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dan-o

Turbo Monkey
Jun 30, 2004
6,499
2,805
Yeah... you wouldn't think so, would you? I personally know of someone living 'round here that has been griping up a STORM about crowded conditions on the trails near their house... yet decided now would be a good time to fly to Hawaii with her daughter to visit her octogenarian parents. :rolleyes:

Oh... and her husband (he did not go) has pneumonia. :wtf:
Cruise prices will be too good to pass up this fall. Think of the savings!
 

Jozz

Joe Dalton
Apr 18, 2002
5,898
7,448
SADL
Oh come on, I'm actually an inbred redneck from florida

I can show you how to light farts and funnel a beer AT THE SAME TIME.

Don't penalize me for the infrastructure of my temporary home. I fucking hate the people in this state as much as everyone else :D
You sure know how to sell yourself! ;)
 

kidwoo

Artisanal Tweet Curator

Toshi

Harbinger of Doom
Oct 23, 2001
38,470
7,826
Via NYT

A doctor says he was removed from his federal post after pressing for rigorous vetting of treatments embraced by Trump.

At a briefing this month, President Trump stopped a reporter from asking a question about the use of the drug hydroxychloroquine to treat the coronavirus.

At a briefing this month, President Trump stopped a reporter from asking a question about the use of the drug hydroxychloroquine to treat the coronavirus.Credit...Joshua Roberts/Reuters

The doctor who led the federal agency involved in developing a coronavirus vaccine said on Wednesday that he was removed from his post after he pressed for a rigorous vetting of a coronavirus treatment embraced by President Trump. The doctor said that science, not “politics and cronyism” must lead the way.

Dr. Rick Bright was abruptly dismissed this week as the director of the Department of Health and Human Services’ Biomedical Advanced Research and Development Authority, or BARDA, and as the deputy assistant secretary for preparedness and response.

Instead, he was given a narrower job at the National Institutes of Health. “I believe this transfer was in response to my insistence that the government invest the billions of dollars allocated by Congress to address the Covid-19 pandemic into safe and scientifically vetted solutions, and not in drugs, vaccines and other technologies that lack scientific merit,” he said in a statement to The New York Times’s Maggie Haberman.

“I am speaking out because to combat this deadly virus, science — not politics or cronyism — has to lead the way,” he said.

The White House declined to comment. A spokeswoman for Alex Azar, the health and human services secretary, did not immediately respond to an email seeking comment. The medical publication Stat reported on Tuesday that Dr. Bright had clashed with Bob Kadlec, the assistant health secretary for preparedness and response.

Dr. Bright, who noted that his entire career had been spent in vaccine development both in and outside of government, has led BARDA since 2016.

In the statement, he said: “My professional background has prepared me for a moment like this — to confront and defeat a deadly virus that threatens Americans and people around the globe. To this point, I have led the government’s efforts to invest in the best science available to combat the Covid-19 pandemic.

“Unfortunately, this resulted in clashes with H.H.S. political leadership, including criticism for my proactive efforts to invest early into vaccines and supplies critical to saving American lives. I also resisted efforts to fund potentially dangerous drugs promoted by those with political connections,” he said.

Dr. Bright, who is a career official and not a political appointee, pointed specifically to the initial efforts to make chloroquine and hydroxychloroquine widely available before it was scientifically tested for efficacy with the coronavirus.

“Specifically, and contrary to misguided directives, I limited the broad use of chloroquine and hydroxychloroquine, promoted by the administration as a panacea, but which clearly lack scientific merit,” he said.

“While I am prepared to look at all options and to think ‘outside the box’ for effective treatments, I rightly resisted efforts to provide an unproven drug on demand to the American public,” Dr. Bright said, describing what ultimately happened: “I insisted that these drugs be provided only to hospitalized patients with confirmed Covid-19 while under the supervision of a physician.

“These drugs have potentially serious risks associated with them, including increased mortality observed in some recent studies in patients with Covid-19.

“Sidelining me in the middle of this pandemic and placing politics and cronyism ahead of science puts lives at risk and stunts national efforts to safely and effectively address this urgent public health crisis,” Dr. Bright said.

