[Andyman_1970]

Andy, i'm pretty sure it was you who stated that jesus had no worse contempt for those who used religion to gain power or money or something like that.

I did? I'm confused...........

It's either Matthew 23 or 24 where Jesus rips the coorupt religious establishment a new one....calling them at one point "son's of hell". A coorupt religious establishment that twisted the Scripture for profit.....the more things change the more they stay the same.

Enough, Jesus talk.........I didn't mean to side track the thread that direction.............

 

[jonKranked]

i'll just leave this right here...

 

[Pesqueeb]

Haight, you bumbling fool.

For real. He's old enough that he should know too.

 

[TheMontashu]

My point was not that there aren’t parts of the Torah that are barbaric. Keep in mind Jesus as a Rabbi gives His interpretation about stoning with the story about when the Pharisee’s and Elders want to stone the one lady for fooling around.

My point was is that there are massive areas in both the Hebrew Scriptures and the Apostolic Text that talk about things like the rich not taking advantage of the poor, various commands to prevent the poor from getting poorer, heck the tithe was originally for the Levites (who couldn’t own land) and those who were poor and disadvantaged.

I’m not trying to convince anyone to come to faith in God / Jesus, but I do want people to understand one of the overarching stories of the Bible involves things like rich folks taking advantage of those who are disadvantaged. Like I mentioned earlier, regardless of if you believe the story of Jesus feeding 5000, or that it’s actually true was not my point. That story was in there for a reason, to show that this promised Messiah was giving Caesar/the Man the bird by such actions.

If only more Christians understood that. All the christian right seems to get is No gays, No abortion, and freedom (unless you're gay or want to abort a fetus) the whole, providing for the poor seems lost on them at the ballot box

 

[mandown]

too big to hail

 

[AngryMetalsmith]

And back to the topic at hand :

Rick Perry On Increasing Income Inequality: 'I Don't Care About That'

Republican presidential candidate Rick Perry says he wants a huge tax break for the rich, and he doesn't care what it means for income inequality.

Rick Perry announced on Tuesday that if elected president he would slash the corporate tax rate to 20 percent from 35 and give everyone the option of paying a flat income tax rate of 20 percent.

He also would try to encourage U.S. companies who have stored $1.4 trillion overseas to move their profits back to the United States by allowing them to pay 5.25 percent in taxes at first, according to Reuters.

The plan, if enacted, would dramatically reduce the tax burdens of the wealthiest people in the United States, saving millions of dollars for some, while raising taxes for poor and middle-class people who opt into the plan.

More fuel for the fire for OWS.

 

[clarkenstein]

what's awesome about this perry plan (which has been done before) is all the companies do is buy back their own stock with all that extra cash they bring over at a discounted tax rate. it's such a bonehead idea. the execs push their stock price up by buying back tons of shares in one minute then exercise a ton of options the next and make a buttload in a day.

i think the last time they did the discounted bring back the profits thing was in 2004. i'd have to google it.

 

[ohio]

Do you see me and other conservatives out protesting on wall street wanting more from the wealthy?

Wow, you really have no idea what they're protesting, do you?

That is what is unfair.

There's that word again. Suck it up, princess.

Please provide the name of ANY company that could do what Halliburton could do and services they provided over in Iraq and Afghanistan better and cheaper.

I’ll not hold my breath for your answer.

First, there are several. Second, even if there weren't, where's your faith in the free market. If there's demand, there will be supply. Why do you hate capitalism?

i'll just leave this right here...

THIS. This x 1,000,000.

 

[Jim Mac]

Lookie here at what the CBO recently said about the top 1%:

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/10/26/us/politics/top-earners-doubled-share-of-nations-income-cbo-says.html?ref=politics

Top Earners Doubled Share of Nation’s Income, Study Finds
By ROBERT PEAR
Published: October 25, 2011

The top 1 percent of earners more than doubled their share of the nation’s income over the last three decades, the Congressional Budget Office said Tuesday, in a new report likely to figure prominently in the escalating political fight over how to revive the economy, create jobs and lower the federal debt.

In addition, the report said, government policy has become less redistributive since the late 1970s, doing less to reduce the concentration of income.

“The equalizing effect of federal taxes was smaller” in 2007 than in 1979, as “the composition of federal revenues shifted away from progressive income taxes to less-progressive payroll taxes,” the budget office said.

Also, it said, federal benefit payments are doing less to even out the distribution of income, as a growing share of benefits, like Social Security, goes to older Americans, regardless of their income.

The report, requested several years ago, was issued as lawmakers tussle over how to reduce unemployment, a joint committee of Congress weighs changes in the tax code and protesters around the country rail against disparities in income between rich and poor.

In its report, the budget office found that from 1979 to 2007, average inflation-adjusted after-tax income grew by 275 percent for the 1 percent of the population with the highest income. For others in the top 20 percent of the population, average real after-tax household income grew by 65 percent.

