[mandown]

so i got some new toys in the mail yesterday

i'm still floating around the 40lbs mark. anyone have any weight savings suggestions? i know i don't have the lightest parts on here. however, i don't see many places to knock a significant amount of weight off (while keeping it gravity-friendly). without going for an air fork or air shock, what is the most you think i could shave off here? maybe 5lbs if i am lucky? what would it cost to do that? i know this question opens me up to tons of flaming. if all i get is confirmation that it would cost $1,000 to shave 5lbs off, then i will be happy knowing that i don't want to go that route. however, i would appreciate it if anyone can spot a boat anchor on my rig that i have yet to see.

 

[coma13]

crankset, wheels

 

[dropmachine]

post up a parts spec, the pic isn't that clear. But from a straight glance, if those are Diety cranks and stem, those things are heavy.

 

[mandown]

frame - bottlerocket w/ dhx ~ 10lbs
fork - fox 36 VAN R ~ 5.5lbs
bars - easton w/ shim ~ ???
stem - deity ~ heavy
headest - fsa orbit
brakes - magura louise fr
shifters and derails - shimano deore and LX (hoping to replace w/ X.7 soon)
cranks - deity (w/ a big fat spider that weighs a ton)
bash - evil
seatpost - thomson
saddle - 210 gram ti rail performance brand
wheels - supergo launch ~ 2200 grams
tubes - pinner thin ones
tires - maxxis advantage front and rear ~ 880grams each
pedals - shimano 545

think that covers it.

 

[hucked2bend]

Hey there, nice rig!!

I would go with:
X4 Thomson Stem - $ 50-$60
XT Cranks - $ 170.00 on e-bay
Ti Spring for the DHX (unless you need a 550 or more Then it won't fit) - $ 220.00
7" front rotor - $40.00

These items would set you back about $400-$500 retail (unless Santiago can hook a brutha up), I would figure about a 3 lb weight savings??

 

[S.K.C.]

Stem: Thomson X4 - bombproof and super light
Cranks: Race Face Atlas - bombproof for FR, plus you'll save more weight with a 110g external BB
Rims: Mavic EX721's - bombproof and only weigh 590g a piece
Hubs: DT Swiss 340's - these come spec'd on all the 07' I.H. Sunday Elite's, and like their name says, the rear hub is only 340g! Front is probably sub-200g.
Suspension: RCS Ti spring for the shock.

... I think this is a good place to start.


Easton bars aren't heavy - their standard size ones are about 250g - I run 31.8 EA70 Monkey Bars w/ a Thomson X4 stem on my DH rig and it is super light weight. Tough as hell too.

 

[mandown]

yeah, i think the cranks may need to leave the building. i love em, but they are heavy. maybe they go on my HT.

 

[bjanga]

Are the launch wheels 'heavy' for DH wheels? I have a similar setup on my Vagrant as you, there is about a pound difference between our bikes after taking into consideration the frames. Just how heavy are your cranks? What cassette are you running?

 

[dG video]

Why is the seat pointing down?

I would change the cranks, they aren't very good anyway. Change the stem, and go with some Lighter tires.

Dan

 

[mandown]

rocky, the seat barely points down. i think it is the photo angle and the silver on the side that makes it look more "down" than it is.

the cranks are awesome. so is the customer service.

the cranks alone are not that heavy compared to saint. however, the addition of the spider pushes them over the edge. the XT seem to be about 300 grams lighter than saint.
the thomson is about 120 grams lighter.
the stem and cranks together could probably get me close to 2lbs of weight savings.

as for the tires, where i am i gonna get ligter tires than that for gravity use that won't pinch flat? sub 900grams is pretty good.

 

[coma13]

what length stroke is that shock? i have a 500lbs. ti spring i might be interested in letting go... i'm not too concerned about the weight savings and i could use a little extra skrilla at this point in time!

 

[Secret Squirrel]

rocky, the seat barely points down. i think it is the photo angle and the silver on the side that makes it look more "down" than it is.

the cranks are awesome. so is the customer service.

the cranks alone are not that heavy compared to saint. however, the addition of the spider pushes them over the edge. the XT seem to be about 300 grams lighter than saint.
the thomson is about 120 grams lighter.
the stem and cranks together could probably get me close to 2lbs of weight savings.

as for the tires, where i am i gonna get ligter tires than that for gravity use that won't pinch flat? sub 900grams is pretty good.

Tires are fine....I know I don't want to skimp too much there....sub 900 is pretty good. Not sure how heavy that wheelset is, but a set of 721's or 823's on, say, hadley's or DT Swiss's *might* lighten it up. Other than the stem and cranks, a Ti spring would kill around .3 to .5 lbs. I'd guess that you'd be close to 4 lbs. off at that point. Puttin' the Rocket at 36-37 sounds decent to me...but then again mine is 50 for just doing whistler runs and the like....

 

[dropmachine]

Thomson is too damn much, and honestly I've never had so many problems with a stem as I have with mine. Just go check out some stems, and weigh them. There are some surprisingly light and strong, without costing an arm and a leg.

