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Discussion in 'Politics & World News' started by gonefirefightin, May 30, 2012.

  1. gonefirefightin

    gonefirefightin free wieners

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  2. stevew

    stevew unique white person

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    i knew what it would be about before i opened the thread.

    i lulzed.
     
  3. JohnE

    JohnE filthy rascist

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    Front Range, dude...
    Wow. Just wow.
     
  4. binary visions

    binary visions The voice of reason

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    It must be amazing to not have a filter on anything you say.

    I wonder what it's like, to just open your mouth and words come tumbling out?
     
  5. JohnE

    JohnE filthy rascist

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    Front Range, dude...
    I think it would be better to have a filter in his case, rather then inflaming a large % of Americans on the day of the year that honors the fallen...
     
  6. rockofullr

    rockofullr confused

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    U inflamed bro?
     
  7. Kevin

    Kevin Turbo Monkey

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    Its actually quite liberating, just dont expect to make too many friends.
    :D
     
  8. Silver

    Silver find me a tampon

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    You mean the day that 200M or so fatties get drunk on terrible beer and eat their own body weight in nitrated lips and assholes? That day?
     
  9. dante

    dante Unabomber

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    So, every soldier who's fought in every single war, regardless of which side he/she fought on (or which country he/she fought for, or however many atrocities were committed), is a hero? Are Al Qaeda fighters heroes? Nazis? Or is it only those who fought for us who are heroes, and those fighting for *other* countries/terrorist groups are "evildoers, terrorists, cowards, etc"?

    By the way, here's his actual quote:

    Right, because the Republicans have never, *ever* used "support our troops" as a tool to push for more (or continued) war... Ever.

    Then again, we know how the Republicans feel about our troops serving overseas....
     
  10. Kevin

    Kevin Turbo Monkey

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    Must spread
     
  11. $tinkle

    $tinkle Expert on blowing

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    plz define hero for any purposes whatsoever
     
  12. rockofullr

    rockofullr confused

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    Take your "words" and "logic" somewhere else. We are being angry and patriotic here!

     
    #12 -   May 30, 2012
    Last edited: May 30, 2012
  13. blackohio

    blackohio Generous jaywalker

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    Man it's been over ten years now that not wanting war means hating troops. crazy how far we've come.
     
  14. dante

    dante Unabomber

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    No.


    45
     
  15. daisycutter

    daisycutter Turbo Monkey

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    \

    As a Vet one of the reasons I joined up was to ensure freedom of speach. Let any asshole say what they want. It makes it so much easier to identify who the assholes are.
     
  16. jimmydean

    jimmydean The Official Meat of Ridemonkey

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    Don't hate the player, hate the game.
     
  17. JohnE

    JohnE filthy rascist

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    I am a vet of 22 years +...I agree with your statement, completely. BUT...Memorial Day is a day set aside for rememberance of those who have given the ultimate sacrifice in service of their country. Not, as Stank so succinctly put it, for "200M or so fatties get drunk on terrible beer and eat their own body weight in nitrated lips and assholes"...nor for other idiots with podiums to disrespect said sacrifices. I cannot beleive that this wasnt premeditated on his part for shock value, designed to propel his nobody little ass into the spotlight. The timing is too perfect...
     
  18. stoney

    stoney Part of the unwashed, middle-American horde

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    According to Webster's:
    By calling all men who join the military (a personal election and a job/career) hero's, it absolutely undermines those who have exhibited "distinguished courage or ability, admired for his brave deeds and noble qualities/". The man who jumps on a grenade to save the lives of 10 others qualifies as such. The guy who puts himself into a locale where he might be blown up (sorry Brett, but I think you know where I am going here), made a decision as to be in that situation. It is not heroic to be assigned to an unfriendly location based on your career.

    The guy who works on an oil rig in the North Atlantic is not a hero, but puts himself at massive risk for the benefit of others (us oil users). Hero used for a large population absolutely degrades the value of that merit.