By contrast, the budget office said, for the poorest fifth of the population, average real after-tax household income rose 18 percent.

And for the three-fifths of people in the middle of the income scale, the growth in such household income was just under 40 percent.

The findings, based on a rigorous analysis of data from the Internal Revenue Service and the Census Bureau, are generally consistent with studies by some private researchers and academic economists. But because they carry the imprimatur of the nonpartisan budget office, they are likely to have a major impact on the debate in Congress over the fairness of federal tax and spending policies.

Also cited as factors contributing to the rapid growth of income at the top were the structure of executive compensation; high salaries for some “superstars” in sports and the arts; the increasing size of the financial services industry; and the growing role of capital gains, which go disproportionately to higher-income households.

The report found that higher-income households got a larger share of the pie, while other households got smaller shares.

Specifically the report made these points:

¶ The share of after-tax household income for the top 1 percent of the population more than doubled, climbing to 17 percent in 2007 from nearly 8 percent in 1979.

¶ The most affluent fifth of the population received 53 percent of after-tax household income in 2007, up from 43 percent in 1979. In other words, the after-tax income of the most affluent fifth exceeded the income of the other four-fifths of the population.

¶ People in the lowest fifth of the population received about 5 percent of after-tax household income in 2007, down from 7 percent in 1979.

¶ People in the middle three-fifths of the population saw their shares of after-tax income decline by 2 to 3 percentage points from 1979 to 2007.

The study was requested by Senators Max Baucus, Democrat of Montana and chairman of the Finance Committee, and Charles E. Grassley of Iowa, when he was the senior Republican on the panel.

Representative Sander M. Levin of Michigan, the senior Democrat on the Ways and Means Committee, said the report was “the latest evidence of the alarming rise in income inequality.”

House Republicans pushed back Tuesday against President Obama’s complaint that they were blocking bills to create jobs. Speaker John A. Boehner said he agreed with Mr. Obama’s new slogan, “we can’t wait,” and he said that 15 House-passed bills were “sitting over in the Senate, waiting for action.”

On Tuesday, the White House endorsed another bill, which is likely to be passed by the House this week with bipartisan support. The bill would repeal a requirement for federal, state and local government agencies to withhold 3 percent of certain payments to suppliers of goods and services and to deposit the money with the Internal Revenue Service.

This requirement was originally adopted as a tax-compliance measure, and the Congressional Budget Office said its repeal would reduce federal revenues by $11 billion over 10 years.

House Republicans would offset the cost with a bill that reduces federal spending on Medicaid under the 2010 health care law. The White House said it supported the bill, intended to fix an apparent error in the law, under which hundreds of thousands of middle-income early retirees can get Medicaid coverage meant for the poor.

The joint Congressional committee on deficit reduction is considering changes in a wide range of benefit programs.

Representative Steny H. Hoyer of Maryland, the No. 2 House Democrat, said Tuesday that he was hopeful but not entirely confident that the panel would succeed in reaching a bipartisan agreement to reduce federal deficits by $1.2 trillion over 10 years.

“Hopeful is not confident,” Mr. Hoyer said.

 

[$tinkle]

my new pr0n: watching OWS vids dubbed over Mo-Do's "eins, zwei, polizei"

 

[Pesqueeb]

Getting ugly on the left coast.

An Iraq war veteran has a fractured skull and brain swelling after allegedly being hit by a police projectile.

Scott Olsen is in a "critical condition" in Highland hospital in Oakland, a hospital spokesman confirmed.

Olsen, 24, suffered the head injury during protests in Oakland on Tuesday evening. More than 15 people were arrested after a crowd gathered to demonstrate against the police operation to clear two Occupy Oakland camps in the early hours of Tuesday morning.

Jay Finneburgh, a photographer who was covering the protest, published pictures of Olsen lying on the ground.

"This poor guy was right behind me when he was hit in the head with a police projectile. He went down hard and did not get up," Finneburgh wrote.

Olsen was taken to Highland by fellow protesters.

The Guardian spoke to people with Olsen at the hospital. Adele Carpenter, who knows Olsen through his involvement with anti-war groups, said she arrived at the hospital at 11pm on Tuesday night.

Carpenter said she was told by a doctor at the hospital that Olsen had a skull fracture and was in a "serious but stable" condition. She said he had been sedated and was unconscious.

"I'm just absolutely devastated that someone who did two tours of Iraq and came home safely is now lying in a US hospital because of the domestic police force," Carpenter said.

Olsen had only moved to Oakland in July, Carpenter said. He is a member of Veterans for Peace and Iraq Veterans Against the War, and met Carpenter through her work with the civilian soldier alliance.