For Cranks, Saints or XT, or the new Truvativ ones would be a good idea. RaceFace Atlas are a personal favorite of mine.

 

[particle bored]

crankset, wheels

yup.

don't see why a Shima-no-no Hone or RF Atlas wouldn't work.

but maybe not on the wheels, if you're heavy, or a plower, sometimes you need equally heavy wheels.

 

[blue]

Thomson is too damn much, and honestly I've never had so many problems with a stem as I have with mine. Just go check out some stems, and weigh them. There are some surprisingly light and strong, without costing an arm and a leg.

Agreed. You get a lot of adjustability and chi-chiness, but I'm suprised nearly everyone and their dog runs them when you can get stuff on par qualitywise and the same weight for half the cost.

FSA makes some light stems....the Gravity Light will knock about 100 grams off and looks pretty sweet.

 

[jvnixon]

Get a bolt on rear axle. That'll save you some weight and is very cheap. Other than that i'd start with cranks/wheels/stem/etc

 

[dropmachine]

WHat I would suggest is go through this list, and find the length you want. Then find out what each retails for and read some reviews, and tada, there ya go.

http://weightweenies.starbike.com/listings/components.php?type=stems&sortby=size

 

[dexter]

get a ti spindle for the cranks and get ti bolts, the e13 spider, e13 guide ring. ti spring for rear shock, new stem, new wheels. good to go

 

[Demomonkey]

rocky, the seat barely points down. i think it is the photo angle and the silver on the side that makes it look more "down" than it is.

the cranks are awesome. so is the customer service.

the cranks alone are not that heavy compared to saint. however, the addition of the spider pushes them over the edge. the XT seem to be about 300 grams lighter than saint.
the thomson is about 120 grams lighter.
the stem and cranks together could probably get me close to 2lbs of weight savings.

as for the tires, where i am i gonna get ligter tires than that for gravity use that won't pinch flat? sub 900grams is pretty good.

SAINT cranks are heavy. Of the recommendations, i'd agree with cranks, stem, rims/hubs, Ti spring, tyres (run the single ply versions) and bar.

 

[Bicyclist]

I would say get a different stem (not a Thomson, too expensive).

Go XT or Atlas cranks. XTs would be an increase in stiffness, and your BB would be better, and you could run a 4x104 e13 Guidering for more weight savings.

On the wheels, that weight's not horrible. I'd leave it. Same w/ tires.

Cassette can be a big savings, and it's unsprung weight. I personally like 11-32t XT cassettes.

 

[SXtrailrider]

All icna think of is wheelset, cranks and ti spring, all expensive to replace but will drop the most weight. You wont save 5lbs but you will get close

 

[SXtrailrider]

ligther tubes and stem would be my other guess and if you don't use the full length of your seat post then you cna afford to cut it which will take some weight off.

 

[Bicyclist]

He's running XC tubes already.

And the cutting of the seatpost is a good call, actually.

 

[mandown]

this is about what i thought it would be. thanks guys. i greatly appreciate the input.

 

[sbabuser]

2200 grams is at least 3/4 pound low for the wheel estimate. I weighed my Outlaws in at 5.8 lbs. Same wheels, except the outlaws are 36 spoke and mine were 150mm rear hub. I bet it's not a 1/4 lb difference b/t the 150 and 135 rear hub and extra spokes. I've got a set of Launch's too, but don't have the motivation to strip 'em down and weigh 'em.
So you can lose weight on the wheels easy. Depending on how much you weigh, I'd be wary of going to an aluminum spindled crank (atlas/ xt). The 2 ring hone is probably a bit lighter than saint, and has a steel spindle and pedal inserts.

 

[davep]

I'd be wary of going to an aluminum spindled crank (atlas/ xt). The 2 ring hone is probably a bit lighter than saint, and has a steel spindle and pedal inserts.

More talking without knowledge!!! Neither R.F Atlas OR X.T's have an aluminum spindle!!! Have you EVER seen an aluminum spindle bb? In case you cant find the anwer, I will tell you ......NO!


Now back to the regularly scheduled program.


If you do not kill cranks, I would say got XT. They are stifffer than Atlas (I have both) and are as light or lighter.
Bicyclist thuoght of a great one..cassette. If you do not already have an aluminum spider cassette, get an XT!!
stem
guarentee you could save some weight on wheels, but that takes $$
look for a second hand Ti spring

P.S. watch out for people talking out of their a$$es and sponsored riders pimpin their sponsors

 

[no skid marks]

Easton do a stem(50mm)that's not much heavier than a Thomson and has normal sized bolts.

 

[sbabuser]

More talking without knowledge!!! Have you EVER seen an aluminum spindle bb? In case you cant find the anwer, I will tell you ......NO!

That's pretty brash typing there for someone who obviously does NOT know what he's talking about himself.
I was wrong about the Atlas cranks, I figured being they were around the same weight as the 3 ring Hones that they would have similar construction. For the Hones DO have an aluminum spindle.
How else would they weigh less than my Diabolus with the spindle being so many times thicker?

 

[monkeyboy424]

How else would they weigh less than my Diabolus with the spindle being so many times thicker?