    To put it into context, I have absolute respect for those willing to join the military and put themselves into those situations to protect our rights. However, not all are heroes... And can anybody explain exactly what rights/freedoms we are fighting for in Iraq and Afghanistan? Sure as hell aren't any rights of Americans.
     
    #18 -   May 30, 2012
    Last edited: May 30, 2012
  19. $tinkle

    $tinkle Expert on blowing

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    what about a directionless, undisciplined, immature, broke, undereducated, substance-abusing, unindicted felon who has no other option but to enlist?

    b/c those were most of my co-workers.



    ok, that was me.
     
  20. X3pilot

    X3pilot Texans fan - LOL

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    Ask most vets, and I bet most are like me, very uncomfortable with the word hero and how it's used, especially when it's used by people to cover their guilt for putting their fellow humans in harms way for whatever cause. On the other hand, I feel comfortable dishing out that label, having personally observed the values and actions that define a hero, just like most of you have. Was my military career a choice? You bet. Was my cousin's choice his own to go to Vietnam, even with a deferral from the draft, because he couldn't stand to see his friends go and him not and died saving his fellow soldiers? Yep. Hero? To me.

    Hero is in the eye of the beholder, as it should be.
     
  21. X3pilot

    X3pilot Texans fan - LOL

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    #21 -   May 30, 2012
    Last edited: May 30, 2012
  22. jimmydean

    jimmydean The Official Meat of Ridemonkey

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    This.

    I have served with many I proudly call a hero. I have met many others I also call a hero. But there are many who serve who are not heroes and many heroes who may have never served (firemen, police, medics, etc). It's not a word I throw around easily and shouldn't be used other than to identify an individual or group.

    But it was still a douche comment.
     
  23. $tinkle

    $tinkle Expert on blowing

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  24. X3pilot

    X3pilot Texans fan - LOL

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    :D Noted.
     
  25. Silver

    Silver find me a tampon

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    The people in charge of the whole Iraq thing? No guilt.



    Dead US soldiers in Iraq? Not heroes.

    Victims.
     
  26. JohnE

    JohnE filthy rascist

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    Well, we cant go around calling it "Victims Day" now can we?

    At the local Memorial Day ceremnoy I attended, the emcee/narrator guy from the VFW seemed to have Memorial Day confused with Veterans Day. Veterans Day I will hoop and holler for, either way you cut it, Memorial Day is a somber occasion. Especially this year. Kid from my home town, Mom was pals with my big sister. RIP Sam...

    http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/local/ct-met-wheaton-soldier-funeral-20120531,0,4919924.story
     
  27. JohnE

    JohnE filthy rascist

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    And George Bush is still an asshole.
     
  28. Silver

    Silver find me a tampon

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    Like I said earlier, Memorial Day is a long weekend where you get drunk and stuff your face. Sure, you might chant USA! USA! at some point before you pass out.

    If I'm in Canada in late October I pick up a poppy. I can't tell you how many Americans I've had to educate at hockey games on why the coaches are wearing those red things on their lapels. That's one thing the Brits and Canucks do much better. Remembrance Day is serious business. Why are we standing out here in the freezing cold at 11 am? And why is everyone so quiet? There's no cheering. And every year, there's less and less of the really old men at the cenotaph.

    The flipside of that is Don Cherry upping the jingoism every Saturday night so people can't criticize him for being a senile bigot. It's not all good...

    20 goddamn years old. Fvck.
     
    #28 -   May 31, 2012
    Last edited: May 31, 2012
  29. sanjuro

    sanjuro Tube Smuggler

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    I don't like to discuss this topic because I wasn't in the military and a close friend and a relative are months away to deploying to Afghanistan.

    On that note, I won't write about heroism and the military.

    But what I feel comfortable talking about is liberals and their knowledge of soldiers.