Keith Shannon, who served with Olsen in Iraq, arrived at the hospital after protesters contacted him through Facebook. He confirmed Olsen had a fractured skull, and said he had been told by a doctor Olsen also had brain swelling.

A neurosurgeon was due to assess Olsen to determine if he needed surgery, Shannon said.

"It's really hard," Shannon said. "I really wish I had gone out with him instead of staying home last night."

Shannon, who is also 24, said he had seen the video footage showing Olsen lying on the floor as a police officer throws an explosive device near him.

"It's terrible to go over to Iraq twice and come back injured, and then get injured by the police that are supposed to be protecting us," he said.

He said Olsen had served two tours of Iraq, in 2006 and 2007. Olsen was in 3rd Battalion, 4th Marines with Shannon before leaving the military in 2010.

He moved to the San Francisco area in July and works for Opswat, a software company, living with Shannon in Daly City, just south of San Francisco.

Shannon said Olsen was hit in the head by a tear gas canister or smoke canister shot by a police officer. He said Olsen had a curved scar on his forehead consistent with a canister.

Protesters who had accompanied Olsen to Highland hospital got in touch with Shannon through Facebook, after Olsen said he lived with someone called "Keith". Shannon said he was told Olsen was unable to say his surname.

Olsen is originally from Wisconsin and some of his family were planning to fly out to California to be with him, Shannon said.

Video footage published to YouTube shows Olsen lying prone on the ground infront of a line of police. Around 10 people gather around him in an apparent attempt to provide aid, before a police officer throws an explosive device into their midst, scattering the group. Footage captured after the explosion, which appears to be from a flash bang grenade, shows Olsen being carried away by a group of people.

Oakland police confirmed at a press conference that they used tear gas and baton rounds, but said they did not use flash bang grenades. Police could not be immediately reached for comment.

Occupy Oakland: Iraq war veteran in critical condition after police clashes | World news | guardian.co.uk

 

[$tinkle]

see? ann coulter was right -- it *is* more dangerous in oakland than iraq

 

[dante]

Police also claimed to not use rubber bullets, either.... Something tells me that with all of the video evidence, there's going to be one or two cops that have to change their story at some point.

 

[$tinkle]

file under: "union thugs"

heh.

 

[dante]

Jesus Christ......

 

[$tinkle]

what part of "free fire zone" don't you get?

 

[$tinkle]

mojo editors may want to re-visit:

http://www.ridemonkey.com/forums/f67/occupy-wall-street-245658/index24/#post3709371

 

[dante]

Oakland police deny using flash-bang grenades, rubber bullets.

Q. Did the Police deploy rubber bullets, flash-bag grenades?
A. No, the loud noises that were heard originated from M-80 explosives thrown at
Police by protesters. In addition, Police fired approximately four bean bag rounds
at protesters to stop them from throwing dangerous objects at the officers

That certainly didn't look like an M-80...

 

[$tinkle]

obviously, some of that TARP money didn't go toward youtube access in the oakland popo PR office

 

[dante]

You know, the more I see this the more thankful I am that Gov Walker didn't follow through with his idea to "send troublemakers into the crowd" here in WI, or to forcibly evict/arrest people at the Capitol Building... The Oakland protest was (supposedly) peaceful, with the city choosing to go in in force to evict the protesters and ratcheting up the tension. It could have gotten really, really ugly really, really quickly here, but the authorities did their job professionally and courteously, calm heads prevailed, and it was overall a very positive experience. People cleaned up trash (and encouraged others to *not* leave it), the police facilitated safe sleeping areas (ground floor of the Capitol building to keep people together and not off in dark areas and corners), and we went as far as having signs reminding us to only use blue painters tape to put up posters/signs on the walls.

The difference between that and Oakland is sobering...

Although at least the mayor responsible is now facing a recall, and had a 28% approval rating *before* this whole thing started.

 

[stevew]

it's oakland...what the fvck were they expecting?

hugs and kisses?

 

[Silver]

Police also claimed to not use rubber bullets, either.... Something tells me that with all of the video evidence, there's going to be one or two cops that have to change their story at some point.

I'm sure the video, once again, does not tell the entire story. It never does, unless it implicated a citizen, in which case it is an unimpeachable smoking gun.

 

[dante]

it's oakland...what the fvck were they expecting?

hugs and kisses?

Are you talking about the cops or the kids?

 

[TheMontashu]

Jesus Christ......

Word is that kid did 2 tours in Iraq, and now has a fractured skull. this is going to get interesting

 

[stevew]

Are you talking about the cops or the kids?

the kids....

 

[dante]

the kids....

No kidding, but you realize how heads are going to (figuratively) roll for this at both the police and local government level, right?This was a political fvckup of massive proportions, and it's exactly why Bloomberg *hasn't* sent in the NYPD. Sending riot police and tear gas after thousands of (up till that point) peaceful protesters and guess what, they got themselves a riot. Combined with photographic proof of rubber bullets (illegal for cops to use in Oakland) and flash-bang grenades (which again, OPD have denied using) and you have at minimum some massive lawsuit and at worse a continuing riot/street battle with the formerly peaceful protesters.

