[MikeD]

Still? Seriously?? Apparently the media is abuzz with this issue and 2/3 of Republicans and 10% of democrats still think Obama is either not an American or still consider it an open question.

My wife just said (paraphrased), "Anyone still spouting this bull**** should have to prove their own citizenship to the same degree they're demanding of him to vote."

Maybe this should be in the new science vs belief thread??

MD

 

[johnbryanpeters]

Just another demonstration that the concept of humans as rational beings is flawed.

 

[DaveW]

My face and my palm are really starting to hurt now.

Can you guys please stop it??

 

[Silver]

My face and my palm are really starting to hurt now.

Can you guys please stop it??

No one can ratchet up the retard like Americans.

 

[MikeD]

Just another demonstration that the concept of humans as rational beings is flawed.

Never was such stuff in my thoughts.

In fact got me in a huge argument with an economics professor first time I tried to take an econ class. Damned Utilitarians.

 

[Pesqueeb]

But remember, its not about race.

A new poll gauging Mississippi Republicans' preferences going into the 2012 election ended up revealing something more startling: 46 percent of GOP voters in the state think interracial marriage should be illegal.

Results were announced Thursday by Public Policy Polling, a polling firm based in North Carolina. The company asked 400 Republican primary voters about their preferences for candidates for state and national offices, as well as their views on interracial marriage.

A whopping 46 percent of likely GOP primary voters said they think interracial marriage should be illegal, while only 40 percent said they think it should be allowed. Another 14 percent said they were unsure.

It was only 45 years ago that Mississippi legalized interracial marriage, and this poll indicates it continues to be a controversial subject.

The poll also found that Mississippi Republicans back Haley Barbour, their outgoing governor, to run for president on the GOP ticket in 2012. Barbour had 37 percent of respondents' support, followed by Mike Huckabee with 19 percent and Newt Gingrich and Sarah Palin tied for third place with 10 percent each.

The PPP poll also revealed that Palin has more support among voters who believe interracial marriage should be illegal than among those who are OK with it. Mitt Romney's numbers reveal just the opposite. He has a higher favorability among Mississippi Republicans who want interracial marriage to remain legal.

The poll was conducted by telephone between March 24 and 27 and has a margin of error of plus or minus 4.9 percent.

PPP describes itself as a nonpartisan polling firm, but it has been described in other media as a Democratic-leaning company.

The firm also conducted a separate poll of non-Republican voters, asking them the same question about interracial marriage. Those results are expected to be released in the coming weeks, along with those from another PPP poll asking Mississippi voters whether they think the right side -- the North or South -- won the Civil War.

http://www.aolnews.com/2011/04/08/46-percent-of-mississippi-republicans-want-interracial-marriage/

You know for every person willing to admit that on the phone there are 2 people thinking it.

 

[MikeD]

But remember, its not about race.


http://www.aolnews.com/2011/04/08/46-percent-of-mississippi-republicans-want-interracial-marriage/

You know for every person willing to admit that on the phone there are 2 people thinking it.

Ummm, it's Mississippi. I bet a hell of a lot of Democrats think so, too. (Black and white.)

 

[Pesqueeb]

Ummm, it's Mississippi. I bet a hell of a lot of Democrats think so, too. (Black and white.)

I respectfully disagree. Nation wide, 45 percent of Republicans are birthers, In Mississippi 46 percent think interracial marriage should be illegal. Coincidence? I think not.

 

[Dartman]

I respectfully disagree. Nation wide, 45 percent of Republicans are birthers, In Mississippi 46 percent think interracial marriage should be illegal. Coincidence? I think not.

...and interfamily marriage is A-OK!

 

[stevew]

in general i try not to give a sh!t about people.

 

[$tinkle]

directly related: so does anyone else have this strange fascination about a strange fascination on andrew sullivan's version of a birther piece?
this one

but, some good overall reading on the general topic of cognitive dissonance:
http://ace.mu.nu/archives/315131.php

 

[Pesqueeb]

directly related: so does anyone else have this strange fascination about a strange fascination on andrew sullivan's version of a birther piece?
this one

No. The Palin with special needs that worries me is not the infant.