“I will request that the inspector general of the Department of Health and Human Services investigate the manner in which this administration has politicized the work of BARDA and has pressured me and other conscientious scientists to fund companies with political connections and efforts that lack scientific merit,” he said. “Rushing blindly towards unproven drugs can be disastrous and result in countless more deaths. Science, in service to the health and safety of the American people, must always trump politics.”

Dr. Bright has hired the lawyers Debra Katz and Lisa Banks, who have a whistle-blower practice and are known in part for representing Christine Blasey Ford, who, during the nomination process of Justice Brett Kavanaugh to the Supreme Court, accused him of engaging in sexual misconduct decades earlier, a claim he denied.

In a statement, the lawyers called Dr. Bright’s change in position “retaliation plain and simple,” and said that they planned to ask the Office of Special Counsel to seek a stay of his termination from the position and that he eventually be restored to it after investigations.
 

kazlx

Patches O'Houlihan
Aug 7, 2006
6,985
1,957
Tustin, CA
why do you say that?
Maybe @Toshi can explain better, but I don't understand how we are waiting for a vaccine, but it's just commonplace for a big chunk of the population to get the flu every year? It always seems like a crap shoot when you get a flu shot. I can see a vaccine helping for a percentage of people, but doesn't that mean it still won't be completely effective and the virus can still mutate and basically re-infect people.

I guess I'm confused how everyone accepts seasonal flu is just a thing you deal with on and off your whole life, yet we expect a treatment for this...I dunno.
 

Toshi

Harbinger of Doom
Oct 23, 2001
38,470
7,826
Maybe @Toshi can explain better, but I don't understand how we are waiting for a vaccine, but it's just commonplace for a big chunk of the population to get the flu every year? It always seems like a crap shoot when you get a flu shot. I can see a vaccine helping for a percentage of people, but doesn't that mean it still won't be completely effective and the virus can still mutate and basically re-infect people.

I guess I'm confused how everyone accepts seasonal flu is just a thing you deal with on and off your whole life, yet we expect a treatment for this...I dunno.
You're right, that effort may prove to be fruitless. The flu vaccine is said to halve the rate of flu per season, certainly not stamping it out, and one will note we have no vaccines for other coronaviruses (albeit possibly due to lack of a financial incentive).

But there are other vaccines, such as that against polio, that are very effective.
 

Pesqueeb

bicycle in airplane hangar
Feb 2, 2007
40,410
16,935
Riding the baggage carousel.

dan-o

Turbo Monkey
Jun 30, 2004
6,499
2,805
part of the real problem


Remember the 500 employee threshold? Apparently that's 1500 employees if you're an oil company.
That's one part of the problem.
Another part is giving money to people and small businesses that don't need it yet.

Why do people who haven't lost their income receive a covid check?
I can't think of a single reason.

Contrary to a previous post, my not taking gov't money has nothing to do with ego.
It's based on fact that other businesses need it more.
Same reason my wife voluntarily took a pay reduction (she is below mandatory reduction level) to preserve some of her staff's jobs.

The notion that the calls to ease restrictions are coming solely from the big, bad corporations belies the fact that 'small business' employs nearly 48% of the US workforce. These are the companies that are going to disappear, along with the 59m jobs they provide. Then the assholes will really hold the cards.



Maybe I missed it, but did they define 'social distancing'?
Is it what the women in the photo are doing (masks, small groups/separation) or lockdown?
 

jonKranked

Detective Dookie
Nov 10, 2005
86,146
24,665
media blackout
Maybe @Toshi can explain better, but I don't understand how we are waiting for a vaccine, but it's just commonplace for a big chunk of the population to get the flu every year? It always seems like a crap shoot when you get a flu shot. I can see a vaccine helping for a percentage of people, but doesn't that mean it still won't be completely effective and the virus can still mutate and basically re-infect people.

I guess I'm confused how everyone accepts seasonal flu is just a thing you deal with on and off your whole life, yet we expect a treatment for this...I dunno.
on any given year there's numerous strains/variants of influenza going around. covid-19 is a single viral strain, has a higher R0 (it spreads faster) and so far by all accounts seems more fatal.
 

Westy

the teste
Nov 22, 2002
54,542
20,343
Sleazattle
on any given year there's numerous strains/variants of influenza going around. covid-19 is a single viral strain, has a higher R0 (it spreads faster) and so far by all accounts seems more fatal.

