good number of those kids are also on pinkbike.
I understand what you're saying, but by that logic, they shouldn't be on mountain bikes in general, if you think there is a risk of a bike company/mountain getting sued every time one of them gets hurt while riding. it's just a completely unrealistic argument IMO.
i wasn't saying that there's a risk of lawsuits every time someone gets hurt. i was stating that its a possibility (realistic or not). It was more food for thought, especially given how lawsuit happy some people here in the US are, and the disturbingly growing trend of pointing blame elsewhere and not taking responsibility for your own actions.
Understandable. I guess there's only one solution: don't let groms ride bikes.
You don't work in the bike biz do you? It's highly likely, and happens very often. Look at the back of a Colorado lift ticket, you have to waive just about every right you have to be allowed up the lift due to a spate of lawsuits. The waiver STILL doesn't protect them though, as you cannot waive your right to a civil lawsuit.
no, just don't let groms on pinkbike.Understandable. I guess there's only one solution: don't let groms ride bikes.
No, I don't work in the bike biz. I'm an enginerd. Based on these two facts, I should do some stress testing on various bars and put the "bars are meant to take forces in a certain direction" notion to the test......
Just don't do the test with your teeth/jaw/chin...
Just don't do the test with your teeth/jaw/chin...
But I have to make it as realistic as possible! Anyone have a Monster edition Sunday I can borrow?
do it!
Also, just from working in a bike shop, I experienced some pretty ridiculous BS. highlights:
-some old guy trying to sell the shop a used kickstand that he found on the side of the road
-another guy accusing us (the mechanics) of stealing the reflectors off his wheels. when he was yelling at out manager about it, he also revealed that he had NEVER BEEN TO OUR SHOP BEFORE. EVER.
-a guy that had us rebuild an old marzocchi xc fork for him. he comes back a month later demanding the we refund him for the rebuild because it broke AGAIN. AND he wanted us to rebuild it for him a second time for free. eventually it came to light that he was using the fork on a huck bike. the owner of the shop told him never to come back.
-people who come in demanding refunds for inner tubes that go flat. or try to warranty them. or try to warranty worn out tires.
-a guy who was pissed that we (nor the manufacturer) couldn't warranty his broken crank arms. because he was using a homemade bottom bracket and bashguard.
-a guy that broken an OLD cannondale super-v (one of the late models). c'dale honored the warranty, but only for the swingarm (this is what actually broke). this was one of the ones where the jekyll swingarms was compatible, so he got that. he was uber pissed because he was expecting an entirely new frame. we highly suspected that he intentionally broke the frame to get a new one (this was deductive reasoning b/c his story on how it broke changed several times).
i could go on, but i have work to do.
If you're talking about my bike, I can't get lower. I've got no spacers under the stem, and my crowns are slammed. A flat crown won't get me lower.
Maybe the macarena will?
Lil' Jon might be able to help you get low...
i KNOW that company's are not taking a directional extrusion
where bars are stronger one way than the next!
I know they are bent from tapered wall that has the SAME wall
thickness all the way around!
I have cut carbon bars length ways to SEE, easton and FSA.
same wall.
I know they are just as strong upside down as right side up.
where bars are stronger one way than the next!
I know they are bent from tapered wall that has the SAME wall
thickness all the way around!
I have cut carbon bars length ways to SEE, easton and FSA.
same wall.
I know they are just as strong upside down as right side up.
30 feet or 30 seconds once they exit that door, is my rule. Anything passed that is there fault.
FWIW I would always go outside our front door and throw broken glass, nails, metal wires on the ground.
irate2:Well thats just something they have to watch out for then, won't they?FWIW I would always go outside our front door and throw broken glass, nails, metal wires on the ground.
Are you willing to bet your face on it?
Are you willing to bet someone else's face on it?
I am not saying they arent just as strong, but I would want some testing (similar to every other product we ride) to show this before I made a statement like that.
If the bike (or auto, or aircraft, or shipbuilding) industry took the attitude design and no test - we would pay a lot less for our products. And we would have a lot more accidents.
however, I am happy to see people experimenting with bike geometry - it is what fuels innovation and better design for all of us.