 

[syadasti]

...and interfamily marriage is A-OK!

I think you might have a hint of that intrafamily heritage yourself

 

[IH8Rice]

Trump is the worst of them all. everytime that dumb s.o.b. talks about Obama's birth certificate, i want to punch my tv hoping somehow he feels it.

 

[drkenan]

Ummm, it's Mississippi. I bet a hell of a lot of Democrats think so, too. (Black and white.)

There are no democrats in Mississippi. Just good ole white, legal, southern republicans and baptists.

 

[ohio]

Ummm, it's Mississippi. I bet a hell of a lot of Democrats think so, too. (Black and white.)

Either you'd be right or there was something seriously wrong with this poll. Check the crosstabs on page 10: http://www.publicpolicypolling.com/pdf/PPP_Release_MS_0407915.pdf

According to the data as presented, liberals in MS are considerably MORE opposed to interracial marriage, with a 55% opposed among the "very liberal" and a whopping 71% opposed among the "somewhat liberal." Even 48% of moderates are shown as opposed. All three are HIGHER than conservative results. I'd point to sample sizes on the liberals (only 8% of respondents... so 32 people), but the moderates were 17%... which should be enough to be statistically significant.

AOL should be slapped for two things:
- writing that report on dems will come soon, rather than just reading down to the data
- not questioning the validity of the data. The numbers seem almost impossible. I don't think the questions were stated in the format they are presented as data. Something fishy is going on... I suspect that's why the written summary does not include mention of the liberal results. PPP is probably scrambling to figure out a way to spin this.

[/buzzkill]

 

[stevew]

There are no democrats in Mississippi. Just good ole white, legal, southern republicans and baptists.

you really should get out more.....selling the audi will probably help.

No one can ratchet up the retard like Americans.

so if i draw allah eating a hebrew national and it gets published....

 

[johnbryanpeters]

Either you'd be right or there was something seriously wrong with this poll. Check the crosstabs on page 10: http://www.publicpolicypolling.com/pdf/PPP_Release_MS_0407915.pdf

According to the data as presented, liberals in MS are considerably MORE opposed to interracial marriage, with a 55% opposed among the "very liberal" and a whopping 71% opposed among the "somewhat liberal." Even 48% of moderates are shown as opposed. All three are HIGHER than conservative results. I'd point to sample sizes on the liberals (only 8% of respondents... so 32 people), but the moderates were 17%... which should be enough to be statistically significant.

AOL should be slapped for two things:
- writing that report on dems will come soon, rather than just reading down to the data
- not questioning the validity of the data. The numbers seem almost impossible. I don't think the questions were stated in the format they are presented as data. Something fishy is going on... I suspect that's why the written summary does not include mention of the liberal results. PPP is probably scrambling to figure out a way to spin this.

[/buzzkill]

The deep south is the deep south. Deep as in deeply, to the core, racist, no matter the political stripe.

 

[MMike]

The deep south is the deep south. Deep as in deeply, to the core, racist, no matter the political stripe.

That's racist

 

[Pesqueeb]

Either you'd be right or there was something seriously wrong with this poll. Check the crosstabs on page 10: http://www.publicpolicypolling.com/pdf/PPP_Release_MS_0407915.pdf

According to the data as presented, liberals in MS are considerably MORE opposed to interracial marriage, with a 55% opposed among the "very liberal" and a whopping 71% opposed among the "somewhat liberal." Even 48% of moderates are shown as opposed. All three are HIGHER than conservative results. I'd point to sample sizes on the liberals (only 8% of respondents... so 32 people), but the moderates were 17%... which should be enough to be statistically significant.


[/buzzkill]

The only thing this proves to me is that people in MS don't know what "liberal" means.

 

[stevew]

That's racist

no.....just stupid.