Flu is a catch all term for a large family of viral strains. It is my understanding that the yearly flu shot is developed by analyzing world trends in attempt to predict what strains will become a problem, the shot then targets those strains. Strains mutate, become dormant and dormant strains pop back up. Sometimes some people do not generate sufficient antibodies for it to effective, but most failures of the vaccine are due to the fact that it simply wasn't intended to protect from the strain someone got infected with.
 

kazlx

Patches O'Houlihan
Aug 7, 2006
6,985
1,957
Tustin, CA
on any given year there's numerous strains/variants of influenza going around. covid-19 is a single viral strain, has a higher R0 (it spreads faster) and so far by all accounts seems more fatal.
I get that part, but there's also no guarantee they will create an effective vaccine in a timely (? not even sure what that would be) manner. I also don't want to sound all "but muh economy", but this really is going to continue to F over a lot of people, especially the longer it goes. Even people with vacation/sick and normal savings can't survive indefinitely without income. I work for a very tourist driven city and it's crazy to think how many people just around here are out of a 'good' job for at least a year, if not more, at this point. I'm curious at what point there is going to be concessions made. Even now, I feel like this is just the tip of the iceberg. I know there's always the hate for billionaires, the mega rich, etc, but as someone that interacts with businesses every day, that is definitely not the majority of businesses. There are people being crushed by this that just want to pay bills and live their lives like everyone else, except they are non-essential, or even if still open, are hurting. It sucks to see. $1200 from the government ain't gonna cut it. Especially in SoCal.
 
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kazlx

Patches O'Houlihan
Aug 7, 2006
6,985
1,957
Tustin, CA
Flu is a catch all term for a large family of viral strains. It is my understanding that the yearly flu shot is developed by analyzing world trends in attempt to predict what strains will become a problem, the shot then targets those strains. Strains mutate, become dormant and dormant strains pop back up. Sometimes some people do not generate sufficient antibodies for it to effective, but most failures of the vaccine are due to the fact that it simply wasn't intended to protect from the strain someone got infected with.
That's how I've always understood it.
 

dan-o

Turbo Monkey
Jun 30, 2004
6,499
2,805
I get that part, but there's also no guarantee they will create an effective vaccine in a timely (? not even sure what that would be) manner. I also don't want to sound all "but muh economy", but this really is going to continue to F over a lot of people, especially the longer it goes. Even people with vacation/sick and normal savings can't survive indefinitely without income. I work for a very tourist driven city and it's crazy to think how many people just around here are out of a 'good' job for at least a year, if not more, at this point. I'm curious at what point there is going to be concessions made. Even now, I feel like this is just the tip of the iceberg.
Wait until the cities go tits up from lack of taxes.
 

Pesqueeb

bicycle in airplane hangar
Feb 2, 2007
40,410
16,935
Riding the baggage carousel.
Why do people who haven't lost their income receive a covid check?
I can't think of a single reason.
I don't understand this either. Maybe give it to a person/family when they file their initial unemployment claim? Every one I work with has taken a pay hit, some by 50%. At least in CO, they can file a partial unemployment claim. Let the guys who became part time involuntarly have it. I don't need it. At least not yet, which is why it now sits in my savings account. Give that shit to all the little bars and restaurants and coffee shops that have been shuttered for 6 weeks. Fortune 500 companies can get fucked. And so can Trump's hotels.
 

kazlx

Patches O'Houlihan
Aug 7, 2006
6,985
1,957
Tustin, CA
Wait until the cities go tits up from lack of taxes.
Dude. It's already gonna get ugly here. Something like 60% of our city income is TOT tax, which is basically zero right now.

My buddy is a relatively successful wedding photographer. He is up shit creek even long term. The ripple effects for him are probably going to be easy a year or more.
 

kazlx

Patches O'Houlihan
Aug 7, 2006
6,985
1,957
Tustin, CA
I don't understand this either. Maybe give it to a person/family when they file their initial unemployment claim? Every one I work with has taken a pay hit, some by 50%. At least in CO, they can file a partial unemployment claim. Let the guys who became part time involuntarly have it. I don't need it. At least not yet, which is why it now sits in my savings account. Give that shit to all the little bars and restaurants and coffee shops that have been shuttered for 6 weeks. Fortune 500 companies can get fucked. And so can Trump's hotels.
Then you add in people that made too much that are out jobs that aren't getting anything. People want to think $100k is good money and anyone making that should have a ton packed away, but it doesn't get you much in SoCal.
 

