[Huck Banzai]

I searched, didnt find anything solid; what is the general consensus on the term 'Black Diamond' to describe what we generally call Freeride, Freestyle and Downhill.

In my experience, MBA is the only place/person/entity that uses this terminology. It has not been accepted by anyone outside of the pages of MBA that I have seen, and, IMHO, is silly and more of a marketing game (to what end?) than a legitimate concern.

Also in my experience, the term 'Freeride' does not carry outside of the sport so therefore does not carry these negatice connotations that are claimed to be associated with it. Those who are aware of it are not distracted by a different label and retain the same opinion, making it a moot point to do so.

I think the term Freeride is appropriate, and I find it annoyinf, albeit inconsequential, that they continue to use the term, going so far as editing submissions and replacing Freeride with Black Diamond Riding in their letters to the editor, ask RC, etc..

I know many feel the magazine is a wash and a sellout, I still like to read it, and this is hardly a real issue, but I digress.

What do you think? Stupid? Legitimate? Am I wrong, and in your experience Freeride DOES carry these negative impressions/connotations outside the sport?

DISCUSS!!

 

[4xBoy]

MBA is the MXA of Bicycle magazines, no real content, tons of ads.

I stick to Dirt and Decline these days.

 

[Fool]

Maybe they think Cannondale still has the copyright on the term Freeride©.

 

[FrontRangeDH]

I remember reading something in their pages a while back about why the felt freeride was a BAD term because it gave the sense to noobs that freeride was just riding down hills without trails or anything like that. It was in response to a lot of questions about the Red Bull Rampage courses. Pretty dumb huh? THey thought that black diamond riding would legitimize it in the eyes of mass media so it would be compared to skiing/snowboarding trail designations....

 

[Huck Banzai]

I like Declines approach, they will use the term freeride, but the magazine titles itself "Downhill, Freestyle and All Mountain"

I can stomach that, things are too specific, I still feel I am an XC, DJ, Urban, FR, DH, AM all in one, and I never have truly made a distinction. I jump when I XC, I climb when I FR, I finesse when I DH, and so on. The bikes might lend themselves more toward one or the other, but in this frame, Mark Weir is my idol!

 

[UiUiUiUi]

i just ride bikes, to hell with MBA

 

[khoolhandz]

DEFINITION: BLACK DIAMOND RIDING

1. Anything that's considered difficult for an average joe mountain biker, and unridable for your everyday average cyclist. It can be any trail from super-steep twisty sections, to fast boulder-strewn dh run, to stunt-filled ewok trail, to a trail full of doubles/tables/gaps.

2. Fun trails

 

[1453]

well, just to be fair, there is a bike call Mongoose Black Diamond. The bandwagon never left the station so they must feel like an a-hole.

oh wait, RC doesn't care what you think

 

[Huck Banzai]

DEFINITION: BLACK DIAMOND RIDING

1. Anything that's considered difficult for an average joe mountain biker, and unridable for your everyday average cyclist. It can be any trail from super-steep twisty sections, to fast boulder-strewn dh run, to stunt-filled ewok trail, to a trail full of doubles/tables/gaps.

2. Fun trails

Thats MBA's definition, to the rest of the world, there is no such thing; this is the impetus for this thread.

A useful answer would be that you agree or disagree; I can suppose you agree from your post...

 

[Huck Banzai]

well, just to be fair, there is a bike call Mongoose Black Diamond. The bandwagon never left the station so they must feel like an a-hole.

oh wait, RC doesn't care what you think

As I care little what RC thinks; however this is a curiousity. They choose not to respond to submissions on the topic based on comments I've seen posted in the past as well as my own experience.

Its clearly asinine and a failed endeavor, I'm just curious to get some feedback from a general audience rather than the traditional MBA bashers; their editorial content is a**, and their reviews are worthless in themselves, but they convey alot of raw info if you are willing to do some wading and deciphering.

Decline is it! MBA is poopy! (Lol, but I still buy it sometimes... what a maroon.)

**BUT** point awarded, I did forget about the 'Goose. Altho they're owned/operated my Pacific so ignorant doofus-ness isnt shocking.

 

[norbar]

I think I've seen such definition used few times but it was waaaaaaaaaaaaay back long ago. Maybe we should tell RC we live in the 21st century?

 

[Huck Banzai]

I think I've seen such definition used few times but it was waaaaaaaaaaaaay back long ago. Maybe we should tell RC we live in the 21st century?

