Yeah Herndon was telling me about that yesterday. How USAC would send all the coaches, families, chefs, etc etc and then not pay for the actually ATHLETES to go. pretty lame.
Worlds team bitches
- Thread starter TheInedibleHulk
- Start date
dang where is dateline NBC /2020 when you need them...
That blows unbelievably and i'm sure a lot of liscense holders wouldn't want their liscense money squandered in that manner when deserving athletes can't even get to the race(s).
EC can shed some light on that story about NZ, I heard the same thing and ranted to him about it, he told me the real story which was a little different.
here it was
http://www.ridemonkey.com/forums/showthread.php?t=165096
here it was
http://www.ridemonkey.com/forums/showthread.php?t=165096
I wrote that when we got back from worlds last year.....the support was awesome, the location USA Cycling got was perfect...couldn't have been closer to the venue. we were asked/told if we needed anything to let them know....we had food and massage if wanted, it really seemed like a turning point had been made and that USA Cycling was finally figuring out a way to support all the athletes
Some time after the race, my brother in law as well as some other riders received an invoice for services from the national team(i didn't get one?) and it wasn't cheap....we were never told before we used the services that there would be a cost associated with it.
It was very tacky and unprofessional, we actually had a good laugh about it.
I realize that nothing is for free, i also realize that the gravity side in the recent past has been the most successful of the disciplines yet we never receive any financial support, but the xc riders do.
It used to be a sore spot with me but i just don't have the energy to get angry about it anymore, nothing is going to change, it has been this way for as long as i can remember.
I think there are some good folks that are associated with the team and it's support at worlds, i just think the politics behind where the money goes is really screwed up.
I'm just going to go over and have a good time, race my best and see what happens.
Some time after the race, my brother in law as well as some other riders received an invoice for services from the national team(i didn't get one?) and it wasn't cheap....we were never told before we used the services that there would be a cost associated with it.
It was very tacky and unprofessional, we actually had a good laugh about it.
I realize that nothing is for free, i also realize that the gravity side in the recent past has been the most successful of the disciplines yet we never receive any financial support, but the xc riders do.
It used to be a sore spot with me but i just don't have the energy to get angry about it anymore, nothing is going to change, it has been this way for as long as i can remember.
I think there are some good folks that are associated with the team and it's support at worlds, i just think the politics behind where the money goes is really screwed up.
I'm just going to go over and have a good time, race my best and see what happens.
What ever ends up happening and who ever ends up going I just wanted to say congrats to all, and good luck. I think we have a real shot for a podium in the Jr. X.
c'mon Ska Todd!! wave your magic wand (hammer?) and make everything ok! 
I didn't vote a dozen times for you (and charge the duplicate licenses on the company card) for nothing!!! 
(edit: this is just a general "clean things up" post... I'm definitely not advocating pulling strings and dumping someone who has already been selected in order to make room for someone who didn't file their paperwork/request correctly)
I didn't vote a dozen times for you (and charge the duplicate licenses on the company card) for nothing!!! (edit: this is just a general "clean things up" post... I'm definitely not advocating pulling strings and dumping someone who has already been selected in order to make room for someone who didn't file their paperwork/request correctly)
That's for sure. Vermont podium:
1. JD
2. Price
3. McCaul
4. Oien
And Bingelli would have been near the top had he not flatted. The reason was that they think the Vermont course is similar to the Ft Bill course, and this shows how well someone would do there. Pretty lame that that became basically the main criteria for going and they didn't account for a bad run, which happened to me, joey, and some others.
I didn't know you had a reccomendation from Cameron Cole, that's sick. I know they wanted you to petition with just the form though, who knows if they read it. I think the petition process could be fixed if they added a cover letter requirement where you can explain your situation or show how passionate about racing you are.
Anyway I guess there's not much we can do now except bitch, and wish good luck for our team. We have a damn good jr team and I'm sure they'll do well.
Email from Matt Cramer
David,
I believe one of the concern was that you would just be getting back on the bike a few weeks prior to Worlds based on your injury from this year. Worlds is going to be a very physically demanding course peak fitness will be essential. It was a very close battle between you and a couple of the other guys. Each of you has Worlds experience making the decision even harder. One thing to keep in mind also is that the selection committee likes to see international experience for elite athlete nominations. Making a Worlds selection on domestic performance only is in a way an apples to oranges comparison as domestic performance is not indicative of international success. A solid international result would have helped in that regard.
Understand it was not an easy decision and your name was not handled lightly. A combination of you just getting back on the bike, and a lack of international results was how the final decision came about. If someone declines their nomination you are the next guy on the list.