Westy

the teste
Nov 22, 2002
54,542
20,343
Sleazattle
Dude. It's already gonna get ugly here. Something like 60% of our city income is TOT tax, which is basically zero right now.

My buddy is a relatively successful wedding photographer. He is up shit creek even long term. The ripple effects for him are probably going to be easy a year or more.

But look at the stock market!!!
 

eaterofdog

ass grabber
Sep 8, 2006
8,373
1,617
Central Florida
Why do people who haven't lost their income receive a covid check?
I can't think of a single reason.
Because they needed to get them out as quickly as possible. I got in just under the limit and don't need it at all. Am I giving it back? Hell no. Now the name of the game is to grab and stash as much as possible, before the economic crash really gets going. COV is only the beginning of the problem, it's tipping the whole house of cards over and all of those traditional investments will go poof. I'm planning to only get a fraction of my 401, but I've got other options. A whole bunch of people are going to get royally fucked.
 

Pesqueeb

bicycle in airplane hangar
Feb 2, 2007
40,410
16,935
Riding the baggage carousel.
Then you add in people that made too much that are out jobs that aren't getting anything. People want to think $100k is good money and anyone making that should have a ton packed away, but it doesn't get you much in SoCal.
I could do 100k easy at LAX with the location over rides and Cali OT rules and it would be an extreme standard of living reduction. Hard nope from me. I love LA, but I don't know how you guys do it there.
 

dan-o

Turbo Monkey
Jun 30, 2004
6,499
2,805

kidwoo

Artisanal Tweet Curator
Why do people who haven't lost their income receive a covid check?
I can't think of a single reason.
The reason is that asshole in the picture in the foreground of that link you quoted. You've seen the coverage of trump removing the oversight arm of the CARE act right? That's the reason. What you're looking at is more corruption than the fault of shutting down the economy. Like I said, they did one part while completely bailing on the second part that allows the first part to be reality.

And yes the Dorr Brothers started the rallies. That is literally a statement of fact. Percentage of small businesses in the country don't support the protests. Lack of the gov't giving the money to the people it was intended for provides support for the protests. Those are different things.

Truth be told, I'm in the same boat. I just got 1200 bucks and the last month and a half have been paid via sick leave, vacation I'd planned on taking right now anyway, and being able to do some work at home.

Pick your favorite business you want to support that I can buy or pay for something online and I'll spend it there (dead serious). I was going to buy some new bike shorts from my buddy's shop since all mine are 15 years old. Open to suggestions.

Business failing right now are the result of the half assed solution. They need to shake the other cheek. Returning to normal with a bunch of people scared to get sick, with some straight up dying is not going to support a recovering economy. You have to understand that. Testing, containment, and public safety have to come first, either now or 2 years from now........it has to happen eventually for anything even resembling a normally functioning economy. These morons in the federal gov't are just delaying the inevitable, while making people and businesses unneccssarily suffer in the meantime because they're breaking the promise they made.

Ego-driven or not, you should be upset that money is not being given to your sphere. Because they're printing that stuff off like crazy. They're just giving it to the wrong people.
 
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kidwoo

Artisanal Tweet Curator
Wait until the cities go tits up from lack of taxes.
One of these posts it will sink in




The fuckers literally printing and handing out money are picking sides. That's the reason you're seeing people in financial trouble. That's the only reason. They can fix it. They just won't. Because chaos allows stealing, and that's exactly what this corrupt ass government is doing. They are monetizing tragedy for themselves while playing on stupidity to distract you from it.
 
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dan-o

Turbo Monkey
Jun 30, 2004
6,499
2,805
The reason is that asshole in the picture in the foreground of that link you quoted. You've seen the coverage of trump removing the oversight arm of the CARE act right? That's the reason. What you're looking at is more corruption than the fault of shutting down the economy. Like I said, they did one part while completely bailing on the second part that allows the first part to be reality.

