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Sandwich

Pig my fish!
Staff member
May 23, 2002
21,155
6,122
borcester rhymes
* before dealer markups

it's the Wild West out there
It is wild out there, but it sounds like, especially with Ford, that people who pre-order correctly are getting their cars for sticker without markup. Sounds more difficult with Kia/Hyundai and others, but that seemed to the case with the Mach-e. I didn't want to wait for the Alfa to explode while I crossed my fingers for a mach-E in six months...
 

jonKranked

Detective Dookie
Nov 10, 2005
86,233
24,733
media blackout
It is wild out there, but it sounds like, especially with Ford, that people who pre-order correctly are getting their cars for sticker without markup. Sounds more difficult with Kia/Hyundai and others, but that seemed to the case with the Mach-e. I didn't want to wait for the Alfa to explode while I crossed my fingers for a mach-E in six months...
just posted in the prius thread, ford is doubling production for the lightning and tripling it by 2023 for the mach-e due to high demand
 

slyfink

Turbo Monkey
Sep 16, 2008
9,400
5,129
Ottawa, Canada
Model Y and X both have low ground clearance and very poor angles. And their stock tires have no sidewall.

Plus the Supercharger network is great if sticking to the freeways, but sparse outside of those (logical) corridors.

Were it not for the AWD bit a Pacifica (plug-in) Hybrid like my wife's would work well. One must choose AWD or PHEV with that, and like he mentioned above the current Sienna is both ugly and not a plug-in.
You sure about the ground clearance? Im reasonably certain the X has adjustable ride height.
 

slyfink

Turbo Monkey
Sep 16, 2008
9,400
5,129
Ottawa, Canada
Yes. But I thought that's what Westy was after? Something to replace the Golf R, and could handle deeper snow and forest roads a bit better?

I will say this though, it would help if the car wasn't so damn expensive and ugly. And those stoopid falcon wing doors... Good luck getting in the car after a snowfall followed by rain and refreeze. Also, hope you didn't want a roof rack...
 
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Changleen

Paranoid Member
Jan 9, 2004
14,365
2,473
Pōneke
Maybe if my commute was city streets, but imagine a scooter trying to clear the pass after a 10 mile stretch of 60+MPH HW30.

A scooter on the freeway might be sketch. That's why 60+ MPH is a requirement on top of 80+ mile range.

Me on my commute...

View attachment 169891
The point was about battery life, not ‘get an electric scooter’ but that would maybe be fun in retrospect. I had a quick look at e-motorcycles generally, they all seem to offer ranges into at least 100 miles, 150, 160 etc.
 

jimmydean

The Official Meat of Ridemonkey
Sep 10, 2001
41,419
13,544
Portland, OR
The point was about battery life, not ‘get an electric scooter’ but that would maybe be fun in retrospect. I had a quick look at e-motorcycles generally, they all seem to offer ranges into at least 100 miles, 150, 160 etc.
Mostly closer to 60-80 miles at freeway speeds unless you are spending $25k+

This is the logical leader currently.


I would rather have an Alta, but you know
 

boogenman

Turbo Monkey
Nov 3, 2004
4,330
1,009
BUFFALO
Honestly the number of pickups on the road is astounding. I know this is 'MERICA and people get to drive what they want, but the logic behind buying a vehicle whose hood is taller than my roof and will likely never see dirt nor tow anything is astounding. Yeah, you've got chrome, four doors, a full size bed, and can tow a battleship, but you use it to get groceries. Fuck.
If you pay attention to what F-150's are actually on the road 90% of them come with the useless 2.7 ecoboost because the people that drive them don't actually need a truck and the 2.7 had a great lease. This is also why the Lightning will do well, most F-150 buyers do not need a truck.
I sure wish I didn't need my gas guzzling vehicle but I have a camper and lots of kids.
 

boogenman

Turbo Monkey
Nov 3, 2004
4,330
1,009
BUFFALO
It is wild out there, but it sounds like, especially with Ford, that people who pre-order correctly are getting their cars for sticker without markup. Sounds more difficult with Kia/Hyundai and others, but that seemed to the case with the Mach-e. I didn't want to wait for the Alfa to explode while I crossed my fingers for a mach-E in six months...
I was just informed yesterday that most Hyundai dealers are asking $5,000 over MSRP for the Tucson Plug in Hybrid.
We have not asked a penny over MSRP for anything yet.

FYI you can't fit a modern mountain bike frame in the "bed" of a Santa Cruz. Remember, it's not a pickup truck. It is a Sport Adventure Vehicle.
 
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Changleen

Paranoid Member
Jan 9, 2004
14,365
2,473
Pōneke
Dude has a Zero SR, gets 150km at 100kph (road trip measure). He says in practice with tootling through lower speed zones, a bit around town he gets 200km.
 

Changleen

Paranoid Member
Jan 9, 2004
14,365
2,473
Pōneke
There’s a place just up the road from me that’s started to do old school EV conversions. I don’t personally like the cars they’re picking but it’s pretty cool as a concept.

 

CBJ

year old fart
Mar 19, 2002
12,893
4,272
Copenhagen, Denmark
There’s a place just up the road from me that’s started to do old school EV conversions. I don’t personally like the cars they’re picking but it’s pretty cool as a concept.

And old RR or Bentley of the 80s would be a perfect choice just to silently roll around town but I do not have silly money like that.
 