And guess what, it was all for naught since the protesters are back on the square...

 

[TheMontashu]

it's oakland...what the fvck were they expecting?

hugs and kisses?

I guess you don't spend much time in Oakland. OPD is super understaffed, as of now you can get away with pretty much anything, so long as you don't kill or seriously hurt some one.

 

[TheMontashu]

No kidding, but you realize how heads are going to (figuratively) roll for this at both the police and local government level, right?This was a political fvckup of massive proportions, and it's exactly why Bloomberg *hasn't* sent in the NYPD. Sending riot police and tear gas after thousands of (up till that point) peaceful protesters and guess what, they got themselves a riot. Combined with photographic proof of rubber bullets (illegal for cops to use in Oakland) and flash-bang grenades (which again, OPD have denied using) and you have at minimum some massive lawsuit and at worse a continuing riot/street battle with the formerly peaceful protesters.

And guess what, it was all for naught since the protesters are back on the square...

I just saw an interview with the interim police chief of Oakland on the local news, he was saying they used the tear gas with just cause

 

[stevew]

I guess you don't spend much time in Oakland. OPD is super understaffed, as of now you can get away with pretty much anything, so long as you don't kill or seriously hurt some one.

living on the east coast....no i don't spend to much time in oakland.

 

[Silver]

White kids have it so easy. If they were black, they'd be shot in the back while handcuffed.

 

[stoney]

White kids have it so easy. If they were black, they'd be shot in the back while handcuffed.

Given they shot a vet in the head, who is now in the hospital with a fractured skull and brain swelling, I think we're heading down that road.

At some point, somebody is going to get killed and it will be on video as clearly the police's fault. God forbid that happens and somebody who is more than a few screws loose decides to retaliate.

 

[eric strt6]

news flash Oakland. The media reporters in the crowd were reporting that they recognized many of the same "professional" anarchists who instigated the confrontation last night with OPD as being the same punks that instigated the looting and riots in last summers Oakland anti bart police riots.

effing punks have even pissed off the legitimate Occupy Oakland Protestors

 

[dante]

news flash Oakland. The media reporters in the crowd were reporting that they recognized many of the same "professional" anarchists who instigated the confrontation last night with OPD as being the same punks that instigated the looting and riots in last summers Oakland anti bart police riots.

effing punks have even pissed off the legitimate Occupy Oakland Protestors

And the Mayor/Police gave them not only the perfect opportunity but a martyr as well...

 

[dante]

Hey, that looks like a rubber bullet, but the cops claimed that they didn't fire any of those....

Occupy Oakland: Did police use flashbangs and rubber bullets on protesters? - BlogPost - The Washington Post

 

[JetTeach]

Hey, that looks like a rubber bullet, but the cops claimed that they didn't fire any of those....

Occupy Oakland: Did police use flashbangs and rubber bullets on protesters? - BlogPost - The Washington Post

Something isn't right about that pic. Most rubber bullets are usually 9mm or 10mm. Have never heard of anything larger than .45 caliber. Relative to that penny it would be over .50 cal. UNLESS, that is a post-impact photo where it has flattened out.

 

[dante]

Shotgun "slug" maybe? There's also this picture making the rounds which would be closer to your 9/10mm rounds...

Still disturbing that police agencies are claiming that they didn't fire these....

 

[dante]

Found it. 12g shotgun shell, double 17mm rubber balls in each shell.

 

[Pesqueeb]

Maybe?

Cant seem to find any info on diameter/caliber of the rounds inside. There were an awful lot of tear gas/flash bang grenades being tossed.


*edit: according to this they are .45 caliber.

 

[stoney]

OWS should get violent... They should find the violence instigators and deliver them to the police. Imagine the reactions of the police when a group of protesters deliver an incitor to their riot line. I think that would also provide a lot more support to the OWS.

 

[TheMontashu]

Shotgun "slug" maybe? There's also this picture making the rounds which would be closer to your 9/10mm rounds...

Still disturbing that police agencies are claiming that they didn't fire these....

OPD weren't the only ones there to my knowledge they are saying OPD didn't use any and that's it, my mom works across the street and was saying there were a bunch of cops/ sheriffs from the valley

OWS should get violent... They should find the violence instigators and deliver them to the police. Imagine the reactions of the police when a group of protesters deliver an incitor to their riot line. I think that would also provide a lot more support to the OWS.

From my understanding it was the police that instigated this with tear gas, pepper spray, and batons. I think the OWL would get more support if people would stop assuming they are all smelly hippies being smelly hippies. There are allot of out of work vets heading out there too.............