Thanks,
Matt Cramer
David,
I believe one of the concern was that you would just be getting back on the bike a few weeks prior to Worlds based on your injury from this year. Worlds is going to be a very physically demanding course peak fitness will be essential. It was a very close battle between you and a couple of the other guys. Each of you has Worlds experience making the decision even harder. One thing to keep in mind also is that the selection committee likes to see international experience for elite athlete nominations. Making a Worlds selection on domestic performance only is in a way an apples to oranges comparison as domestic performance is not indicative of international success. A solid international result would have helped in that regard.
Understand it was not an easy decision and your name was not handled lightly. A combination of you just getting back on the bike, and a lack of international results was how the final decision came about. If someone declines their nomination you are the next guy on the list.
Thanks,
Matt Cramer
Don't wager any money on that.....
DK,
i suggest that you respond and ask them to be put on the team as an alternate....we still have Snomass before worlds and it is possible for a rider on the team to be injured or even not have the funds to make the team....but you can't be dropped into the spot with out USA Cycling putting you on an alternate list, it's a UCI rule.
the only effort they have to make is include your name on the list.
i will send an e-mail to matt as well. good luck.
Props to Chris Herndon and Gerrit Betagh. representing the south **** ya man
I'm not going. No support, and a new mortgage payment is keeping me here.
Good luck over there!
Bigz
Good luck over there!
Bigz
Ok, so I e-mailed Cramer and he responded that the reason they are not taking a full team of Juniors is due to the fact that USA Cycling is covering some of the costs for the Juniors and if they take a full team of 7 it will increase costs for everyone. I'm assuming these costs are covering the stuff that BC Van was talking about, cooks that type of thing. Pretty much all they said they can't do anything for me and better luck in elite because they can't afford for me to go now.
wow...so they're going to pamper a few and tell the other juniors to screw off. Anybody besides me think this sends yet another crappy message to kids looking to race Pro DH.
What do you think is better? Send 5 kids with some support or 7 with no support?
I personally like the idea of the kids having some support at worlds. Even if this means we cannot send as many. It would be nice if this support was a little more known to the paying members(the rest of us).
I personally like the idea of the kids having some support at worlds. Even if this means we cannot send as many. It would be nice if this support was a little more known to the paying members(the rest of us).
What? No. It sends the message that they are starting to look at taking care of their fastest racers. (Of course, the selection process is jacked, but that's another story).
How can they reconsider? That's absurd if they told some kids they can go and now they change their minds. wow.
Ah ok cool, never mind then. That'd be cool.
Anyone going better ask the important question that EC found the answer to too late last year......
After a self imposed month and a half hiatus from posting here, I wanted to jump in and post up some relevant info regarding this situation and offer some clarifications. Sorry for not posting up earlier today in regards to this but I was waiting to get some more detailed info on the situation before I opened my yapper.
First off, I want to clarify my position w/ USAC-Mountain Bike. I was elected to serve on the Board of Trustees. I am not in charge of the selection of athletes to Worlds teams nor do I hold any sort of magical sway within USAC. What I attempt to do my best at is take the comments, suggestions, thoughts, and passion of you guys; the racers, the team staff, the media, and the industry, and pass them along to staff at USAC and to the rest of the USAC Mountain Bike Board. I represent you guys within the sport, particularly for the gravity side!
Now, with all of that said; USAC/Matt Cramer did indeed reach out to myself and another knowledgeable supporter of the US gravity scene for advice on the selection of athletes for the team. While we did not choose these riders for USAC, we did our best to provide insight into the racers and the overall make-up of the team.
From what I took away from the discussions we had, USAC is focussed on fielding the most competitive team they can for racing at Fort William in a few weeks. There is a genuine interest in seeing gravity athletes, juniors in particular, develop their skills on an international level and step their game up a notch.
USAC knows about this thread (as myself and others have passed it along) as well as recognizing the level of passion and support everyone here (and on other boards) has for OUR sport. USAC is certainly exploring ways to bring more athletes to Scotland and determining ways to accomplish it.
-ska todd
First off, I want to clarify my position w/ USAC-Mountain Bike. I was elected to serve on the Board of Trustees. I am not in charge of the selection of athletes to Worlds teams nor do I hold any sort of magical sway within USAC. What I attempt to do my best at is take the comments, suggestions, thoughts, and passion of you guys; the racers, the team staff, the media, and the industry, and pass them along to staff at USAC and to the rest of the USAC Mountain Bike Board. I represent you guys within the sport, particularly for the gravity side!
Now, with all of that said; USAC/Matt Cramer did indeed reach out to myself and another knowledgeable supporter of the US gravity scene for advice on the selection of athletes for the team. While we did not choose these riders for USAC, we did our best to provide insight into the racers and the overall make-up of the team.