I might mail him some poop, but that would cost 65c and I dont think its worth it................................

 

[UiUiUiUi]

maybe i should make my statement more clear:

personally i don't care about these kind of definitions of what i like to do, i use the term "downhill" when talking to people who have no idea that mountainbiking can be more than just riding your bike uphill, and then "carry" it back down ^^

i just ride my bike.

all these terms are just... oh well terms to sell a product.
some of them may be helpful, most of them are just marketing bull****.

so to broaden this approach. to hell with all bicycle magazines which have no clue what they are talking/writing about.

 

[Huck Banzai]

maybe i should make my statement more clear:

personally i don't care about these kind of definitions of what i like to do, i use the term "downhill" when talkigto people who have no idea that mountainbiking can be more than just riding your bike uphill, and the "carry" it back down ^^

i just ride my bike, my snowboard.

all these terms are just... oh well terms to sell a product.
some of them may be helpful, most of them are just marketing bull****.

so to broaden this approach. to hell with all bicycle magazines which have no clue what they are talking about.

Agreed, but cant I be curious?

 

[UiUiUiUi]

curiosity is great.

and then maybe its because i am no native english speaker,
but for me the term "freeride" only has positive connotations.
mostly associated with snowboarding in powder, mountainbiking somehow never carried a label in my head.

sometimes i get lost with all this political correctness in the US.

 

[mandown]

Thats MBA's definition, to the rest of the world, there is no such thing; this is the impetus for this thread.

A useful answer would be that you agree or disagree; I can suppose you agree from your post...

huh huh, you said "impetus."

 

[norbar]

I might mail him some poop, but that would cost 65c and I dont think its worth it................................

The poop idea is nice. I can pay for it. Or we can make a global RM poop and send him a huge package. It will have a bigger impact

 

[kidwoo]

Dude......black diamond is a lifestyle. From riding only the most difficult ski trails, to drinking black diamond shooters in the apres ski.

The drinks are black diamond because they're on fire. And they're mostly cyanide.

My tighty whiteys are made of sandpaper coated in acid. You get my drift? I wear black diamond underwear because it's dangerous.......and that's the life I've chosen to lead.

I respect MBA for recognizing this lifestyle for the extremeness that it is. My only problem is now that the coverage is there, the way I chose to live will become diluted in a sold out watering down of the core essence. Then it will be only single diamond. And eventually blue square........till one day we're all on a bunch of bunny slope bikes.

 

[Huck Banzai]

Damn you KidWoo


Damnyou!


(How can I be down?)

 

[Rover Nick]

Let me describe my Idea of black diamond riding.

You load up your bike onto a chairlift, ride it to the top. When you get of you look for a sign for your trail. When you find the sign and read it, it will contain the trail name and a curious little symbol that represents a diamond that is colored black.

Now that, is black diamond riding

 

[bdamschen]

bunny slope bikes.

A secret dig at slopestyle? Hmmmmm

 

[kidwoo]

A secret dig at slopestyle? Hmmmmm

I was going to say there's nothing bunny about the the crankworx slopestyle course..........but upon further reflection.......with something like the redbull rampage having existed, who needs that glorified dirtjump bullsh1t?

I miss non racing MOUNTAIN bike events.

 

[Loozinskin]

I specifically remember reading the issue when they made a big deal about how they were going to hence forth refer to freeride as
Black diamond riding.
It was most definitely about a short lived hype in the media about how "Freeriders" were rouge MTB'ers devoid of respect for established trails and posed major threats to the allready fragile land use agreements Socal riders and else where had worked to obtain. It was all about trail erosion, new lines getting cut, and global warming too I think. (JK)
I thought they had a fair point for a minute but in the big picture I think they ended up causing more negative buzz to the term Freeride than anyone else has yet.
I remember it all pretty well because I think that was the last issue of MBA I ever read.

 

[Huck Banzai]

I specifically remember reading the issue when they made a big deal about how they were going to hence forth refer to freeride as
Black diamond riding.
It was most definitely about a short lived hype in the media about how "Freeriders" were rouge MTB'ers devoid of respect for established trails and posed major threats to the allready fragile land use agreements Socal riders and else where had worked to obtain. It was all about trail erosion, new lines getting cut, and global warming too I think. (JK)
I thought they had a fair point for a minute but in the big picture I think they ended up causing more negative buzz to the term Freeride than anyone else has yet.
I remember it all pretty well because I think that was the last issue of MBA I ever read.

I like this post. It made me smirk (AND I cracked a rat while reading it and dispersed 2 people...)