 

[dante]

That's racist

 

[Silver]

so if i draw allah eating a hebrew national and it gets published....

Get back to me when half of a major group of Muslims believe that Osama bin Laden was born in Ecuador, would you?

 

[stevew]

Get back to me when half of a major group of Muslims believe that Osama bin Laden was born in Ecuador, would you?

the muslims i had met in denver through a friend viewed about 98% of african americans as subhuman......

 

[Silver]

the muslims i had met in denver through a friend viewed about 98% of african americans as subhuman......

Religious, don't like blacks, and hate gays:

It's odd they don't get along with people from the South, really.

 

[BurlyShirley]

I in no way believe this, but someone help me out here.

Is there a difference between a birth certificate and a certificate of live birth (which is what was produced and what Ive seen online)? Trump claims there is.

If so, why not just show the actual birth certificate and be done with it. If not, sorry for asking.

 

[MikeD]

It's semantic, really, from what I can tell. Hawaii issued different sorts of certificates but has now issued the sole type of document they're currently issuing. Obama may not, like most people, have his original birth certificate from the hospital.

As someone who used to investigate and verify/refute claims of US citizenship in the course of criminal investigations for the federal government, I have to say that what's been shown to-date (if verifiable, which the Hawaii government is offering publically) is enough to end the debate under any reasonable legal standard. The birth announcement, in particular, is quite convincing. Conspiracy of beyond-sci-fi-wet-dreams of RenegadeRick proportions necessary to either have it falsely entered at the time of his birth outside of the US or to insert it into a seamless microfilm archive after the fact. Again, I haven't inspected the microfilm, but that is REALLY convincing stuff. Baptismal certificates, school records, birth announcements, etc. are all routinely used to prove presence in the US at time of birth to establish jus soli.

Honestly much easier to fake a single official doc like a birth certificate (by whatever name a state calls it), and even considering the tinfoil nature of it, to bribe or threaten or cajole the entire Hawaii state vital records system into supporting your fraudulent claim.

 

[IH8Rice]

It's semantic, really, from what I can tell. Hawaii issued different sorts of certificates but has now issued the sole type of document they're currently issuing. Obama may not, like most people, have his original birth certificate from the hospital.

The birth announcement, in particular, is quite convincing.

they are saying that he does have a birth certificate and the birth announcement wouldnt be enough...or are you talking about his certificate of live birth?

 

[$tinkle]

According to the data as presented, liberals in MS are considerably MORE opposed to interracial marriage, with a 55% opposed among the "very liberal" and a whopping 71% opposed among the "somewhat liberal." Even 48% of moderates are shown as opposed. All three are HIGHER than conservative results. I'd point to sample sizes on the liberals (only 8% of respondents... so 32 people), but the moderates were 17%... which should be enough to be statistically significant.

i would trust the numbers if i could see there was a defensible attempt to be arbitrary in its collection, which if i'm reading the results correct ("press 1 for such and such..."), it appears it's as close to arbitrary & w/o biases as possible

The numbers seem almost impossible. I don't think the questions were stated in the format they are presented as data. Something fishy is going on... I suspect that's why the written summary does not include mention of the liberal results. PPP is probably scrambling to figure out a way to spin this.

as previously stated: they don't what "liberal" is defined as (beyond "not rich yankee catholic businessmen"), and it's the deep south: racist to the core. some things are exactly what they seem to be.

cool story bro: i was dating this girl in alabama back in the mid 90's & so to get in good w/ her klan, we went to church (it may even have been easter), where her family was 1/2 the congregation of a couple dozen. her uncle gave the sermon, & afterward we all went back to the house for the weekly potluck. once everyone got fed & their waistbands & tongues relaxed, it was "nigger this" & "nigger that", with all the caution normally reserved for talking about home improvement, where to get the best feed for your hogs, or how to rebuild a carburetor . it was truly bizarre, esp given the fact they look down on mississippi for being so backwards.

it was one day, over 15 yrs ago, and i have no idea what the sermon was about, or where the church is, or anyone's names, but i remember that clear as a bell.