From what I took away from the discussions we had, USAC is focussed on fielding the most competitive team they can for racing at Fort William in a few weeks. There is a genuine interest in seeing gravity athletes, juniors in particular, develop their skills on an international level and step their game up a notch.
USAC knows about this thread (as myself and others have passed it along) as well as recognizing the level of passion and support everyone here (and on other boards) has for OUR sport. USAC is certainly exploring ways to bring more athletes to Scotland and determining ways to accomplish it.
-ska todd
Not for nothing Stik but what are you doing in the here-and-now to offer up anything of substantial substance to help the situation, to get support for the US riders out there, and to advance the sport in general? Seriously, you tend to post in threads almost simply to rip people, agitate, and stir $hit up. You bitch and moan and then have the audacity to mock those who put in their own personal time and effort to do something positive? Do you really need the personal attention that bad?
You are someone with years of team experience on the domestic and international racing level. You are married to a former professional racer; a World and National Champion. You surely still have connections, contacts, and friendships with those in the industry. You were there for the early days, the rise, and the fall off of our sport so you have a rather broad perspective. So instead of sitting in the peanut gallery and dishing out the same old recycled criticisms, why not roll up your sleeves and do something positive with all of that experience? If you are choosing not to, at least have the common courtesy to allow others to have their best shot at doing so or simply go do something better on your own.
I remain positive overall that USAC is working to grow the gravity side of the sport and that it is more than just lip service. It's clearly not an overnight process, it takes some time for peoples ideas to be heard, proofed out, and be incorporated into the overall picture. The real fruits of our success (or failures) will be seen over time. As I've stated before, the moment I feel that USAC is not moving forward in a positive direction for our sport and is beyond all hope, I will step aside and work hard at a viable alternative.
-ska todd
You are someone with years of team experience on the domestic and international racing level. You are married to a former professional racer; a World and National Champion. You surely still have connections, contacts, and friendships with those in the industry. You were there for the early days, the rise, and the fall off of our sport so you have a rather broad perspective. So instead of sitting in the peanut gallery and dishing out the same old recycled criticisms, why not roll up your sleeves and do something positive with all of that experience? If you are choosing not to, at least have the common courtesy to allow others to have their best shot at doing so or simply go do something better on your own.
I remain positive overall that USAC is working to grow the gravity side of the sport and that it is more than just lip service. It's clearly not an overnight process, it takes some time for peoples ideas to be heard, proofed out, and be incorporated into the overall picture. The real fruits of our success (or failures) will be seen over time. As I've stated before, the moment I feel that USAC is not moving forward in a positive direction for our sport and is beyond all hope, I will step aside and work hard at a viable alternative.
-ska todd
wooooooooooord!
yeah, go to college!
Yeah Ben! See you at Snowmass.
That's good of them to rethink the junior team, it seems to be based way too much on Vermont results than anything else. I feel bad for people like Joey who broke his freewheel of all things and did bad at Vermont.
Besides, I think it would be better to send a full team sans massages and fine dining than a smaller team with the perks. And to me that's silly reasoning on Matt Cramer's part as well, they're sending 24 people by my count and they decide to go 2 jr's short? Come on, that's not good planning. Especially if you consider the dropout rate of junior racers which is huge. I know of a bunch of hugely talented racers who killed it in jr X (and even competed at worlds/world cups) but stopped racing for one reason or another. Considering that, it seems illogical to focus heavily on 5 when you can give more kids experience at the international level. Plant more seeds!
Perhaps I should clarify with more detail. Trying to keep my posts less than epic these days backfires.
What I mean about the other junior riders is that they have the slots to send those riders, they should put deserving names on there. I understand that they only have so much to fund the top 4-5, but leaving the other kids off?
Their parents, local community, governor, Wal-mart or whatever might want to fund those remaining spots to go! Award ALL the slots remaining, let the kids with drive earn their own way over. Award the ALTERNATE spots TOO! For ALL categories.
You can make it clear that the governing body can fund a given # of the awarded slots and that the other slots will be responsible for getting over there themselves. So what if NONE of them can get the funds together to do it...at least they were awarded and not waisted.
Edit:
It's doing them an honor rather than a disservice.
What I mean about the other junior riders is that they have the slots to send those riders, they should put deserving names on there. I understand that they only have so much to fund the top 4-5, but leaving the other kids off?
Their parents, local community, governor, Wal-mart or whatever might want to fund those remaining spots to go! Award ALL the slots remaining, let the kids with drive earn their own way over. Award the ALTERNATE spots TOO! For ALL categories.
You can make it clear that the governing body can fund a given # of the awarded slots and that the other slots will be responsible for getting over there themselves. So what if NONE of them can get the funds together to do it...at least they were awarded and not waisted.
Edit:
It's doing them an honor rather than a disservice.
