Quantcast

BOOOOOO E-BIKES

Gary

my pronouns are hag/gis
Aug 27, 2002
8,469
6,355
UK
No. that's a massive fail IMO

Most Ebikes had their battery in a better place back when external batteries were the norm (2017-19 ish). Most were Alu. and lighter than current Emtbs too
 

sethimus

neu bizutch
Feb 5, 2006
5,308
2,405
not in Whistler anymore :/
BT? No. I don't think so. Tell me MOAR?
That's a great weight for a 630wh battery. But my point was designers fucked the weight distribution in the search of making Eebs "look" less Ebikey by fitting Loooong narrow batteries up inside downtubes.
Now Ebikes are accepted (by most). They really need to get away from that ridiculous idea and design compact batteries designed to sit with the bulk of the weight lower down and closer to the BB and not necessarily hidden away. (which BTW also created the heavier frames we see today).
 

Gary

my pronouns are hag/gis
Aug 27, 2002
8,469
6,355
UK
Cheers Seth. Had kinda forgotten BH was even a brand.
Kinda steeper H/A for an Enduro bike but not necessarily bad Geo for pingin' about on.
You ridden one?
 

Toshi

butthole powerwashing evangelist
Oct 23, 2001
39,544
8,625
my Pivot Shuttle has better battery weight distribution than most, as the pack is right where the downtube _would_ be.

downside is that swapping out the external-form-factor pack involves 12 T25 and 2 4 mm Allen bolts to remove the faux-bottom-of-downtube cover to which the battery is affixed.
 

Gary

my pronouns are hag/gis
Aug 27, 2002
8,469
6,355
UK
Yeah. I get the feeling the prohibitive factor might well be cost.
Mind you. Plenty folk seem absolutely fine with paying £10k for a 26kg mediocre spec carbon Emtb to mince around on
 

DaveW

Space Monkey
Jul 2, 2001
11,572
3,104
The bunker at parliament
*shrugs* TBH I haven't noticed any thing like a wieght distribution difference between my Orbea Wild and Orbea Rallon.
I suspect there is just a lot of overly anal retentiveness going around on the issue.
 

Gary

my pronouns are hag/gis
Aug 27, 2002
8,469
6,355
UK
That'll be firstly because your Orbea Wild is one of the lighter modern full power motor Emtbs and secondly because it doesn't have all that long an internal battery. and it's not shoved right up the downtube all the way to the headube.
I suspect you simply haven't ridden an Emtb with poor weight distribution. Try a Mondraker Level XR with the 750wh battery.
If that's not an option for you simply hang an extra kilo of lead around the very top of your Wild's downtube then try and bunny hop and manual the bike. I can't guarantee simulated *anal retention* but spend long enough trying to unweight the front and you probably will feel lower back fatigue.
 

DaveW

Space Monkey
Jul 2, 2001
11,572
3,104
The bunker at parliament
Hmmm I've riden a few mate (it goes with the teritory when you owned a bike shop up until a year ago.)
The Wild is NOT the lightweight orbea (perhaps you are thinking of the Rise? which I've also ridden extensively), the Wild has a 750wh battery that goes up the inside of the down tube it starts about 15cm forward of the cranks and goes 90% of the way to the steerer.
 

Gary

my pronouns are hag/gis
Aug 27, 2002
8,469
6,355
UK
I know it's not THE lightweight one but it's claimed weight is definitely one of the lighter 750wh full power motor longer travel Emtbs
 

sethimus

neu bizutch
Feb 5, 2006
5,308
2,405
not in Whistler anymore :/
Cheers Seth. Had kinda forgotten BH was even a brand.
Kinda steeper H/A for an Enduro bike but not necessarily bad Geo for pingin' about on.
You ridden one?
never seen one in rl, dunno if they even have distribution here

jusg interesting that there are now 2 spanish/basque companies that have custom batteries with way better kwh/kg than the big guns
 

sethimus

neu bizutch
Feb 5, 2006
5,308
2,405
not in Whistler anymore :/
That'll be firstly because your Orbea Wild is one of the lighter modern full power motor Emtbs and secondly because it doesn't have all that long an internal battery. and it's not shoved right up the downtube all the way to the headube.
I suspect you simply haven't ridden an Emtb with poor weight distribution. Try a Mondraker Level XR with the 750wh battery.
If that's not an option for you simply hang an extra kilo of lead around the very top of your Wild's downtube then try and bunny hop and manual the bike. I can't guarantee simulated *anal retention* but spend long enough trying to unweight the front and you probably will feel lower back fatigue.
one of last gen norcos with the 900wh battery is even worse
 

Gary

my pronouns are hag/gis
Aug 27, 2002
8,469
6,355
UK
one of last gen norcos with the 900wh battery is even worse
We had a batch of those to sell when they first became available in the UK. Sold quickly. But when PDI'd. Not ONE battery worked. Customers refunded and bikes sent back. Dodged a bullet really. Horrendous weight. and terrible battery insertion system.
Let's hope brands using the 21700 cell batteries get it right. YT was first brand I noticed with custom batteries for the Shimano motor and those had many issues too.

It's interesting how some folk just don't notice bad weight distribution. Especially if it's someone with a lot of experience.
 

SylentK

Turbo Monkey
Feb 25, 2004
2,633
1,083
coloRADo
I think that's Boromir. :nerd:
Nah, he wouldn't wear a jacket.

And you just totally went there.. Lord of the Rings bro. HA.

Maybe we should Lord of The Rings Colorado? Hmmm sounds like a challenge. ?