Changleen

Paranoid Member
Jan 9, 2004
14,365
2,473
Pōneke
Y has 6.6” and has all of the space. Pretty sure you can easily get two bikes in an X too, if you’re open to radical, ludicrously time eating solutions like taking the front wheels off.

X:
DF4CE83D-AF5A-40AE-80B9-62D51ABB29DE.jpeg


Y:
5CE7FE43-B450-4421-8C65-6C908CF1CC44.jpeg
 
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CBJ

year old fart
Mar 19, 2002
12,893
4,272
Copenhagen, Denmark
I was able to fit 3 DH bikes in my Golf size wagon in the 00 via this thing called wheel removal. Not sure if that feature is available on modern DH bike.
 

boogenman

Turbo Monkey
Nov 3, 2004
4,330
1,009
BUFFALO
I was able to fit 3 DH bikes in my Golf size wagon in the 00 via this thing called wheel removal. Not sure if that feature is available on modern DH bike.
I had a 2003 Golf TDi that we could get 2 DH bikes into with gear for a weekend(hotel) of riding.
 

iRider

Turbo Monkey
Apr 5, 2008
5,654
3,101
I was able to fit 3 DH bikes in my Golf size wagon in the 00 via this thing called wheel removal. Not sure if that feature is available on modern DH bike.
Yeah, but they had these tiny-sized wheels and frames that were too short for even hobbits. And there was more room available in these old Golf wagons then there is in a Tesla, at least from what I have seen. You were probably also less concerned ruining the interior of your car at that time. ;)
FWIW: I transported my DH bike in a regular Golf II w/o wheel removal.
 

CBJ

year old fart
Mar 19, 2002
12,893
4,272
Copenhagen, Denmark
Yeah, but they had these tiny-sized wheels and frames that were too short for even hobbits. And there was more room available in these old Golf wagons then there is in a Tesla, at least from what I have seen. You were probably also less concerned ruining the interior of your car at that time. ;)
FWIW: I transported my DH bike in a regular Golf II w/o wheel removal.
Company car so close to zero concern for the inside of my Citroen Xsara Wagon and it's beautiful french plastic. The forks in the trunk and then frames sticking into the cabin with half seat folded down.
 

Jm_

sled dog's bollocks
Jan 14, 2002
19,092
9,747
AK
I was able to fit 3 DH bikes in my Golf size wagon in the 00 via this thing called wheel removal. Not sure if that feature is available on modern DH bike.
Crammed with chains touching the interior, etc. My Honda Pilot was pretty decent for transporting bikes in the back with the two rows folded down. Most every smaller vehicle is some level of trying to fit it all in with a hammer. 3 bikes? That’s some next level shit IME.
 

CBJ

year old fart
Mar 19, 2002
12,893
4,272
Copenhagen, Denmark
Crammed with chains touching the interior, etc. My Honda Pilot was pretty decent for transporting bikes in the back with the two rows folded down. Most every smaller vehicle is some level of trying to fit it all in with a hammer. 3 bikes? That’s some next level shit IME.
I am a magician when it comes to packing cars :-) This was the trunk

 

slyfink

Turbo Monkey
Sep 16, 2008
9,400
5,129
Ottawa, Canada
road trip - electric vehicle :twitch:
It's not ideal, but it can be done. A friend of mine did a road trip from Ottawa to Quebec City (+/- 600km) with three bikes and three adult men in his Bolt. Two on the roof and one in the trunk. Range was cut significantly with the wind resistance and extra weight, and the fast charging Network wasn't quite there yet 5 years ago. But a lot has changed and it's getting better. Also, Tesla supercharger network is still head and shoulders above the rest.
 

Fool

The Thing cannot be described
Sep 10, 2001
2,805
1,527
Brooklyn
A friend of mine did a road trip from Ottawa to Quebec City (+/- 600km) with three bikes and three adult men in his Bolt. Two on the roof and one in the trunk
That must have sucked for the dudes on the roof. Hope it didn't rain on them
 

Westy

the teste
Nov 22, 2002
54,615
20,430
Sleazattle
It's not ideal, but it can be done. A friend of mine did a road trip from Ottawa to Quebec City (+/- 600km) with three bikes and three adult men in his Bolt. Two on the roof and one in the trunk. Range was cut significantly with the wind resistance and extra weight, and the fast charging Network wasn't quite there yet 5 years ago. But a lot has changed and it's getting better. Also, Tesla supercharger network is still head and shoulders above the rest.

I found an EV route planning site and assuming a very expensive Tesla it would add about 20% travel time and add 7 stops to a winter road trip to someplace with decent weather. Would also find myself pushing 10% battery capacity through a lot of very cold empty places. What I could normally do in one very long day would take two full days effectively requiring using 2 additional vacation days for a week long trip. Also alternative routes that are often required to avoid winter mountain weather are non options, because 200 miles between towns with populations of less than 100 people.

Use a more affordable car like a Leaf or a Bolt and said trip is pretty much a solid no.
 
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Jozz

Joe Dalton
Apr 18, 2002
5,900
7,453
SADL
It's not ideal, but it can be done. A friend of mine did a road trip from Ottawa to Quebec City (+/- 600km) with three bikes and three adult men in his Bolt. Two on the roof and one in the trunk. Range was cut significantly with the wind resistance and extra weight, and the fast charging Network wasn't quite there yet 5 years ago. But a lot has changed and it's getting better. Also, Tesla supercharger network is still head and shoulders above the rest.
My definition of a road trip seems to differ. More like going out west putting in 10 hours of drive time to get to the good stuff, and then be in remote places for days.