One more thing:
Say you are a company like Giant, Specialized, etc and your top Junior X rider who you've budgeted 10's of thousands of dollars toward all year b/c you feel he is the NEXT Sam Hill and your goal for the year was to get him to Worlds.
USAC gives him slot #7 on Junior X but says they can't fund him. You're gonna put him on a plane on your bike. It was your goal from day 1!
I think USAC has just assumed that if they don't have money...nobody else does.
I'm sure they think they would be doing a disservice to a kid who gets over there on his own and can't use the "team amenities". But to the kid who makes it and knows going in that he's on his own over there...I'm sure all they care about is putting in laps on the track!
Say you are a company like Giant, Specialized, etc and your top Junior X rider who you've budgeted 10's of thousands of dollars toward all year b/c you feel he is the NEXT Sam Hill and your goal for the year was to get him to Worlds.
USAC gives him slot #7 on Junior X but says they can't fund him. You're gonna put him on a plane on your bike. It was your goal from day 1!
I think USAC has just assumed that if they don't have money...nobody else does.
I'm sure they think they would be doing a disservice to a kid who gets over there on his own and can't use the "team amenities". But to the kid who makes it and knows going in that he's on his own over there...I'm sure all they care about is putting in laps on the track!
Best post eva....
This year all team members received an e-mail outlining the cost and services associated with those cost, no surprise invoice's this year.
Again the cost isn't cheap but nothing is for free and for some who are not fortunate enough to have trade team support it might be the only alternative to having help.
For those who haven't been to Ft William, it can be a very hard race without support.....it's cold, it rains a lot, the venue is far removed from all the lodging...the support of the National team as far as working on bikes and providing transpo to and from the venue is going to take a lot of stress off some riders.
It is simple really, I have always done things to support riders and situations, but unlike you I do not stand atop a soap box and let everyone know of my work behind the scenes-it IS apparent the only one who NEEDS attention here is you. You have bamboozled your RM fans into thinking you are some kind of wizard of oz.
Helping people who ride bikes-Doing it still today and I am not even employed by the bicycle business. I just love the fact you think USAC is going to change when myself and countless others have tried steering the boat for them over the years with ZERO success in charting new waters with them.
You know nothing of what I have done or what I do and that is the very reason I mock you. Lets see how you are helping the sport when you have been GONE from it for 4 years, probably absolutely nothing.
Ah. Good to hear.
Just to be a complete dick....
Who really cares who is going for DH as none of them will be anywhere near the limelight anyways. I think they would be lucky to crack the top 25 at the Worlds. The American team is just plain outclassed at the World level. You never hear anything about them at the WC events really. They really need to do the whole WC circuit to prepare themselves better for that kind of riding/racing/competitions. You wonder why the Aussies and Frenchies are so good? They are backed huge by their federations from a young age. I bet half of the guys who didn't make the French or Oz team could lay some smack down at the worlds.
Who really cares who is going for DH as none of them will be anywhere near the limelight anyways. I think they would be lucky to crack the top 25 at the Worlds. The American team is just plain outclassed at the World level. You never hear anything about them at the WC events really. They really need to do the whole WC circuit to prepare themselves better for that kind of riding/racing/competitions. You wonder why the Aussies and Frenchies are so good? They are backed huge by their federations from a young age. I bet half of the guys who didn't make the French or Oz team could lay some smack down at the worlds.
I'll put money on that bet....How long does it take? I have been racing for 16 years and still see the same BS....gotten worse actually. NORBA's used to be prestigious and THE races to go to, now local state races are better and even top Pro's fore go the Nationals to go to things like Crankworx. There also used to be multiple World Cups in the US....now there are none. We have always been the black sheep of the sport.
Last year at Rotorua, Duncan got 19th, Strobel got 20th, Cody Warren got 24th. Not top ten or anything, but i think its respectable considering the circumstances.
New addition to Jr. Team
Junior Men’s Downhill
1. JD Swanguen (San Diego, Calif.)
2. Logan Binggeli (St. George, Utah)
3. Brad Oien (Fountain Valley, Calif.)
4. Tim Price (Great Falls, Va.)
5. Tyler McCaul (Aptos, Calif.)
6. Joey Schusler (Boulder, Colo.)
Junior Men’s Downhill
1. JD Swanguen (San Diego, Calif.)
2. Logan Binggeli (St. George, Utah)
3. Brad Oien (Fountain Valley, Calif.)
4. Tim Price (Great Falls, Va.)
5. Tyler McCaul (Aptos, Calif.)
6. Joey Schusler (Boulder, Colo.)
Stoked!
Yeah exactly. And Luke has been doing well this year all around; Duncan not as much... If all goes well I don't see why Luke wouldn't make the top 25.