Doesn't anybody believe in magic anymore?

 

[A.P]

The build on that bike makes me cringe. I might have just thrown up in my mouth a little bit.
I dont know if its the deity stuff, the ugly seat pointing down, the paint job...whatever.

First off I would loose the deity stuff, if not only because their stuff is heavy but ugly and overpriced and overhyped? Get some xt's, singletrack rims, and thompson stuff.

 

[frznnomad]

im surprised that tubless hasnt been brought into the equation. if you get the 823's your shaving weight there and you can run them tubless to shave even more weight. the previous suggestions are excellent and its deffinatly worth going that route. i know your already running light xc tubes in it, but going tubless would shave that extra weight and also help in the pinch flat department as well. good luck to you man hope you can shave the pounds man.

 

[zmtber]

tubeless thats all

 

[mandown]

wow, i am shocked at the hate here for deity. i know the parts are heavy, but man, to here people say their parts suck is odd. the stem works. it bolts on and holds the bar. i like the way it looks. can't help it if some of you don't. as for the cranks, they bolted on. they spin around. the chainline is adjustable. i can get a wider stance with them than with isis bb's (which i like). i never need to worry about them breaking. i have never had a problem with a bmx bb creaking (unlike isis stuff). eric at deity has been helpful and is a great guy to talk too. i just don't get it.

as for the tubeless. i don't see the weight savings there. it would seem to me the weight of the stan's goo in the wheel would be about the same as an XC tube (just a guess). i see the advantage of pinch flat resistance, but i am running advantage tires which are single ply and intended to be run at 40+psi. i have yet to have a pinch flat problem. i did two days in mammoth and they were great. can anyone shed some light on the weight savings from tubeless? i keep hearing it saves weight, but from what i have seen (and i may be wrong because i have not looked too close) the tubeless tires are heavier than standard, the tubeless rims are heavier, and you still need to run the goo inside the tire (how much does that weigh?).

 

[bjanga]

The stem does not do much, like you said. So why not run something lighter that does the same thing? Although, I have no idea what stems weigh.

As for the cranks . . . the site says 1044g complete (arms and BB I assume). So you could save whatever you spider and rings weigh by going with XT or Hone, and the external BBs have a bit of chainline adjustment and they hold up better than ISIS. I would guess that diety is similar to saint / diabolus . . . you usually pay the weight penalty for running bombproof stuff and we were making suggestions to make your bike lighter.

What I have read about tubeless and ghetto tubeless leads me to believe that heavier rims / rimstrips / slime / heavier tubeless casings do not add up to much weight savings. So you trade extra hassle for more pinch flat resistance, possible burping issues, and a faster rolling setup.

 

[frznnomad]

Originally Posted by bjanga
What I have read about tubeless and ghetto tubeless leads me to believe that heavier rims / rimstrips / slime / heavier tubeless casings do not add up to much weight savings. So you trade extra hassle for more pinch flat resistance, possible burping issues, and a faster rolling setup.

thats exactly why you dont run ghetto tubless. if you get a wheelset that is setup tubless then there is no rimstrip, no slime, and my 823's weigh as much as my old single tracks. so in the end i pulled the tubes out, shaved two pounds of the whole rig, and no longer do i get pinch flats.

 

[sbabuser]

I've run ghetto tubeless for 2 seasons now, racing and training for dh in CO. The only time I got flats (2x) was because the sealant dried up. Generally I wear out tires faster than the sealant dries. If you're having trouble w/ ghetto tubeless, likely you're not running Maxxis tires, or your tire/ rim combo is too loose.
Lighter weight is not the reason to switch to tubeless. Lower rolling resistance, no pinch flats (running pressure in the mid to low 20's) and a cushier ride are the reason I will not run tubes if I can help it. And if the name "ghetto" turns you off, buy either Maxxis or Stan's tubeless rimstrips, which in my experience, work about as well, but cost more.

 

[dhkid]

you could run a crossmax xl wheel set and kill two birds with one stone, light weight wheel ready for tubeless set up.

 

[Guntruck]

You could sandblast that lavender paint off there and lose a few grams and maybe even look a bit less girly . I was a bit disapointed to see the weight of the Bottlerocket. I thought it was going to be alot lighter.

 

[davep]

thats exactly why you dont run ghetto tubless. if you get a wheelset that is setup tubless then there is no rimstrip, no slime, and my 823's weigh as much as my old single tracks. so in the end i pulled the tubes out, shaved two pounds of the whole rig, and no longer do i get pinch flats.

Go back and do the math again. Not trying to bash tubeless as I run all my (off road) bikes tubeless, but the weight savings does not always add up.

In your instance, single tracks are about 590 g each. The mavic 823's are about 725 g each. By switching to tubeless, you added 270 g (~2/3 lb) in rim weight. You could of easily put stans strips in you single tracks for the same weight....

 

[davep]

you could run a crossmax xl wheel set and kill two birds with one stone, light weight wheel ready for tubeless set up.

And have poor rear hub durability and proprietary spokes that like to pop out of the rim if hit hard.


















sorry, I had to