 

[Secret Squirrel]

jus soli.

Mmmmm....soli juice...

 

[MikeD]

they are saying that he does have a birth certificate and the birth announcement wouldnt be enough...or are you talking about his certificate of live birth?

What I am saying is that it's much harder to fake a real news item from decades ago than it is to forge a single government document. (Getting a government office to verify your forged document is, of course, another story, but forgers are usually relying on the hope you won't bother to verify a document which appears genuine...)

Of course, all evidence must be seen in the totality of the circumstances, which in these, still clearly indicate Obama was born in Hawaii.

 

[MikeD]

"nigger this" & "nigger that", with all the caution normally reserved for talking about home improvement,

Maybe they were just Chuck D fans?

 

[ohio]

i would trust the numbers if i could see there was a defensible attempt to be arbitrary in its collection, which if i'm reading the results correct ("press 1 for such and such..."), it appears it's as close to arbitrary & w/o biases as possible
as previously stated: they don't what "liberal" is defined as (beyond "not rich yankee catholic businessmen"), and it's the deep south: racist to the core. some things are exactly what they seem to be.

There's numerous holes in the report and ways they could have introduced massive errors even if the data is correct (the data is almost always "correct," it is just usually misinterpreted). I am guessing the question was worded something like "Do you approve of marriage between people of different races?" Which is a question of social opinion, not legal opinion. I also suspect that most of their liberal respondents were black, who could easily have greater social disapproval of interracial marriage even while desiring legal freedom to do so.

I'm not surprised that the liberals are racist. I'm surprised their numbers are so much higher than the conservatives.

 

[IH8Rice]

What I am saying is that it's much harder to fake a real news item from decades ago than it is to forge a single government document.

i wouldnt think it would be that hard....call up newspaper and say, hey, we had a kid named Barrack Obama II born on blah blah blah. i dont think the paper would go out of their way to check it.
though if his parents were planning on scamming everyone from day one, then they are some smart S.O.B.'s

 

[Jim Mac]

Well, Michell Bachmann said the whole birther thing is over, so that's that!

http://www.foxnews.com/on-air/hannity/transcript/michele-bachmann-obamas-birth-certificate-possible-presidential-run

 

[zdubyadubya]

Well, Michell Bachmann said the whole birther thing is over, so that's that!

http://www.foxnews.com/on-air/hannity/transcript/michele-bachmann-obamas-birth-certificate-possible-presidential-run

Its sad that every new interview I see with her or read about her just makes her more stupid. You would think there would be some sort of limit of diminishing returns to her idiocy. But she just keeps going. And going. And going. And going.

 

[X3pilot]

Religious, don't like blacks, and hate gays:

It's odd they don't get along with people from the South, really.

We eat pork. I mean, BBQ in the south, c'mon

 

[the desmondo]

He traveled to Pakistan in 1981 with an Indonesian passport. The real issue is his past in Indonesia as an Indonesian citizen with the name Barry Soetoro. He had to have given up his American citizenship to become an Indonesian.

 

[MMike]

He traveled to Pakistan in 1981 with an Indonesian passport. The real issue is his past in Indonesia as an Indonesian citizen with the name Barry Soetoro. He had to have given up his American citizenship to become an Indonesian.

Well there we go everyone. Proof positive.

Call in the KGB

 

[IH8Rice]

He traveled to Pakistan in 1981 with an Indonesian passport. The real issue is his past in Indonesia as an Indonesian citizen with the name Barry Soetoro. He had to have given up his American citizenship to become an Indonesian.

holy sh!t. put the meth pipe down and call Trump!! he needs to know this! no wonder his birth certificate is "missing or not there!"



Anderson Cooper had a good show last night about Hawaii's "Certificate of Live Birth." they even had someone born on the same day as Obama go and get his Certificate just to prove some things. Im glad Cooper actually called Trump out. finally someone with balls to.