    Sadly, Hayes and I both grew up in the Bronx, although thankfully he lived in Riverdale (put it this way, kids from Riverdale say they are from Riverdale. I tell people I am from the Bronx). We both went to magnet schools, and while he went to an Ivy and I went to a state university, we both have plenty of smart liberal friends.

    But if you don't know someone in the military, then you don't think about, "Man today was tough, but no one is shooting at me, the drive home was IED-free, everyone speaks English, and I get to sleep in my own bed".

    My people going to Afghanistan made the choice to leave their lives in America behind for reasons which I won't be able to understand because I didn't make the choices they did, I can say unequivocally they are heroes to me.
     
    #29 -   May 31, 2012
    Last edited: May 31, 2012
  30. JohnE

    JohnE filthy rascist

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    ...I sit on my porch, and I watch the parade pass before me
    And I watch my old comrades, how proudly they march, reliving old dreams of past glory
    And the old men march slowly, all bent, stiff and sore, he forgotten heroes from a forgotten war
    And the young people ask, "What are they marching for?"...and I ask myself the same question
    And the band plays Waltzing Matilda...and the old men answer to the call
    But year after year their numbers get fewer...some day no one will march there at all...


    FTR Stink, I for one, did not get drunk, and the last time I went 'round chanting USAUSAUSA was 1980, after the gold medal hockey game...

    Now, next weekend I will be drunk. Very drunk. And George Bush is still an asshole.
     
  31. daisycutter

    daisycutter Turbo Monkey

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  32. X3pilot

    X3pilot Texans fan - LOL

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    People get Memorial Day and Veteran's Day confused a lot. And I really like the poppies. A very classy tribute and done very well.
     
  33. JohnE

    JohnE filthy rascist

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    Front Range, dude...
    Yep, got one hanging on my rear view mirror right now...
     
  34. stoney

    stoney Part of the unwashed, middle-American horde

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    Please explain.
     
  35. $tinkle

    $tinkle Expert on blowing

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  36. valve bouncer

    valve bouncer Master Dildoist

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    Must spread, great minds and all that. Using the extremely useful Tunein app I've been listening to lots of radio from back home recently. One forgettable product was spruiking "a trip to Gallipoli" as a prize. Tacky. According to the BBC this is called "dark tourism".
     
  37. Secret Squirrel

    Secret Squirrel There is no Justice!

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  38. X3pilot

    X3pilot Texans fan - LOL

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    The confusion? Most people express their gratitude to all veterans for their service on Memorial Day and that is what Veteran's Day is for, all though originally V day celebration. Memorial Day is a day, originally Decoration Day, specifically for honoring war dead.

    http://www.memorialdayorigin.info/order11.html
     
  39. sanjuro

    sanjuro Tube Smuggler

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    Chris Hayes has a response, and I am unsatisfied with it.

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/06/02/chris-hayes-heroes-apology_n_1565071.html

    It is funny he mentions robots, like choosing to use drones and bomb-disposal robots is the coward's way, not an effective way to combat the enemy and save our soldiers' lives.

    I also read several defenses of his initial comments, and they criticize war, soldiers who fought dishonorably or for dishonorable causes, and the manipulation of heroism for less-than-patriotic purposes. Most of it I agree with.

    But none of these opinions offer what they consider heroism, who they consider heroes.

    To be frank, one reason why Hayes has received so much criticism is that he seems like a liberal mamby-pamby who wouldn't stand up to a schoolyard bully while he was defending the bully's 1st Amendment rights to tease him.

    I suppose that's why Hayes bothers me so much, the similarity to myself. We are both fairly liberal, living in a world which others defend and protect my rights and safety.

    But I acknowledge the soldiers who fight for these things, even if I don't always agree with the politics behind the fight.
     
  40. X3pilot

    X3pilot Texans fan - LOL

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    Careful there, you're starting to sound patriotic and we'll label you a patriot.

    You, my friend, get it.