I'm totally fine not riding a horse or running from awesome places. Orcs blah. I have an elvish blade. We can shuttle. :D
 
Last edited:

SylentK

Turbo Monkey
Feb 25, 2004
2,633
1,083
coloRADo
Well for that weight, 105Nm, and 800mwh at that weight? Call me impressed. Take my money nao!

Compared to my Trek Fuel exe, the TQ motor is 50nm at 350mwh. Yeah. I do love how quiet the TQ is. But could use moar Nm.
 

Lelandjt

adorbs
Apr 4, 2008
2,636
997
Breckenridge, CO/Lahaina,HI
I don't get the disconnect between the ebike industry that seems to greatly favor powerful ebikes vs ebike access advocates who play the "these just help people with less mobility to ride in the same way as young people who have the time to maintain fitness."
If ebikes really just made up the power difference between a Dad bod and a pro rider, while weighing 10lbs more than a normal bike, I'd say, "Sure, they should be allowed on non-motorized trails"' but that's not the case. The vast majority of people making and buying ebikes clearly want a lightweight dirtbike that uses the pedals as the throttle so they can be used on non-motorized trails.
Once the hikers who hate dirtbikes more than life itself figure out what's going on the access argument is gonna get more difficult.
 
Last edited:

sethimus

neu bizutch
Feb 5, 2006
5,308
2,405
not in Whistler anymore :/
I don't get the disconnect between the ebike industry that seems to greatly favor powerful ebikes vs ebike access advocates who play the "these just help people with less mobility to ride in the same way as young people who have the time to maintain fitness."
If ebikes really just made up the power difference between a Dad bod and a pro rider, while weighing 10lbs more than a normal bike, I'd say, "Sure, they should be allowed on non-motorized trails"' but that's not the case. The vast majority of people making and buying ebikes clearly want a lightweight dirtbike that uses the pedals as the throttle so they can be used on non-motorized trails.
Once the hikers who hate dirtbikes more than life itself figure out what's going on the access argument is gonna get more difficult.
this argument is already settled, in europe. you and your 3 categories brought this on all on yourselfs. way more unused land nobody should give a shit about yet less freedum, sad.

i‘m in finale ligure atm, there are at least as many ebikes as not ebikes around. nobody cares. get over it
 

toodles

ridiculously corgi proportioned
Aug 24, 2004
5,814
5,191
Australia
FWIW, my mate has one of the Kenevo SL bikes (not the brand new one). Two rad things - one it can run solely on range extenders without the main battery (and two range extenders can be taken as carry on for flights) - giving it a viable option to be used for flying with without have to source a hire battery or ship a battery across ahead of time.

The other cool thing is the new upgraded Speshy drive unit is retrofittable apparently so he can buy that and bump his torque and peak power up like 30%.

I travel quite a bit for riding and the inability to fly with an Eeb always concerned me a bit (hiring a battery seems to be a pain in the ass, at least in Oz). The option to run the range extenders is nice (although they drop the power mode to Eco automatically @ 10% which sucks).

This is probably all old news to experienced Eeb people but nice to know.
 

Toshi

butthole powerwashing evangelist
Oct 23, 2001
39,544
8,625
good to know.

I contemplated shipping one of my two batteries to Seattle--would probably need to go through a hazmat shipping broker and it's not cheap at all... then I could ship my Shuttle normally.

but then I decided to not. :D
 

sethimus

neu bizutch
Feb 5, 2006
5,308
2,405
not in Whistler anymore :/
The other cool thing is the new upgraded Speshy drive unit is retrofittable apparently so he can buy that and bump his torque and peak power up like 30%.
possible but they won‘t sell you the motor and tcu if you don‘t have the one with the display. the only way so far is buying the levo sl kids and swap the parts
 

toodles

ridiculously corgi proportioned
Aug 24, 2004
5,814
5,191
Australia
possible but they won‘t sell you the motor and tcu if you don‘t have the one with the display. the only way so far is buying the levo sl kids and swap the parts
Weird, our local Speshy shop has offered to hook up my mate if he wants the upgrade but maybe that's a bro deal or something.

Wonder if warranty replacements would be the new motor or the OG one.
 

Toshi

butthole powerwashing evangelist
Oct 23, 2001
39,544
8,625
I have a small desire to update my 2018 E8000 Pivot Shuttle to EP8, since mounting points are all the same and all

but not nearly enough to buy pieces and swap them out
 

Gary

my pronouns are hag/gis
Aug 27, 2002
8,469
6,355
UK
I have a small desire to update my 2018 E8000 Pivot Shuttle to EP8, since mounting points are all the same and all

but not nearly enough to buy pieces and swap them out
You'd also need to swap all wiring. Which is a PITA and kinda pricy.
I rode the latest EP8 with the race tune at the weekend.
I still prefer the old E8000 as it gives a far more natural feeling assistance in Trail and a much more subtle over run. Range and torque aren't actually all that much less
 

Toshi

butthole powerwashing evangelist
Oct 23, 2001
39,544
8,625
good to know. I do like the natural feeling in Trail, 'tis true. I'm in Trail 95% of the time probably, maybe even more.
 

Toshi

butthole powerwashing evangelist
Oct 23, 2001
39,544
8,625
Is that the new DJI (?) motor thingy everyone raving about?
It does look like an impressive setup

 

rideit

Bob the Builder
Aug 24, 2004
24,495
12,329
In the cleavage of the Tetons
Ok, I came up with an idea for a mod. If I could rig up a small pressure pad under the saddle, that immediately switched your assist (heh) from walk-mode to Trail or Trail+, that would be super duper neato.
We have all hopped back on, ready to give ‘er the beans on some steep slope, and the bike is still in walk or 0 assist.

Anyone with me on this?

“This bike is ASS-isted!”