 

[cycleryshop]

Keeping in mind the entire editorial staff is closer to 60 to than 30, it is surprising it they are out of touch with the FR scene?

 

[bdamschen]

Aw, why does age have to have anything to do with it?

Just because you're old doesn't mean you have to only ride XC or road.

 

[Jettj45]

Blackdiamond riding...thats a stupid name. Who cares what they call it, just go ride whatever you love riding.

 

[MinorThreat]

Also in my experience, the term 'Freeride' does not carry outside of the sport . . . .

Wasn't it stolen from snowboarding?

Frankly, I'm tired of ALL the ski/snow derivations in mountain biking - - doesn't it have anything original? Dual slalom and downhill formats, 'black diamond,' even fourcross was borrowed from bordercross (although that was loosely patterned after motocross). Maybe it's my moto background . . . just saying.

 

[Author Unknown]

Interesting discussion. I'll bite because I can't talk about riding (or lack thereof here in Vermont).

IMHO, it's all silly semantical/marketing speak. I work at an ad agency. I frequently hear my clients (and co-workers) say "Let's do something viral." My response to them is always the same: "As marketers, we don't determine what's viral." That's for the masses. Most pop culture jargon is determined by pop culture itself. Not by people with profit as an agenda - whether it be a publication, an ad agency, or a manufacturer of a product/service.

That said, I personally think the term "Black Diamond" in mtn biking is quite lame. I usually don't talk about my riding with outsiders unless someone asks: "What kind of biking do yo do?" In which case I answer: All kinds.

It's kinda like asking someone what kind of music they like.

 

[CKxx]

i just ride bikes, to hell with MBA

yep.

It's kinda like asking someone what kind of music they like.

Thats easy. Everyone answers, "basically everything, except country."

 

[Huck Banzai]

I get a kick out of you guys, you're alright!

LOL

I guess in the end all of this can pretty much be interpreted as:

Screw MBA

and

Yes, Black Diamond is really stupid.



more comments welcome though!

 

[Author Unknown]

"Country" music = "Trail" riding

Pretty nebulous.

 

[Huck Banzai]

I said LOL


hehe

 

[norbar]

"Country" music = "Trail" riding

Pretty nebulous.

No country is rather like single speed 24h xc races (Ppl actualy do that! when I first heard I bashed my head against the wall)

 

[CKxx]

"Country" music = "Trail" riding

Pretty nebulous.

It's an ad hoc test. You know it when you hear it.

 

[ChrisRobin]

My problem with these guys is whenever I pick up an issue in a book store every couple months (not to buy, but to look at the pictures), it always seems like they're reviewing the same damn XC bikes: Specialized, Cannondale, Trek.

 

[norbar]

The same bikes wouldn't be a problem. The problem is that they are writing the same reviews(well about the same bikes so it kinda makes sense for them but that's why after 1 mba you've read them all)

 

[Diablo_Freeride]

I searched, didnt find anything solid; what is the general consensus on the term 'Black Diamond' to describe what we generally call Freeride, Freestyle and Downhill.

In my experience, MBA is the only place/person/entity that uses this terminology. It has not been accepted by anyone outside of the pages of MBA that I have seen, and, IMHO, is silly and more of a marketing game (to what end?) than a legitimate concern.

Also in my experience, the term 'Freeride' does not carry outside of the sport so therefore does not carry these negatice connotations that are claimed to be associated with it. Those who are aware of it are not distracted by a different label and retain the same opinion, making it a moot point to do so.

I think the term Freeride is appropriate, and I find it annoyinf, albeit inconsequential, that they continue to use the term, going so far as editing submissions and replacing Freeride with Black Diamond Riding in their letters to the editor, ask RC, etc..

I know many feel the magazine is a wash and a sellout, I still like to read it, and this is hardly a real issue, but I digress.

What do you think? Stupid? Legitimate? Am I wrong, and in your experience Freeride DOES carry these negative impressions/connotations outside the sport?

DISCUSS!!

Great topic Huck! It was this very topic that originally spawned the mini-mac phenom. http://diablofreeridepark.com/video/04diablosmall.wmv

 

[jvnixon]

Great topic Huck! It was this very topic that originally spawned the mini-mac phenom. http://diablofreeridepark.com/video/04diablosmall.wmv

That video is definitely funny stuff especially if you've ever read mba.

 

[LukeD]

haha black diamond riding... so why not call super G skiing "triple black gnar diamond skiing"?