And yes the Dorr Brothers started the rallies. That is literally a statement of fact. Percentage of small businesses in the country don't support the protests. Lack of the gov't giving the money to the people it was intended for provides support for the protests. Those are different things.

Truth be told, I'm in the same boat. I just got 1200 bucks and the last month and a half have been paid via sick leave vacation I'd planned on taking right now anyway, and being able to do some work at home.

Pick your favorite business you want to support that I can buy or pay for something online and I'll spend it there (dead serious).

Business failing right now are the result of the half assed solution. They need to shake the other cheek. Returning to normal with a bunch of people scared to get sick, with some straight up dying is not going to support a recovering economy. You have to understand that. Testing, containment, and public safety have to come first, either now or 2 years from now........it has to happen eventually for anything even resembling a normally functioning economy. These morons in the federal gov't are just delaying the inevitable, while making people and businesses unneccssarily suffer in the meantime because they're breaking the promise they made.

What I'm hoping for isn't magic wand, pretend nothing happened re-opening.
DeBlasio was just on NPR talking about need to fire NYC back up ASAP.
The criteria being testing, tracking/containment and data showing it's reasonably safe to do so.
MA is hiring 1000 people specifically to track contacts of covid + people, to the same end.

This is the type of action/planning I want to see prioritized, not the appeasement money charade.
 

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jonKranked

Detective Dookie
Nov 10, 2005
86,146
24,665
media blackout
Flu is a catch all term for a large family of viral strains. It is my understanding that the yearly flu shot is developed by analyzing world trends in attempt to predict what strains will become a problem, the shot then targets those strains. Strains mutate, become dormant and dormant strains pop back up. Sometimes some people do not generate sufficient antibodies for it to effective, but most failures of the vaccine are due to the fact that it simply wasn't intended to protect from the strain someone got infected with.
my wife was watching a documentary and i caught a part which interviewed a team trying to develop a universal flu vaccine by sequencing the genome of all known influenza strains so they can identify (hopefully) a genetic portion shared by all variants and develop a vaccine which targets that common section. interesting for sure.
 

kidwoo

Artisanal Tweet Curator
What I'm hoping for isn't magic wand, pretend nothing happened re-opening.
DeBlasio was just on NPR talking about need to fire NYC back up ASAP.
The criteria being testing, tracking/containment and data showing it's reasonably safe to do so.
MA is hiring 1000 people specifically to track contacts of covid + people, to the same end.

This is the type of action/planning I want to see prioritized, not the appeasement money charade.
Yeah good luck with that particular magic wand.

States can't issue FDA approval for new testing techniques, nor can they adequately direct supply chains for the flac swabs that are STILL holding up testing. New York can't use the DPA to bump up manufacturing once some good serum test options are available at a potentially large scale.

That needs to happen but it won't on an effective scale. New York state has tested the biggest proportion of its population by far of any other state and they still haven't done jack shit in terms of actual population profiling of the spread.

You genuinely don't seem to know what the supply chain problems are at the moment with regards to testing materials. Sure it's a great idea. But there are very good reasons why we're not already there after states (like New York) have been working on it 24/7 for 6 weeks now.

You rely on gov't for testing, tracing and tracking, but scoff at relying on gov't for money.

Yes, that's your ego. All of the above need to be happening concurrently.
 
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jonKranked

Detective Dookie
Nov 10, 2005
86,146
24,665
media blackout
One of these posts it will sink in




The fuckers literally printing and handing out money are picking sides. That's the reason you're seeing people in financial trouble. That's the only reason. They can fix it. They just won't. Because chaos allows stealing, and that's exactly what this corrupt ass government is doing. They are monetizing tragedy for themselves while playing on stupidity to distract you from it.
these are also the same fuckwits that have been part of a decades long systemic dismantling of the kinds of social & financial safety nets that would gone a long way to mitigating the damage of this kind of catastrophe for the average american.
 

jonKranked

Detective Dookie
Nov 10, 2005
86,146
24,665
media blackout
You genuinely don't seem to know what the supply chain problems are at the moment with regards to testing materials. Sure it's a great idea. But there are very good reasons why we're not already there after states (like New York) working on it 24/7 for 6 weeks now.
the money printer goes brrr, not the supply chain.